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Adesk bashing

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Message 1 of 105
Anonymous
779 Views, 104 Replies
‎05-27-2003 05:03 AM

Adesk bashing

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-27-2003 05:03 AM
I've been extremely busy lately and havn't participated in this forum for a while. What I notice reading through here today is A LOT of very negative comments. I want to put my 2 cents in.



First of all it is to our advantage to have Autodesk employees participate in this group. Most of them do it because they WANT to, as volunteers. If we just bash their work constantly in a non-constructive way it will only encourage them to ignore this forum.

Secondly Rome wasn't built in a day. Inventor has had some problems, we all know that. Shapemanager is an example of Autodesk taking a major step to solve a problem. It will take time, you don't fix up somebody elses kernal with a decade of bugs in it within a few months. Autodesk has taken some major steps in other areas too to address key issues. It will take time for the changes to have an effect on things howerver. My point is things are being addressed but it takes time for the changes to occur.

Finally I'm sure somebody can read back through the posts and find times when I bashed Autodesk as well. We all get frustrated but lets all try and focus on being constructive.

Rich Thomas
0 Likes
‎05-27-2003 05:03 AM

Adesk bashing

I've been extremely busy lately and havn't participated in this forum for a while. What I notice reading through here today is A LOT of very negative comments. I want to put my 2 cents in.



First of all it is to our advantage to have Autodesk employees participate in this group. Most of them do it because they WANT to, as volunteers. If we just bash their work constantly in a non-constructive way it will only encourage them to ignore this forum.

Secondly Rome wasn't built in a day. Inventor has had some problems, we all know that. Shapemanager is an example of Autodesk taking a major step to solve a problem. It will take time, you don't fix up somebody elses kernal with a decade of bugs in it within a few months. Autodesk has taken some major steps in other areas too to address key issues. It will take time for the changes to have an effect on things howerver. My point is things are being addressed but it takes time for the changes to occur.

Finally I'm sure somebody can read back through the posts and find times when I bashed Autodesk as well. We all get frustrated but lets all try and focus on being constructive.

Rich Thomas
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104 REPLIES 104
Message 61 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-27-2003 11:50 PM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-27-2003 11:50 PM
Forget subscription, one new feature does not
require a new release number. Now they can say we have released 8 versions in X
number of years.
0 Likes
‎05-27-2003 11:50 PM

Forget subscription, one new feature does not
require a new release number. Now they can say we have released 8 versions in X
number of years.
Report
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Message 62 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-27-2003 11:50 PM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-27-2003 11:50 PM
How about the check-in/check-out functionality of
the semi-isolated mode... for which an overlapping product was aquired
from TrueVault afterwards?

 

Sorry Mike ;0)

 

Dave


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
Ok,
let me rephrase,... the new features are product aquired features that were
not featured in the existing product prior to aquiring the new prodocts to
enhance the existing product features with new features. My tongue hurts......
Mike
0 Likes
‎05-27-2003 11:50 PM

How about the check-in/check-out functionality of
the semi-isolated mode... for which an overlapping product was aquired
from TrueVault afterwards?

 

Sorry Mike ;0)

 

Dave


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
Ok,
let me rephrase,... the new features are product aquired features that were
not featured in the existing product prior to aquiring the new prodocts to
enhance the existing product features with new features. My tongue hurts......
Mike
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Message 63 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-27-2003 11:52 PM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-27-2003 11:52 PM
The way it was explained to me was that they cannot
add new functionality without charging for it.

 

Ed


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

From what I have come to understand, is that
since adsk is a publicly traded company they are bound by certain regulations
that prevent them from adding new functionality to a product without
incrementing the release number.

 

It was explained to me that they can't release a
product today, post the sales today, and actually add the features later
through service packs.

 

So the requirement to increment the release
number is an imposed regulation.

 

So why not an incremental number instead of a
full step... it's just a number to distinguish one release from
another.

 

Take for example AutoCAD that jumped from R14 to
R2000 - did it include 1,984 release levels of new functionality?  Its
just a number.

