Demolition - Wall infill not wanted

[Anonymous]

Afternoon!

When I demo a door, automatically Revit puts in wall infill. Is there a way to turn the wall infill off so it just shows the opening that's left after the door is gone?

Also, when I draw a wall opening in an existing wall, it doesn't show as being demo'd in plan. Is there a setting I can change?

Any input is appreciated.

[Anonymous]

Afternoon!

When I demo a door, automatically Revit puts in wall infill. Is there a way to turn the wall infill off so it just shows the opening that's left after the door is gone?

Also, when I draw a wall opening in an existing wall, it doesn't show as being demo'd in plan. Is there a setting I can change?

Any input is appreciated.

[Anonymous]

Anne,

1. No there is no way to turn this off. Are you going to place something into the opening later? Why would you not want this demoed area to be visible for a demolition plan?

2. You cannot use the opening tool to get demoed behavior. We have created a generic object that has a void in it set to cut the wall. This will produce the correct behavior. The opening tool is not a true object per say. therefore, it cannot be used in a phase different than the wall you are putting it in.

[Anonymous]

Anne,

1. No there is no way to turn this off. Are you going to place something into the opening later? Why would you not want this demoed area to be visible for a demolition plan?

2. You cannot use the opening tool to get demoed behavior. We have created a generic object that has a void in it set to cut the wall. This will produce the correct behavior. The opening tool is not a true object per say. therefore, it cannot be used in a phase different than the wall you are putting it in.

[Anonymous]

1. An example would better explain it. Please see the 'doordemo' attachment. I want to show the door and the door jambs/wall as being demo'd so it opens up into a hallway to access the stairs. I don't need the wall infill. How would you get this scenerio to show up correct on both the demo and new plans?

2. Good to know. Thanks!

[Anonymous]

1. An example would better explain it. Please see the 'doordemo' attachment. I want to show the door and the door jambs/wall as being demo'd so it opens up into a hallway to access the stairs. I don't need the wall infill. How would you get this scenerio to show up correct on both the demo and new plans?

2. Good to know. Thanks!

[Anonymous · Accepted solution]

Even though technically you are only removing the door leaf (and hardware), to Revit you are demolishing the door and installing a new one. You'll want to create a new door family with just the jambs, head, & trim. Demo the original door, then place your new door "opening" in the same place. This will now cut the infill wall. There are some minor problems with the wall/infill being cut if the old and new doors are the same size and in the same place. Revit sometimes doesn't know which is the new door's host, but they can usually be solved by nudging the new door, first one way, then back the same distance. I use the arrow keys to accomplish this, but you can also use the Move function, say 1/8".

The advantage of this method is that the door shows correctly in existing, demo, and new phases.

This method works for window replacement too.

[Anonymous · Accepted solution]

Even though technically you are only removing the door leaf (and hardware), to Revit you are demolishing the door and installing a new one. You'll want to create a new door family with just the jambs, head, & trim. Demo the original door, then place your new door "opening" in the same place. This will now cut the infill wall. There are some minor problems with the wall/infill being cut if the old and new doors are the same size and in the same place. Revit sometimes doesn't know which is the new door's host, but they can usually be solved by nudging the new door, first one way, then back the same distance. I use the arrow keys to accomplish this, but you can also use the Move function, say 1/8".

The advantage of this method is that the door shows correctly in existing, demo, and new phases.

This method works for window replacement too.

[Anonymous · Accepted solution]

wrote in message news:5829819@discussion.autodesk.com...
Afternoon!

When I demo a door, automatically Revit puts in wall infill. Is there a way
to turn the wall infill off so it just shows the opening that's left after
the door is gone?

Also, when I draw a wall opening in an existing wall, it doesn't show as
being demo'd in plan. Is there a setting I can change?

Any input is appreciated.


Anne,

After placing the door in the existing wall you can hover over the infill
lines drawn across the opening and tab until you can "right click" the small
infill section - not the door. You can then, "Override Graphics In View",
"By Element", uncheck "Visible", and click "OK". This will make the infill
go away.

The second issue is an issue of phasing. Make sure that the wall is assigned
the "existing" phase prior to inserting the wall opening. You'll then be
able to right click the opening and assign an infill style to the opening
that meets your needs.

-Mark

[Anonymous · Accepted solution]

wrote in message news:5829819@discussion.autodesk.com...
Afternoon!

