Rotate & Copy Doubles Rotation Angle

[rmarkowitz]

When I rotate an item in Revit using the rotate command and I want to make a copy, the new instance of the item appears 2x the angle that I entered. If I want to rotate and make a copy of something at 45°, I must type in 22.5 as the rotation angle.

Is anyone else having this problem? It's not the worst problem in the world but is sure is annoying...

Thanks!

[ToanDN]

It works properly here. No 100% tax added.

[barthbradley]

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@rmarkowitz wrote:

If I want to rotate and make a copy of something at 45°, I must type in 22.5 as the rotation angle.

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Could you elaborate please?  Perhaps, provide us with a step-by-step workflow to replicate?  

[rmarkowitz]

Absolutely...

I take a face-based generic model and place it on a ref. plane. Then I select the model and click "Rotate" and check "Copy". If I then type in 45° as the angle, the replicated model will appear 90° from the original.

If "Copy" is not checked, the function performs as expected.

Does that help?

Thank you!

[Anonymous]

You added 45deg in the Toolbar window and also selected 45deg in the temporary dimension.  Do one or the other.

I usually leave the angle in the toolbar empty and modify the temporary dimension.

[rmarkowitz]

Can you explain?

This also happens if I don't type, rather just click. Ie. if I were to "Rotate" and "Copy", and then select 45°, the fixture will show up at 90. The angle box in the toolbar is empty.

[Anonymous]

That was the only explanation that I could think of on how it could add the same amount to double your angle.

Since we cannot look over your shoulder to see what you are doing, create a screencast instead.  When I rotate/copy something 45 or whatever it is the correct degrees.

[koert.vynckier]

It looks like a bug to me.

To replicate the issue start a new project from an empty Metric Template and place a component.

Load one because there are none present in the project.

Take M_TV - Flat Screen from C:\ProgramData\Autodesk\RVT 2019\US Metric\Furniture if that's installed in the default location.

Place the TV, add a line so you can select the endpoint as the origin for the Rotate with Copy.

Rotate the TV and Line 22.5° and you should get a result like in Capture.png

Edit the Family and change to Workplane-based Component like in Capture2.png and load into project.

Now do the Rotate with Copy option again, select the line and component and rotate with copy over 22.5°. The Component wil turn 22.5° but it will be located at the point where it would have ended up if you had rotated the line 45°. Result as in Capture3.png.

The Array (circular) command does not appear to be affected by the issue. No need for work-arounds like not using Workplane-based components or not using rotate with copy option but first copying and then rotating. Checking if this is still the case in Revit 2020 would be helpful.

I'm just making clear what the issue is.

[ToanDN]

I still can't replicate the issue using the US metric project template and a work-plane family.

[ToanDN]

After further testing I can replicate the issue as you described.

[SteveKStafford]

What did you do to replicate it? I only get weird behavior if a floor is present...the family gets hosted by the floor if so. I don't have access to the metric family and I'm using the DefaultMetric template.

Edit: The metric family misbehaves as described, the imperial one does not (for me). It does it in 2020.2 as well. If I uncheck the Always Vertical setting in the metric version is rotated properly, I had a floor in my model. Furniture gets hosted by a floor element if one is present by default.

[ToanDN]

I tested with the Imperial template. But I need to revise my statement: The rotation angle does not double, but the center of rotation isn't where I placed it so the location of the copy is not where I expected it to be.

https://knowledge.autodesk.com/community/screencast/f758d361-7a86-4e78-a0e0-87f99dddf6e5

[koert.vynckier]

So it's either twice the angle that's applied or the centre of rotation is two times as far away as you'd expect it to be.

To replicate the problem you need to place the component workplane based since no floors are present in the empty file you started from.

If I uncheck "Always vertical" in the Family and try again, the component is simply rotated over two times the angle but with the correct center of rotation this time.

Still, clearly a pretty bugged command and not a feature. I hope they fix it.

[koert.vynckier]

So with the instructions above you can all replicate the unexpected behavior with Workplane-based components. The behavior is different depending on whether Always Vertical is checked in the Family, or not.

[SteveKStafford]

The imperial version of the family didn't misbehave for me while the metric one did...not sure what that means but suggests it isn't the Rotate/Copy process but something about the family itself.

[rmarkowitz]

Thanks all for following up on this - sorry I haven't gotten to screencap it but I'm glad to know this is a pervasive issue. Hopefully someone @Anonymous can look into it...

[koert.vynckier]

I can reproduce the exact same behavior with the Imperial component in an empty Metric File.

New Project, Template <none>, Metric. etc.

So it's not just some faulty component.

Try again, start from scratch Metric

place Imperial TV

draw the line

rotate with copy of line and TV.

Edit Family, make Workplane based, load into project, overwrite.

Rotate with copy of the original line and TV, see the difference.

Edit Family, uncheck Always Vertical and load into project, overwrite

Rotate with copy again of the original line and TV, and observe the difference again.

Did it in empty Imperial Template (New project, Template <none>, Imperial etc.

and got the exact same result. Things may be set differently in whatever Template you chose to start from, but if you start from scratch, you should be able to reproduce the bug.

Make sure you don't have the Edited Family open when you try to reproduce this in a different project because Edit Family will take you to the open Family which you may have already changed and could cause confusion.

[SteveKStafford]

 Okay...weird. I just tried this again in the imperial architectural template using both the imperial and metric TV families. You'll see in the screencast both families rotated as I'd expect them to as is OOTB.

[koert.vynckier]

Your screencast does not follow the steps of my previous post and thus does not demonstrate the problem with Workplane-based components. All it does is show that non-Workplane-based components do not have the problem, which should have been obvious if you had fully read my previous post(s). The TV is indeed not Workplane-based OOTB.

Just follow the steps all the way through. You're not editing the family, you're not making it workplane-based, you're not loading it back into the project. You're not rotating with copy the now Workplane-based TV, you're just stuck in part 1 of the steps and apparently totally oblivious to part 2 and 3 that demonstrate the issue of the OP.

[koert.vynckier]

If you need more help in understanding the OP issue, please take a look at ToanDN's screencast. He understood perfectly that the issue only affects Workplane-based families. The fact that a Family is not Workplane-based OOTB should really not stop you from reproducing the bugs in the Rotate-command, with copy option (unless you don't want to).

• Not Workplane-based Family: no bug, demonstrates the desired behavior.
• Workplane-based and Always Vertical: rotates the component over 1 time the angle, but its origin point is where it would end up if you had rotated the original non-Workplane-based version over 2 times the angle.
• Workplane-based and NOT Always Vertical: the component is rotated over 2 times the requested angle, as the OP stated. This has already been verified by ToanDN in Revit 2020.