 

Dave

 


face=Arial size=2> 



style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
What makes the AutoCAD 2004 functionality
require a new version number?  The only answer I can come up with is
$$$.
0 Likes
‎05-27-2003 11:52 PM

The way it was explained to me was that they cannot
add new functionality without charging for it.

 

Ed


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

From what I have come to understand, is that
since adsk is a publicly traded company they are bound by certain regulations
that prevent them from adding new functionality to a product without
incrementing the release number.

 

It was explained to me that they can't release a
product today, post the sales today, and actually add the features later
through service packs.

 

So the requirement to increment the release
number is an imposed regulation.

 

So why not an incremental number instead of a
full step... it's just a number to distinguish one release from
another.

 

Take for example AutoCAD that jumped from R14 to
R2000 - did it include 1,984 release levels of new functionality?  Its
just a number.

 

Dave

 


face=Arial size=2> 



style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
What makes the AutoCAD 2004 functionality
require a new version number?  The only answer I can come up with is
$$$.
Report
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Message 64 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-27-2003 11:52 PM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-27-2003 11:52 PM
We all know what problems their "under the hood"
fiddling has caused.

 

My position is that it should have been a point
release, a full version increase is misleading
(IMHO).
0 Likes
‎05-27-2003 11:52 PM

We all know what problems their "under the hood"
fiddling has caused.

 

My position is that it should have been a point
release, a full version increase is misleading
(IMHO).
Report
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Message 65 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-27-2003 11:53 PM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-27-2003 11:53 PM
Thats ok Dave, for non AIS users this will not be an issue. Fore AIS users they will have the option to use it (Vaulting), or disregard it. The vaulting will be available before the IV Pro is released, thats all I can say about it. Mike
0 Likes
‎05-27-2003 11:53 PM

Thats ok Dave, for non AIS users this will not be an issue. Fore AIS users they will have the option to use it (Vaulting), or disregard it. The vaulting will be available before the IV Pro is released, thats all I can say about it. Mike
Report
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Message 66 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-27-2003 11:59 PM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-27-2003 11:59 PM
When doing drawing revisions so you revise using a whole number numerical or alphabetical sequence, ie, 1,2,3/A,B,C or do you make a small changes in minor sequences, that is 2.2, 3.5, or A'g.
0 Likes
‎05-27-2003 11:59 PM

When doing drawing revisions so you revise using a whole number numerical or alphabetical sequence, ie, 1,2,3/A,B,C or do you make a small changes in minor sequences, that is 2.2, 3.5, or A'g.
Report
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Message 67 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-28-2003 12:06 AM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-28-2003 12:06 AM
Walt, excellent piece of work. I couldn't have said it any better. I hope Autodesk is listening.
0 Likes
‎05-28-2003 12:06 AM

Walt, excellent piece of work. I couldn't have said it any better. I hope Autodesk is listening.
Report
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Message 68 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-28-2003 12:06 AM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-28-2003 12:06 AM
You might be right about the point release
thing.  I'm not sure what the requirements would be.

 

The only R7 issue that's given me any real
grief is the equal constraint bug.  The rest of my gripes
are carryover stuff.  It seems to me that R7 has been a stable and
benign (if unexciting) release.

 

Walt


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

We all know what problems their "under the hood"
fiddling has caused.

 

My position is that it should have been a point
release, a full version increase is misleading
(IMHO).
0 Likes
‎05-28-2003 12:06 AM

You might be right about the point release
thing.  I'm not sure what the requirements would be.

 

The only R7 issue that's given me any real
grief is the equal constraint bug.  The rest of my gripes
are carryover stuff.  It seems to me that R7 has been a stable and
benign (if unexciting) release.

 

Walt


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

We all know what problems their "under the hood"
fiddling has caused.

 

My position is that it should have been a point
release, a full version increase is misleading
(IMHO).
Report
0 Likes
Reply
Message 69 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-28-2003 12:20 AM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-28-2003 12:20 AM
<g> I'm sure they are.  I'm told that
some of my posts have been forwarded all over the place.  I've
wondered at times if there aren't a few pictures of me hanging on dartboards in
Autodesk's breakrooms.....

 

Seriously, the developers do monitor threads like
this.  Sadly, I doubt the marketers and upper-echelon decision-makers
do.  This big a dose of reality all at once would probably send a
marketing boyo into a coma.

 

WJ


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
Walt,
excellent piece of work. I couldn't have said it any better. I hope Autodesk
is listening.
0 Likes
‎05-28-2003 12:20 AM

<g> I'm sure they are.  I'm told that
some of my posts have been forwarded all over the place.  I've
wondered at times if there aren't a few pictures of me hanging on dartboards in
Autodesk's breakrooms.....

 

Seriously, the developers do monitor threads like
this.  Sadly, I doubt the marketers and upper-echelon decision-makers
do.  This big a dose of reality all at once would probably send a
marketing boyo into a coma.

 

WJ


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
Walt,
excellent piece of work. I couldn't have said it any better. I hope Autodesk
is listening.
Report
0 Likes
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Message 70 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-28-2003 12:21 AM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-28-2003 12:21 AM
Actually - if you are considering that the full release was for the revision of the DWG file format (a single part in the assembly called Inventor), but yet there was no major modification, or change to the overall apperance of Inventor - then the DWG File format change would be considered a minor change to that assembly (INV) - which would then require a point change rather than a full rev change.
Its like this (if you didn't follow from above) I have an assembly with 2 diff. casing caps, caore wire and conduit. This assembly is at rev 1.0. Well now I have to modify 1 of the casing caps becasue the teolerances are too big for production. I reduce the size of the tolerance and that individual drawing gets a full bump but the assembly it is linked to gets a minor bump to 1.1 Otherwise you run into the problem of the cutomer seeing the new 2.0 rev on that assembly and not being able to find out what warrented the full rev bump where if they saw the 1.1 rev they would know it was something minor.
Thats the way I see it
0 Likes
‎05-28-2003 12:21 AM

Actually - if you are considering that the full release was for the revision of the DWG file format (a single part in the assembly called Inventor), but yet there was no major modification, or change to the overall apperance of Inventor - then the DWG File format change would be considered a minor change to that assembly (INV) - which would then require a point change rather than a full rev change.
Its like this (if you didn't follow from above) I have an assembly with 2 diff. casing caps, caore wire and conduit. This assembly is at rev 1.0. Well now I have to modify 1 of the casing caps becasue the teolerances are too big for production. I reduce the size of the tolerance and that individual drawing gets a full bump but the assembly it is linked to gets a minor bump to 1.1 Otherwise you run into the problem of the cutomer seeing the new 2.0 rev on that assembly and not being able to find out what warrented the full rev bump where if they saw the 1.1 rev they would know it was something minor.
Thats the way I see it
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Message 71 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-28-2003 12:36 AM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-28-2003 12:36 AM
My point is, one aquired asset is part of AIS and
another aquired asset is part of AIP.

 

Dave 


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
Thats
ok Dave, for non AIS users this will not be an issue. Fore AIS users they will
have the option to use it (Vaulting), or disregard it. The vaulting will be
available before the IV Pro is released, thats all I can say about it.
Mike
0 Likes
‎05-28-2003 12:36 AM

My point is, one aquired asset is part of AIS and
another aquired asset is part of AIP.

 

Dave 


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
Thats
ok Dave, for non AIS users this will not be an issue. Fore AIS users they will
have the option to use it (Vaulting), or disregard it. The vaulting will be
available before the IV Pro is released, thats all I can say about it.
Mike
Report
0 Likes
Reply
Message 72 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-28-2003 12:37 AM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-28-2003 12:37 AM
I'd be looking for a new VAR.... or perhaps R cuz
they aren't A any V (G)

 

Dave


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

We get absolutely ZERO help from our
reseller.  They simply don't know the software.  I would at least
like to use them as a go between from us to Autodesk, but they are so lazy
there's no need to bother.
0 Likes
‎05-28-2003 12:37 AM

I'd be looking for a new VAR.... or perhaps R cuz
they aren't A any V (G)

 

Dave


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

We get absolutely ZERO help from our
reseller.  They simply don't know the software.  I would at least
like to use them as a go between from us to Autodesk, but they are so lazy
there's no need to bother.
Report
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Message 73 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-28-2003 12:40 AM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-28-2003 12:40 AM
Walt, send me your new email address (I think I misplaced it)

I send some stuff to your hotmail one but not sure you read it..