When I demo a door, automatically Revit puts in wall infill. Is there a way
to turn the wall infill off so it just shows the opening that's left after
the door is gone?

Also, when I draw a wall opening in an existing wall, it doesn't show as
being demo'd in plan. Is there a setting I can change?

Any input is appreciated.


Anne,

After placing the door in the existing wall you can hover over the infill
lines drawn across the opening and tab until you can "right click" the small
infill section - not the door. You can then, "Override Graphics In View",
"By Element", uncheck "Visible", and click "OK". This will make the infill
go away.

The second issue is an issue of phasing. Make sure that the wall is assigned
the "existing" phase prior to inserting the wall opening. You'll then be
able to right click the opening and assign an infill style to the opening
that meets your needs.

-Mark

[Anonymous · Accepted solution]

1. If you reallllly want to do this: First split the wall at the door on
both sides in plan view using the split command. Then go to 3d view and demo
this wall segment. This shows correct in plan views. However, in 3d views
and for estimating, etc this may not be correct.
So you can split the wall again in 3d view just above the door and select
the lower part of the wall and go to its properties and change the
Unconnected height parameter to be .01" more than that of the height of the
door. (theoritically it should be equal to that of the door height but Revit
does not like it...)
HTH
nicholas iyadurai


wrote in message news:5830308@discussion.autodesk.com...
1. An example would better explain it. Please see the 'doordemo'
attachment. I want to show the door and the door jambs/wall as being demo'd
so it opens up into a hallway to access the stairs. I don't need the wall
infill How would you get this scenerio to show up correct on both the demo
and new plans?

2. Good to know. Thanks!

[Anonymous · Accepted solution]

1. If you reallllly want to do this: First split the wall at the door on
both sides in plan view using the split command. Then go to 3d view and demo
this wall segment. This shows correct in plan views. However, in 3d views
and for estimating, etc this may not be correct.
So you can split the wall again in 3d view just above the door and select
the lower part of the wall and go to its properties and change the
Unconnected height parameter to be .01" more than that of the height of the
door. (theoritically it should be equal to that of the door height but Revit
does not like it...)
HTH
nicholas iyadurai


wrote in message news:5830308@discussion.autodesk.com...
1. An example would better explain it. Please see the 'doordemo'
attachment. I want to show the door and the door jambs/wall as being demo'd
so it opens up into a hallway to access the stairs. I don't need the wall
infill How would you get this scenerio to show up correct on both the demo
and new plans?

2. Good to know. Thanks!

[Anonymous]

Great advice all! I'll try these things out.

Thanks!
Anne

[Anonymous]

Great advice all! I'll try these things out.

Thanks!
Anne

[Anonymous]

This is a confusing topic. I'm finding that when I demolish a door (in a demolition phase) Revit will infill the existing wall with a visibly different fill (that looks like 'new construction'), BUT it only shows that way in the demolition phase. It then deceivingly looks like existing wall in 'new construction' view. As someone mentioned before, you can select this infill, BUT you can't change it's properties... I don't want to show 'new construction' on my Demolition drawing, if I'm going to infill an opening I would like to show that work on my Construction drawing.

SO, in other words, if i have an existing door in an existing wall and i want to demolish the door, i would like to show the door demolished on the Demolition plan (demo phase) and then show the opening infilled with new wall on the construction plan (new construction phase) - but Revit's infill gets in the way of doing that.

This is very standard drawing practice - am i missing something?

[Anonymous]

This is a confusing topic. I'm finding that when I demolish a door (in a demolition phase) Revit will infill the existing wall with a visibly different fill (that looks like 'new construction'), BUT it only shows that way in the demolition phase. It then deceivingly looks like existing wall in 'new construction' view. As someone mentioned before, you can select this infill, BUT you can't change it's properties... I don't want to show 'new construction' on my Demolition drawing, if I'm going to infill an opening I would like to show that work on my Construction drawing.

SO, in other words, if i have an existing door in an existing wall and i want to demolish the door, i would like to show the door demolished on the Demolition plan (demo phase) and then show the opening infilled with new wall on the construction plan (new construction phase) - but Revit's infill gets in the way of doing that.

This is very standard drawing practice - am i missing something?

[Anonymous]

The infill piece cannot have its phase per say changed, but you can sometimes change its type, but you can certainly change its workset. Then you can use a filter on the view to get existing walls to not show their surface patterns, but the infills, on a different workset will show the surface patterns for elevations.

Scott Womack

[Anonymous]

The infill piece cannot have its phase per say changed, but you can sometimes change its type, but you can certainly change its workset. Then you can use a filter on the view to get existing walls to not show their surface patterns, but the infills, on a different workset will show the surface patterns for elevations.

Scott Womack

[Anonymous]

thank you. that's a very good tip. in looking at this problem i'm also now suspecting that we are not managing our phases correctly. we have multiple demolition phases (in the project) and each have separate phases in the model - thus no demolition is 'phased' as happening during 'new construction. the final demo phase should be indicated as part of 'new construction', right? it hasn't caused us any other problems so far, except for the infill issues...

[Anonymous]

thank you. that's a very good tip. in looking at this problem i'm also now suspecting that we are not managing our phases correctly. we have multiple demolition phases (in the project) and each have separate phases in the model - thus no demolition is 'phased' as happening during 'new construction. the final demo phase should be indicated as part of 'new construction', right? it hasn't caused us any other problems so far, except for the infill issues...

[Anonymous]

From you innitial post it sounded to me like you are right about not
managing your phases correctly. You do not need to have an explicit "demo"
phase. The demo can be done in the new construction phase. You can have a
"demo" view that uses a phase filter to only show existing and demolished
elements. The have another plan using a phase filter showing only new and
existing elements. This should help resolve the in-fill display problems
you are having.

--
Jeff Hanson
Autodesk - AEC Technical Publications
Manchester, NH


wrote in message news:5919031@discussion.autodesk.com...
thank you. that's a very good tip. in looking at this problem i'm also now
suspecting that we are not managing our phases correctly. we have multiple
demolition phases (in the project) and each have separate phases in the
model - thus no demolition is 'phased' as happening during 'new
construction. the final demo phase should be indicated as part of 'new
construction', right? it hasn't caused us any other problems so far, except
for the infill issues...

[Anonymous]

From you innitial post it sounded to me like you are right about not
managing your phases correctly. You do not need to have an explicit "demo"
phase. The demo can be done in the new construction phase. You can have a
"demo" view that uses a phase filter to only show existing and demolished
elements. The have another plan using a phase filter showing only new and
existing elements. This should help resolve the in-fill display problems
you are having.

--
Jeff Hanson
Autodesk - AEC Technical Publications
Manchester, NH


wrote in message news:5919031@discussion.autodesk.com...
thank you. that's a very good tip. in looking at this problem i'm also now
suspecting that we are not managing our phases correctly. we have multiple
demolition phases (in the project) and each have separate phases in the
model - thus no demolition is 'phased' as happening during 'new
construction. the final demo phase should be indicated as part of 'new
construction', right? it hasn't caused us any other problems so far, except
for the infill issues...

[Anonymous]

Good tip, I was having issues with the infills, no clue what was going on, now I know. Sometimes the 1/8" back and forth doesn't work when done to the New Construction element, say, the replaced door. In those cases I've moved the original back abd forth and that did the job. Sometimes, though, that doesn't work. Then you have to use the Pick new host function and select the infill. I was working with a system, one door in the middle and 2 windows on each side, symmetrical. The three of them to be replaced with a sliding 4 panel door, but with the same overall width and height as the original system. The two windows I sorted out with the 1/8" back and forth method (or whatever small increment indeed). But picking the infill as a new host, even though it all works, is kind of a strange thing to have to do, since the host could be the original wall. Anyway, it seems like in these cases it's a matter of playing with switching between original wall and infill as a host for those windows that give us problems on either Existing Conditions or New Construction phases. Thanks for the tip again.

[Anonymous]

Good tip, I was having issues with the infills, no clue what was going on, now I know. Sometimes the 1/8" back and forth doesn't work when done to the New Construction element, say, the replaced door. In those cases I've moved the original back abd forth and that did the job. Sometimes, though, that doesn't work. Then you have to use the Pick new host function and select the infill. I was working with a system, one door in the middle and 2 windows on each side, symmetrical. The three of them to be replaced with a sliding 4 panel door, but with the same overall width and height as the original system. The two windows I sorted out with the 1/8" back and forth method (or whatever small increment indeed). But picking the infill as a new host, even though it all works, is kind of a strange thing to have to do, since the host could be the original wall. Anyway, it seems like in these cases it's a matter of playing with switching between original wall and infill as a host for those windows that give us problems on either Existing Conditions or New Construction phases. Thanks for the tip again.

[Anonymous]

I have to agree that this is a quirk of Revit that we have come to live with and work around.

In real life, when I remove a door I am left with a structured opening that I can choose to close up, leave open, or insert a new door.

In my ideal Revit, I could toggle "auto infill" (by instance) and it would make my masonry renovations exceedingly more enjoyable.

A "replace with new door" option is probably too many years out...

[Anonymous]

I have to agree that this is a quirk of Revit that we have come to live with and work around.

In real life, when I remove a door I am left with a structured opening that I can choose to close up, leave open, or insert a new door.

In my ideal Revit, I could toggle "auto infill" (by instance) and it would make my masonry renovations exceedingly more enjoyable.

A "replace with new door" option is probably too many years out...

[RDAOU]

You really had to revive this ancient post?! AFTER 8 YEARS!!! Things one might want to consider...

1. the opening resides within the DOOR family and not as a separate entity on its own and that when you demolish a door you are explicitly telling Revit to demolish the family (ie: door + Opening)
2. if one would model the door separately from the opening and use a face based or adaptive family, that the sledge hammer would leave the opening intact and just take out the door
3. demolishing is not actually a phase but in fact a new construction in the sense of an activity
4. Revit does not and cannot predict what one wants to actually model
5. One can always hide it or select it>>change it to a curtain wall with empty panel and no mullion.

[RDAOU]

You really had to revive this ancient post?! AFTER 8 YEARS!!! Things one might want to consider...

1. the opening resides within the DOOR family and not as a separate entity on its own and that when you demolish a door you are explicitly telling Revit to demolish the family (ie: door + Opening)
2. if one would model the door separately from the opening and use a face based or adaptive family, that the sledge hammer would leave the opening intact and just take out the door
3. demolishing is not actually a phase but in fact a new construction in the sense of an activity
4. Revit does not and cannot predict what one wants to actually model
5. One can always hide it or select it>>change it to a curtain wall with empty panel and no mullion.

[Anonymous]

Wow.  Let's take it down a level. 

First, the latest post on this ancient string is from 3 months ago - not that it should matter.

When I post in a community forum, I prefer to post as if I might run into this person someday and that maybe we have jobs and reputations to maintain.   I am here to help and be helped.  I am not asking anyone to 'Make Revit Great Again',  I think it is great now and have been using it for 14+ years in which time I have not bee accused of not understanding it.  Revit's greatest strength is that it is rooted in real world construction and that is actually where this string hopes to reinforce Revit's strengths

I understand your points from 1 to 3 and do not want those to change. 

I disagree with your fourth assumption that I want Revit to predict what I want. What I m actually saying is that Revit is aware that it has automatically infilled an opening.  The program knows where it is, how big, and what shape.  So, it would be a more elegant solution for me to be able to toggle the infill off instead of creating new wall opening family for every door I want to leave open and align it. 

A toggle is a choice to not have a magic wall appear where I want to leave it open.  Programmers are geniuses and I know this is within their skillset, but if I don't bring up a desirable solution, it might not be at the forefront of their mind.

[Anonymous]

Wow.  Let's take it down a level. 

First, the latest post on this ancient string is from 3 months ago - not that it should matter.

When I post in a community forum, I prefer to post as if I might run into this person someday and that maybe we have jobs and reputations to maintain.   I am here to help and be helped.  I am not asking anyone to 'Make Revit Great Again',  I think it is great now and have been using it for 14+ years in which time I have not bee accused of not understanding it.  Revit's greatest strength is that it is rooted in real world construction and that is actually where this string hopes to reinforce Revit's strengths

I understand your points from 1 to 3 and do not want those to change. 

I disagree with your fourth assumption that I want Revit to predict what I want. What I m actually saying is that Revit is aware that it has automatically infilled an opening.  The program knows where it is, how big, and what shape.  So, it would be a more elegant solution for me to be able to toggle the infill off instead of creating new wall opening family for every door I want to leave open and align it. 

A toggle is a choice to not have a magic wall appear where I want to leave it open.  Programmers are geniuses and I know this is within their skillset, but if I don't bring up a desirable solution, it might not be at the forefront of their mind.

[RDAOU]

---

@Anonymouswrote:

I disagree with your fourth assumption that I want Revit to predict what I want. What I m actually saying is that Revit is aware that it has automatically infilled an opening.  The program knows where it is, how big, and what shape. 

---

How is that? Im slightly confused. You agree that the cutting element is in the family and it is gone after you removed that family...and yet you expect the cut to remain with no void or insert to cut the element with?! Maybe I am missing something but it sounds somewhat like saying the opening should be an imaginary assumption.

If I am missing out on something then please explain the idea being proposed...how can do you expect to preserve the opening in a wall and if it is a toggle, what shall the toggle/switch do? A visibility toggle to make it invisible while it actually is still there ie: : make the infills invisible to make everyone happy kinda solution ... if that is the case the:

1. right click it and hide it 
2. or do your phasing differently to avoid having those infills the first place

[RDAOU]

---

@Anonymouswrote:

I disagree with your fourth assumption that I want Revit to predict what I want. What I m actually saying is that Revit is aware that it has automatically infilled an opening.  The program knows where it is, how big, and what shape. 

---

How is that? Im slightly confused. You agree that the cutting element is in the family and it is gone after you removed that family...and yet you expect the cut to remain with no void or insert to cut the element with?! Maybe I am missing something but it sounds somewhat like saying the opening should be an imaginary assumption.

If I am missing out on something then please explain the idea being proposed...how can do you expect to preserve the opening in a wall and if it is a toggle, what shall the toggle/switch do? A visibility toggle to make it invisible while it actually is still there ie: : make the infills invisible to make everyone happy kinda solution ... if that is the case the:

1. right click it and hide it 
2. or do your phasing differently to avoid having those infills the first place

[Darin_HDR · Accepted solution]

I found a work around that I think will work pretty good. If you set it up in your templete, it should get you what you want with little hassle each time moving forward.

I created a material, call it demolished opening and made it transparent. Not sure if this is necessary but I tried to make the material disappear as much as possible in the off chance it does show up somewhere by accident. Then I created a wall type (call it Demolished Opening) and made it 1/16” thick and assigned this new material to it. Again the 1/16” thickness is to make it as thin as possible in case it does show up somewhere but it shouldn’t. I assign ‘DEMO’ to the wall Type Mark.

Then I create a graphic display filter for walls with the Type Mark ‘DEMO’.

Then apply this filter to your views or view templates and make it “not visible”

Then when Revit infills the wall you demolished something out of, you select the infill wall and turn it to the Demolished Opening wall type and poof, it disappears (by which I mean every view with the filter set up in, it becomes not visible).

[Darin_HDR · Accepted solution]

I found a work around that I think will work pretty good. If you set it up in your templete, it should get you what you want with little hassle each time moving forward.

I created a material, call it demolished opening and made it transparent. Not sure if this is necessary but I tried to make the material disappear as much as possible in the off chance it does show up somewhere by accident. Then I created a wall type (call it Demolished Opening) and made it 1/16” thick and assigned this new material to it. Again the 1/16” thickness is to make it as thin as possible in case it does show up somewhere but it shouldn’t. I assign ‘DEMO’ to the wall Type Mark.

Then I create a graphic display filter for walls with the Type Mark ‘DEMO’.

Then apply this filter to your views or view templates and make it “not visible”

Then when Revit infills the wall you demolished something out of, you select the infill wall and turn it to the Demolished Opening wall type and poof, it disappears (by which I mean every view with the filter set up in, it becomes not visible).

[Anonymous]

Check out the idea about this subject here:

http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/revit-ideas/infill-yes-or-no-option/idi-p/6473443

@Anonymous @Darin_HDR

But what @RDAOU said...holy cow you resurrected an old thread!!  One with Scott Womack too...miss that guy.

[Anonymous]

Check out the idea about this subject here:

http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/revit-ideas/infill-yes-or-no-option/idi-p/6473443

@Anonymous @Darin_HDR

But what @RDAOU said...holy cow you resurrected an old thread!!  One with Scott Womack too...miss that guy.

[Anonymous]

Thanks - good ideas never die.
It is not an issue I lost a lot of sleep over, but it would be nice.

[Anonymous]

Thanks - good ideas never die.
It is not an issue I lost a lot of sleep over, but it would be nice.

[Anonymous]

E.F.D. -  

Interestingly, I did do something similar on a project (but at 1/32"...).

I didn't use the filter, but that could be handy.

With historic stuff, I am probably best served by editing the wall profile if I don't need it to be smart in other areas.

[Anonymous]

E.F.D. -  

Interestingly, I did do something similar on a project (but at 1/32"...).

I didn't use the filter, but that could be handy.

With historic stuff, I am probably best served by editing the wall profile if I don't need it to be smart in other areas.