Why Pipe Connector Tolerance affects fittings with connections that have the instance parameter unchecked?

[Caed9]

The issue is concerning a concrete inspection chamber for the sanitary pipes, and it is under the Pipe Fitting Category, as it is basically a fitting (not equipment, nor a fixture).  This kind of sanitary construction element can receive pipes at any given reasonable angle, so all its connectors have the "check box" instance parameter "allow slope adjustements" checked, and avoid any kind of elbows or transition fittings.  In  order to flex the family I set the Pipe Connector Tolerance to 45  or 50(in extreme cases there are some crazy angles). Everything works more or less fine, but it works with all the wonky adjustments. 

The "out of the box" pipe fittings all have the "Allows slope adjustements" parameter unchecked, so they are not supposed to be affected (I supposed Wrong, we  can never be happy with revit). 

Revit throws an error when creating regular pipes and it's not allowing the angles under the Connector Tolerance setup Angle, despite the fact that those pipe fittings are not supposed to be affected since it's connectors do not have the checkmark. 

So, Lets just go straight to the point, in this situations the only way is it to change the tolerance angle back and forth like crazy? is there any other method besides that?

On the image below I get the desired Angle with the Concrete fitting Family and  50 degrees as Connector Tolerance.

 

On the image below I try to create an elbow with normal piping at a 45 degree angle and it throws an error. All routing solutions are setup with the Revit "Out of the box"  DWV Pipe fitting libraries.

 

[iainsavage]

I don't think "allow slope adjustments" and connector tolerance angle are the same thing.

The latter determines the angle which can exist between pipes before Revit decides to insert a bend/elbow (5 degree minimum).

[Caed9]

I see, its kind of confusing. Well I'll just go back and forth changing the conector tolerance then.

[iainsavage]

Can you not include a sweep in your chamber family for each connector and apply angle parameters to them so that the sweeps can be rotated to match the pipe angle and the connectors will then align to the pipes?

PS: I think your chamber should maybe be a pipe accessory rather than a fitting.

[Caed9]

I didn't know there was an accessory category, I was looking for one that best fits an Inspection Chamber Family.

I was trying to avoid angles on custom fittings, they are a bit intimidating. I still don't get how that works, the fitting angles and how they flex with the pipe direction. My brain can't comprehend it yet, I'm just sticking with the "out of the box" fittting Families.  

I'll try to set up the angle parameters inside the Inspection Chamber Family. I was concerned that the angles will go crazy and start acting like a Tee or an elbow. I can control those angles strictly from the properties palette too.  I guess once the category is changed It will no act crazy like fittings. 

Thank you very much for the advice, I really appreciate it! 

[iainsavage]

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@Caed9  schrieb:

I'm just sticking with the "out of the box" fittting Families.  

So is the concrete chamber one that you found in the Autodesk library?

Can you upload it or point to where it is in the library so that I can take a look inside the family?

[Caed9]

I created that one under pipe fitting category, cause I could not find any in the default libraries, I guess I was looking in the wrong folder. Its just a hollow square extrusion with the conections placed according to the piping system on the real project. I was going to create another same family in case there is a drastical configuration difference, but with the parametric angles you recommended I might just create one family and just reuse it as I'll get any Angle I want. I have to switch the category of the family too, that changes everything. 

[iainsavage]

Okay, it was your "out of the box" description which confused me - that usually refers to Autodesk library content.

[RobDraw]

Have you checked with manufacturers to see if they have families? How about other sources? There is a ton of content out there. You might not get exactly what you want but modifying something that already exists might be easier than creating it from scratch. I've learned a lot about families by reverse engineering other peoples work.

[Caed9]

I found some but the families are not that flexible, hehe, Also I have to keep in mind those families have their own v-lookup tables which I Honestly still don't understand how that works inside formulas yet.  Where I'm having strong doubts is with the category, I found a family online and the category is fitting and then in this post I was recommended to use Accesory instead. I found another family online and the category is Generic.

Accesories are Valves and concrete inspection chambers do not have valves (that I know of), it seems a little odd to be accesory if its made up of concrete. It acts more like a fitting, like a concrete fitting basically, with the only difference that it is not supposed to rotate in crazy angles like fittings do.

[iainsavage]

It depends on how you want the item to perform in a pipe system in terms of flows, pressure drop, etc.

Also how you would describe them in a schedule, bill of quantities, bill of materials etc.

I would normally consider bends, tees, offsets, wyes, transitions, caps etc as fittings and other items as accessories.

Valves are accessories but accessories are not exclusively valves.

In your case it maybe doesn't make much difference whether you make it a fitting or an accessory, as long as you have the part type set correctly. Depending on the quantity of inlets you'd need to set it as an elbow, a tee, a wye, a cross, a multi-port etc.

Generic Models will connect to pipes but have no hydraulic qualities at all: