Move origin not body

[Anonymous]

Hi

Is there a way to move a component origin without moving the body

I have several models with numerous components and i need need to move the origin on some components for exporting

Thanks

[laughingcreek]

No, origins by their nature are absolute and can't be moved.  can you move everything in the component relative to the origin, so they are positioned correctly? 

Attach an example if that's not going to do it.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the reply

please see the attached

i'm looking for the best way to put origin in required place on components created in position or created from body

[davebYYPCU]

Why, 

In Fusion you have a clean assembly, 

if exporting to elsewhere, change it there.

[Anonymous]

When I send the components to a third party machine shop they are having to move the parts

to a home origin for there CAM software

this is taking them time and costing us more money

[laughingcreek]

I haven't looked at your file your, but I think I understand your issue as I've imported other peoples geometry that was WAY away from the origin.  it can get weird.  Yes, they should be able to fix it themselves, but who knows what there level of computer skill is?

One possible work flow, may be a better one out there.

save each component out as there's own file, fix the origin, and send that to them

or

fix it in your assembly, and rejoin using regular joints instead of as built joints.

both seem laborious, but may be worth it to you. 

[Anonymous]

"origins are absolute" is actually the opposite of what's true, and stated in every algebra, geometry and calculus textbook I've read.

Origins are arbitrary in nature, as are coordinate systems. Defining and redefining the origin is at the root of most engineering and 3D design

[TrippyLighting]

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@Anonymous wrote:

"origins are absolute" is actually the opposite of what's true, and stated in every algebra, geometry and calculus textbook I've read.

Origins are arbitrary in nature, as are coordinate systems. Defining and redefining the origin is at the root of most engineering and 3D design

---

That's true. In any of the CAD systems I've used over the last almost 30 years, you start defining where the origin of your 3D geometry is when you start sketching or modeling. The origin is used as a reference point for constraints and dimensions. That is at the beginning of the design process. That is why they are called origins, because things originate from them 😉 Thus they are not arbitrary but their location is chosen intentionally.

That can make it hard to change them afterwards. As that is the case and because different origins are used for different purposes usually and particularly in CAM software it is a normal and common tasks to define the origin of your part for a machine setup.

You would not redefine the origin in your design as it has a different purpose. E.g in a given design you might have chosen for the origin to be in the center of an object because it is symmetric.

In the CAM environment, however, you might want to redefine the origin of that same component in the upper right corner. 

If the people that do your CAM work are not able to do this effectively, then that is bad news, but it does not mean that Fusion 360 or any other CAD software can or should provide you with a means to compensate for that weakness in your manufacturing chain. Arguing that it should isn't going to get you anywhere and most certain not immediately.

If you want more detailed help of how this can possibly accomplished then please share your model and well see what can be done, but I m fairly certain it will involve some work your end.

[TheCADWhisperer]

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@Anonymouswrote:

When I send the components to a third party machine shop they are having to move the parts

to a home origin for their CAM software

this is taking them time and costing us more money

---

How do you know where they want the Origin for the set-ups on their machines for each part?

If they are having difficulty setting up the parts for CNC programming - I would recommend finding a more experienced shop as this is a trivial and frequent function performed as automatically as a tennis player makes a shot with their racket to place the ball in desired location on court.

[Anonymous]

the real point here is this: origins are not by definition static,
unmoveable.

They can and sometimes in my experience must be moved. My experience is in
manufacturing, computational fluid dynamics, simulation and mathematical
modeling in chemicals, petrochemicals, energy and general consulting.

My experience is that it's helpful to adhere to absolute, true fact because
that's the only thing that's common in all fields.

Feel free to define and stick to convention s, but that's not the same
thing as stating artificial 'facts' as universal truth.

Fact: origins are not by definition unmoveable

[Anonymous]

Those are valid points, and productivity and efficiency are paramount in
production.

However, "origins" do, can, and sometimes *must* move.

I'm curious where you typically think of the original being located for an
irregular part where there's no symmetry. Do you design those around the
default origin in f360, and then never relocate?

[chrisplyler]

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@Anonymouswrote:

When I send the components to a third party machine shop they are having to move the parts

to a home origin for there CAM software

this is taking them time and costing us more money

---

I had assumed most CAM software had the ability to establish an Origin relative to the defined stock. Maybe that assumption was wrong?

That's how Fusion's CAM environment works. It doesn't matter where the Origin is in the Model environment. When it comes time to do the CAM, you define your stock and the machine Origin that is appropriate for your machine/setup.

[TrippyLighting]

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@Anonymous wrote:

Fact: origins are not by definition unmoveable

---

I already agreed with that statement. "Thats true" is a pretty straight forward statement!

The conventions here are provided by Fusion 360 (not me) and you'll have to move within these conventions. Fighting against them will only frustrate you as seems to be the case.

You can move geometry to relocate it in reference to the origin and when you export it, the origin will be in that changed location. However, If that works in your particular case depends on how the model was built.

Without having access to it we cannot evaluate it.

[TrippyLighting]

@Anonymous

To add to my earlier post, the convention in Fusion 360 is that origins are somewhat absolute. But this is more of a limitation in Fusion 360.

In one of my other CAD softwares I can also not move the original origin as I based my geometry building process on it.

However at any point it the design history I can define a new origin that now is the reference point of that component. Then when I want to export that component I can choose which origin/coordinate system I want to use.

Unfortunately that is something that you cannot do in Fusion 360. 

[JDMather]

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@Anonymous wrote:
Fact: origins are not by definition unmoveable

---

Your alternative facts do not match my experience.

You might create a user defined coordinate system, but The Origin is The Origin.

In CAD - The BORN Technique.

I guess maybe I need to go back to school.

[Anonymous]

these are not alternative facts. Origins are by mathematical definition NOT
static/unmovable.

The above will be true long after the stars have burned out, regardless of
your snide comment about "alternative facts".

Fact #2: for years I owned a business that built equipment using CNC
machines for customers like Mobil, Shell, Sasol. Every time we moved the
origin to a sensible location because, well, that's what sensible people do.

Fact #3: for 15 years I consulted to global corporations like Neste Oy,
NPRC, Chevron, Reliance Industries doing computation fluid dynamic
modeling, mathematical simulation/modeling. Every. Single. Time. I. Moved.
The. Origin. To. A. Place. Where. It. Made.Things. Simpler.

Fact #4: the origin in fact doesn't exist in an absolute sense - unless
you're religious (I'm not) and believe some divine entity sets the origin.
Read about relativity.

Fact #5: the origin is by definition the intersection point of the 3 axes
of the coordinate system. Which coordinate system? The User. Defined.
Coordinate. System.

All coordinate systems are user-defined. Even in Fusion360. You can move
the origin there if you know how to find the menu and aren't a sheep


And, finally, fact #6: being snide and unpleasant while hidden behind a
screen is not how adults behave

[TrippyLighting]

Did you read my last reply ?

What did you learn from it ?

[rogierweekers]

The origin moves with the component, not the body. So the solution is to move the component. A workaround for your problem: Select the body you want the origin to move, move it so it is positioned correct to the origin of the component, then move the component back to the previous point. The origin moves with the component.

[lecour.pascal]

I think he was not talking about the origin of the project.

open the body as a design, move the body from the point you need to the "origin" it was. Save it.

update the body in your design.

I don't know better for now, sorry.

[ToddHarris7556]

@Anonymous I think both @TrippyLighting and @JDMather have offered this already, but here's my spin on it:

Debating 'Origin' vs 'coordinate' system and whether or not they must be able to move is a great topic for academic debate. If you're looking for a way to simplify this and move forward, then in Fusion terms, the origin is absolute and cannot be moved. You can move a body, move a component, move a CAM setup, but if you want to move an origin, well, good luck with that 🙂

I would offer, frankly, that the CAM setup is normally best done by the CAM programmer or operator. Let's just say that you get a part 'moved' in whatever manner you're trying to do. You don't normally have knowledge of what machine they're running on. How do you know if the part will fit? Maybe they need to rotate it 90 degrees? Or maybe they zero top left, vs. your bottom left. 

I'm a huge proponent of optimizing the digital workflow and finding efficiency working with supply chain partners, and I understand trying to reduce manufacturing costs. In my experience, when the volume justifies it, we'd just develop a mid-tier tool that would take all of the parts you're exporting, process them according to business rules developed with the strategic supplier, and move on. If the volume is small and doesn't justify this kind of investment, then I would suggest that the setups are best left to the vendor. If they don't have the skillset to provide this cost-effectively, I'd be talking to new vendors.

And, no, this isn't being dismissive of your original question whatsoever - it's an honest attempt to address your issue.