--
Sean Dotson, PE
http://www.sdotson.com
Check the Inventor FAQ for most common questions
www.sdotson.com/faq.html
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Walt Jaquith" wrote in message
news:0A18296D8F54405E4EBD38407FBC6575@in.WebX.maYIadrTaRb...
> I'm sure they are. I'm told that some of my posts have been forwarded
all over the place. I've wondered at times if there aren't a few pictures
of me hanging on dartboards in Autodesk's breakrooms.....
>
> Seriously, the developers do monitor threads like this. Sadly, I doubt
the marketers and upper-echelon decision-makers do. This big a dose of
reality all at once would probably send a marketing boyo into a coma.
>
> WJ
> "LandPman" wrote in message
news:f167ac3.70@WebX.maYIadrTaRb...
> Walt, excellent piece of work. I couldn't have said it any better. I
hope Autodesk is listening.
0 Likes
‎05-28-2003 12:40 AM

Walt, send me your new email address (I think I misplaced it)

I send some stuff to your hotmail one but not sure you read it..

--
Sean Dotson, PE
http://www.sdotson.com
Check the Inventor FAQ for most common questions
www.sdotson.com/faq.html
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Walt Jaquith" wrote in message
news:0A18296D8F54405E4EBD38407FBC6575@in.WebX.maYIadrTaRb...
> I'm sure they are. I'm told that some of my posts have been forwarded
all over the place. I've wondered at times if there aren't a few pictures
of me hanging on dartboards in Autodesk's breakrooms.....
>
> Seriously, the developers do monitor threads like this. Sadly, I doubt
the marketers and upper-echelon decision-makers do. This big a dose of
reality all at once would probably send a marketing boyo into a coma.
>
> WJ
> "LandPman" wrote in message
news:f167ac3.70@WebX.maYIadrTaRb...
> Walt, excellent piece of work. I couldn't have said it any better. I
hope Autodesk is listening.
Report
0 Likes
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Message 74 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-28-2003 12:50 AM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-28-2003 12:50 AM
That's not that different from my job.  I have
to answer questions from our customers as to why the product does or doesn't
work and will it do this, that, or the other and if not, why not.  I can
usually answer their questions, and part of the time, it's not to the customer's
satisfaction, but at least they got to talk to someone at the company that
produced the product, and they received a definite answer.

 

I still have to design products that the management
wants to produce.  Management should want to produce what customers want,
and the sales department should be finding out what customers want.  So if
it's not the job of the software designers to dialog with us, the customers,
then sales should be here finding out what we want and pushing to get it for
us!  And by sales, I don't mean the VARs, I mean someone that receives a
check from Autodesk at the end of the week.

 

-Mike


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

There are a number of valid reasons why the
development team can't hang out here much.  For one, they're (hopefully)
too busy developing.  This place would end up a huge time sink for any
developer who posted regularly.  You'd have folks getting upset if there
were no "official" response to their particular problem, and it would get all
unpleasant.  For another, it's dangerous.  Those guys have to be so
careful about what they say.  We would be unable to resist the urge to
pump them for information that it would cost their job to give out. 
How'd you like to work in an atmosphere where everyone could freely express
and explain themselves but you?  Finally, look back on the times a
developer did post, and find me an example where they weren't subsequently
deluged with "while we've got your attention, when are you going to fix
this..." posts.  As I've said before, the last developer I talked to told
me his work was scheduled for the next eighteen months.  They don't
decide what they'll be working on, and can't talk about it even if they are
working on that particular problem, and so have no good answer to posts like
that.

 

This group is a minefield for the development
team.  With the ordeal they go through when they do post, I consider us
lucky that they come here at all.

 

Walt


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
I
agree. why don't we see more autodesk help on this discussion group.
wouldn't hurt them to chime in every now in and again. but they don't which
just shows they don't care. its all about the money any more... tried to
get a answer about the welding feature and all they could do was try to
defend them selves without giving me a true answer. then try to say it was
the customers fault not thiers.
0 Likes
‎05-28-2003 12:50 AM

That's not that different from my job.  I have
to answer questions from our customers as to why the product does or doesn't
work and will it do this, that, or the other and if not, why not.  I can
usually answer their questions, and part of the time, it's not to the customer's
satisfaction, but at least they got to talk to someone at the company that
produced the product, and they received a definite answer.

 

I still have to design products that the management
wants to produce.  Management should want to produce what customers want,
and the sales department should be finding out what customers want.  So if
it's not the job of the software designers to dialog with us, the customers,
then sales should be here finding out what we want and pushing to get it for
us!  And by sales, I don't mean the VARs, I mean someone that receives a
check from Autodesk at the end of the week.

 

-Mike


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

There are a number of valid reasons why the
development team can't hang out here much.  For one, they're (hopefully)
too busy developing.  This place would end up a huge time sink for any
developer who posted regularly.  You'd have folks getting upset if there
were no "official" response to their particular problem, and it would get all
unpleasant.  For another, it's dangerous.  Those guys have to be so
careful about what they say.  We would be unable to resist the urge to
pump them for information that it would cost their job to give out. 
How'd you like to work in an atmosphere where everyone could freely express
and explain themselves but you?  Finally, look back on the times a
developer did post, and find me an example where they weren't subsequently
deluged with "while we've got your attention, when are you going to fix
this..." posts.  As I've said before, the last developer I talked to told
me his work was scheduled for the next eighteen months.  They don't
decide what they'll be working on, and can't talk about it even if they are
working on that particular problem, and so have no good answer to posts like
that.

 

This group is a minefield for the development
team.  With the ordeal they go through when they do post, I consider us
lucky that they come here at all.

 

Walt


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
I
agree. why don't we see more autodesk help on this discussion group.
wouldn't hurt them to chime in every now in and again. but they don't which
just shows they don't care. its all about the money any more... tried to
get a answer about the welding feature and all they could do was try to
defend them selves without giving me a true answer. then try to say it was
the customers fault not thiers.
Report
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Message 75 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-28-2003 12:57 AM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-28-2003 12:57 AM
It should be the program/product managers that are
here.  They go out in the field all the time.  They should be here to
see is and is not working.  To see HOW something should work!  I made
a suggestion that they should hire or invite some ME to sit down at the Autodesk
site and use the product 8 -10 hours a day and when something didn't work, they
could look up the developer and "discuss" it with them.  The QA manager
drooled over the idea, but knew it would never get funded.  This newsgroup
is the next best thing.

 

Ed


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

That's not that different from my job.  I
have to answer questions from our customers as to why the product does or
doesn't work and will it do this, that, or the other and if not, why
not.  I can usually answer their questions, and part of the time, it's
not to the customer's satisfaction, but at least they got to talk to someone
at the company that produced the product, and they received a definite
answer.

 

I still have to design products that the
management wants to produce.  Management should want to produce what
customers want, and the sales department should be finding out what customers
want.  So if it's not the job of the software designers to dialog with
us, the customers, then sales should be here finding out what we want and
pushing to get it for us!  And by sales, I don't mean the VARs, I mean
someone that receives a check from Autodesk at the end of the
week.

 

-Mike


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

There are a number of valid reasons why the
development team can't hang out here much.  For one, they're
(hopefully) too busy developing.  This place would end up a huge time
sink for any developer who posted regularly.  You'd have folks getting
upset if there were no "official" response to their particular problem, and
it would get all unpleasant.  For another, it's dangerous.  Those
guys have to be so careful about what they say.  We would be unable to
resist the urge to pump them for information that it would cost their job to
give out.  How'd you like to work in an atmosphere where everyone could
freely express and explain themselves but you?  Finally, look back on
the times a developer did post, and find me an example where they weren't
subsequently deluged with "while we've got your attention, when are you
going to fix this..." posts.  As I've said before, the last developer I
talked to told me his work was scheduled for the next eighteen months. 
They don't decide what they'll be working on, and can't talk about it even
if they are working on that particular problem, and so have no good answer
to posts like that.

 

This group is a minefield for the development
team.  With the ordeal they go through when they do post, I consider us
lucky that they come here at all.

 

Walt


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
I
agree. why don't we see more autodesk help on this discussion group.
wouldn't hurt them to chime in every now in and again. but they don't
which just shows they don't care. its all about the money any more...
tried to get a answer about the welding feature and all they could do
was try to defend them selves without giving me a true answer. then try to
say it was the customers fault not
thiers.
0 Likes
‎05-28-2003 12:57 AM

It should be the program/product managers that are
here.  They go out in the field all the time.  They should be here to
see is and is not working.  To see HOW something should work!  I made
a suggestion that they should hire or invite some ME to sit down at the Autodesk
site and use the product 8 -10 hours a day and when something didn't work, they
could look up the developer and "discuss" it with them.  The QA manager
drooled over the idea, but knew it would never get funded.  This newsgroup
is the next best thing.

 

Ed


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

That's not that different from my job.  I
have to answer questions from our customers as to why the product does or
doesn't work and will it do this, that, or the other and if not, why
not.  I can usually answer their questions, and part of the time, it's
not to the customer's satisfaction, but at least they got to talk to someone
at the company that produced the product, and they received a definite
answer.

 

I still have to design products that the
management wants to produce.  Management should want to produce what
customers want, and the sales department should be finding out what customers
want.  So if it's not the job of the software designers to dialog with
us, the customers, then sales should be here finding out what we want and
pushing to get it for us!  And by sales, I don't mean the VARs, I mean
someone that receives a check from Autodesk at the end of the
week.

 

-Mike


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

There are a number of valid reasons why the
development team can't hang out here much.  For one, they're
(hopefully) too busy developing.  This place would end up a huge time
sink for any developer who posted regularly.  You'd have folks getting
upset if there were no "official" response to their particular problem, and
it would get all unpleasant.  For another, it's dangerous.  Those
guys have to be so careful about what they say.  We would be unable to
resist the urge to pump them for information that it would cost their job to
give out.  How'd you like to work in an atmosphere where everyone could
freely express and explain themselves but you?  Finally, look back on
the times a developer did post, and find me an example where they weren't
subsequently deluged with "while we've got your attention, when are you
going to fix this..." posts.  As I've said before, the last developer I
talked to told me his work was scheduled for the next eighteen months. 
They don't decide what they'll be working on, and can't talk about it even
if they are working on that particular problem, and so have no good answer
to posts like that.

 

This group is a minefield for the development
team.  With the ordeal they go through when they do post, I consider us
lucky that they come here at all.

 

Walt


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
I
agree. why don't we see more autodesk help on this discussion group.
wouldn't hurt them to chime in every now in and again. but they don't
which just shows they don't care. its all about the money any more...
tried to get a answer about the welding feature and all they could do
was try to defend them selves without giving me a true answer. then try to
say it was the customers fault not
thiers.
Report
0 Likes
Reply
Message 76 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-28-2003 01:18 AM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-28-2003 01:18 AM
Actually, I think if they add any brand new code (for something that doesn't
already exist in the program) it gets a new release number. SP releases
never have any brand new code; they are bug/defect fixes only.
~Larry

"Jerry Berry" <-> wrote in message
news:16D118DDA0C30E7BDF8142D8B3D59D2B@in.WebX.maYIadrTaRb...
> Forget subscription, one new feature does not require a new release
number. Now they can say we have released 8 versions in X number of years.
0 Likes
‎05-28-2003 01:18 AM

Actually, I think if they add any brand new code (for something that doesn't
already exist in the program) it gets a new release number. SP releases
never have any brand new code; they are bug/defect fixes only.
~Larry

