Move project to origin point

[Anonymous]

I am having issues with my template for few months and I can't find the cause of the problem.

I am coming from the thread below

https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/revit-architecture-forum/template-corrupted-with-graphic-issues/td-p/...

Today, I have learn that apart of the project base point, and survey point, the revit files have also a origin point hidden. I thought that the 20km rule was between the model and the project base point, but apparently it is between the origin point of the revit file, and the model (I don't know if it is different rule, I had just misunderstood the rule at the beginning).

I have seen the issue with the hatch contour is resolved once you move the hatch close to the origin point (It was already in the project base point, but the project base point was like 12km away of the origin point), so in order to make another test and see if that is the cause of all the problems in the template, I want to move the whole project, model, details, everything, close to the origin.

Does anybody know how to do it? how to move a model close the origin point??

Regards

[Ilic.Andrej]

I would suggest to unclip Project Base Point, then right click it and "Move to Startup Location".... See if it moves....

[Anonymous]

Thanks for your answer, but unfortunately it move just the project base point, not the whole model

[Ilic.Andrej]

Yeah, but you discovered the hidden origin. Can you please tell what is the altitude of your site (in real World)?

[Anonymous]

The elevation is 57m

[Ilic.Andrej]

Ok, good.

Now, I will tell you how I manage points so that I don't get in this situation. I don't know whether this is the "right" way to do it, cause I searched all over the internet and didn't find one.

First, I set all points to match the hidden origin. Ideally, your template file should have this set. Then, I just move the unclipped Project Base Point and all levels to their Real World elevation. Why? Because, people rarely design buildings stationed over 3200m altitude. This means that the Pr Base Point will stay within the acceptable range from the hidden origin. I never move the Survey Point. I keep it at the origin.

Revit made all this very confusing. This is why I suggest to match all points with the hidden origin. To do this, unclip Project Base Point and move it there. Link a DWG file with three 3D lines that intersect at 0,0,0. This will help you snap the Survey Point to the origin.

If the points are matched, your toposurface should be moved accordingly. Then, you can move all levels to their altitudes (which will move the model). when you finish everything, set the elevation of the unclipped Project Base Point to match the elevation of the ground level.

(edited)

One more thing I forgot to mention. You can duplicate the project. When setting up points, topography and levels, delete the building (everything). This will make it easier to manipulate elevations. Once you set levels, open the past project. Select the building model and copy it to clipboard. Open the ground level on your new project, and paste it there.

[barthbradley]

Read what @RDAOU wrote here: 

https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/revit-architecture-forum/revit-coordinate-system-and-project-site-set...

[ToanDN]

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@Anonymous wrote:

Today, I have learn that apart of the project base point, and survey point, the revit files have also a origin point hidden. I thought that the 20km rule was between the model and the project base point, but apparently it is between the origin point of the revit file, and the model (I don't know if it is different rule, I had just misunderstood the rule at the beginning).

Does anybody know how to do it? how to move a model close the origin point??

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There are no easy ways to physically move the model closer to the Origin Point without some headaches.  How far is your project?  Design?  Documentation?

And No, you cannot just do it by relocating the Project Base Point once it is more than 9144 m from the Origin point.

This lead to a question for Autodesk that why the Model Origin Point isn't made visible?  It is a very important coordinate element that often mistaken by users that it is the same as the Survey Point.

[barthbradley]

You can move the Revit Project "WCS" Origin and later find it by Linking a CAD Origin to Origin.  

[ToanDN]

You can move the Project Base Point (UCS) and Survey Point (also another UCS), not Origin Point (WCS).

[barthbradley]

I disagree. Try this test:

1. Drag the PBP to a new location (do not unclip). Call this new location "A".

2. Unclip and drag the PBP back to 0,0,0. 

3. Link in a CAD drawing -- Origin to Origin. The CAD drawing's 0,0,0 origin lands on #1's "A" location.  

[ToanDN]

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@Anonymous wrote:

I disagree. Try this test:

1. Drag the PBP to a new location (do not unclip). Call this new location "A".

2. Unclip and drag the PBP back to 0,0,0. 

3. Link in a CAD drawing -- Origin to Origin. The CAD drawing's 0,0,0 origin lands on #1's "A" location.  

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All the 0,0,0 you said are referenced to the Survey Point, not the Origin Point.  The Origin Point does not move.

[barthbradley]

Not following you @ToanDN.  There is no correlation to the SP either.  You will get the same results if you move both the PBP and the SP.  Try it.  Is this not relocating the Project Origin? 

[ToanDN]

See below how the coordinates of the PBP changed when the SP moved.

[barthbradley]

@ToanDN: I well aware of the relationships between the PBP and SP. I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about the Project WCS Origin; the point you can't see in the view. That WCS point is not always located at the 0,0,0 of the PBP/SP, like it is when you first open a new template.  You can easily replicate a scenario where this is true, if you follow the 3 steps I posted above.  

[ToanDN]

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@Anonymous wrote:

@ToanDN: I well aware of the relationships between the PBP and SP. I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about the Project WCS Origin; the point you can't see in the view. That WCS point is not always located at the 0,0,0 of the PBP/SP, like it is when you first open a new template.  You can easily replicate a scenario where this is true, if you follow the 3 steps I posted above.  

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All you did is panning the Origin Point off center, not moving it.  You cannot move the Origin, same as you cannot move the WCS in AutoCAD, you are just panning it.

[barthbradley]

@ToanDN: I think we're on two different wavelengths here. You calling it "panning"; I call it "moving". Fundamentally, the WCS point (a.k.a. the point that the Link recognizes as the "Origin") is in a different location than it's default location -- which is at the Project Base Point's 0,0,0 location when you begin a new Project. 

[ToanDN]

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@Anonymous wrote:

@ToanDN: I think we're on two different wavelengths here. You calling it "panning"; I call it "moving". Fundamentally, the WCS point (a.k.a. the point that the Link recognizes as the "Origin") is in a different location than it's default location -- which is at the Project Base Point's 0,0,0 location when you begin a new Project. 

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The AutoCAD WCS point is in the same location which is the Revit Origin Point.  That is the Project Base Point moved away from it.  (No, clip it + move it away and then unclip it + move it back does not cancel each other out.)

[barthbradley]

@ToanDN: So, you are in agreement with me; or no?  

[ToanDN]

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@Anonymous wrote:

@ToanDN: So, you are in agreement with me; or no?  

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Sure I agree that we cannot move the Revit Origin Point as well as the AutoCAD WCS 0,0,0.  Why shouldn't I?