"Jerry Berry" <-> wrote in message
news:16D118DDA0C30E7BDF8142D8B3D59D2B@in.WebX.maYIadrTaRb...
> Forget subscription, one new feature does not require a new release
number. Now they can say we have released 8 versions in X number of years.
Report
0 Likes
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Message 77 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-28-2003 02:07 AM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-28-2003 02:07 AM
We're thinking about looking into another, but
would like someone local.
0 Likes
‎05-28-2003 02:07 AM

We're thinking about looking into another, but
would like someone local.
Report
0 Likes
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Message 78 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-28-2003 02:11 AM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-28-2003 02:11 AM
So is a point release (ie: r5.3) the same as a service pack? 5.3 had new
code right? Why not call this r6.3?
0 Likes
‎05-28-2003 02:11 AM

So is a point release (ie: r5.3) the same as a service pack? 5.3 had new
code right? Why not call this r6.3?
Report
0 Likes
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Message 79 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-28-2003 02:23 AM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-28-2003 02:23 AM
Yes, that would be great.  I think it's an
excellent idea for this type of product.  Customers and everyday users of
any product seem to think of ways that they want to use the product that the
designers never thought of.  I know its true with our product.


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

It should be the program/product managers that
are here.  They go out in the field all the time.  They should be
here to see is and is not working.  To see HOW something should
work!  I made a suggestion that they should hire or invite some ME to sit
down at the Autodesk site and use the product 8 -10 hours a day and when
something didn't work, they could look up the developer and "discuss" it with
them.  The QA manager drooled over the idea, but knew it would never get
funded.  This newsgroup is the next best thing.

.
0 Likes
‎05-28-2003 02:23 AM

Yes, that would be great.  I think it's an
excellent idea for this type of product.  Customers and everyday users of
any product seem to think of ways that they want to use the product that the
designers never thought of.  I know its true with our product.


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

It should be the program/product managers that
are here.  They go out in the field all the time.  They should be
here to see is and is not working.  To see HOW something should
work!  I made a suggestion that they should hire or invite some ME to sit
down at the Autodesk site and use the product 8 -10 hours a day and when
something didn't work, they could look up the developer and "discuss" it with
them.  The QA manager drooled over the idea, but knew it would never get
funded.  This newsgroup is the next best thing.

.
Report
0 Likes
Reply
Message 80 of 105
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous
‎05-28-2003 02:24 AM

Anonymous
Not applicable
‎05-28-2003 02:24 AM
Don't get me wrong, I am on the side of the fence that would have liked to have seen more
functionality added to R7, but I don't really understand why it matters so much what it is
called. It is a new CD with some of the files containing a newer date than the old CD so
it gets a new name.

It all becomes semantics. We are probably spending more time/money/ and energy deciding
if it should be a point release or a full release than Autodesk did. 8^)

--
Kent
Assistant Moderator
Autodesk Discussion Forum Moderator Program


"Jerry Berry" <-> wrote in message
news:9DAB5C7B79D85F78CF1AC16F5F281E88@in.WebX.maYIadrTaRb...
> So is a point release (ie: r5.3) the same as a service pack? 5.3 had new
> code right? Why not call this r6.3?
>
>
0 Likes
‎05-28-2003 02:24 AM

Don't get me wrong, I am on the side of the fence that would have liked to have seen more
functionality added to R7, but I don't really understand why it matters so much what it is
called. It is a new CD with some of the files containing a newer date than the old CD so
it gets a new name.

It all becomes semantics. We are probably spending more time/money/ and energy deciding
if it should be a point release or a full release than Autodesk did. 8^)

--
Kent
Assistant Moderator
Autodesk Discussion Forum Moderator Program


"Jerry Berry" <-> wrote in message
news:9DAB5C7B79D85F78CF1AC16F5F281E88@in.WebX.maYIadrTaRb...
> So is a point release (ie: r5.3) the same as a service pack? 5.3 had new
> code right? Why not call this r6.3?
>
>
Report
0 Likes
Reply
Reply

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