Map 3D ... Idea Station, what is the future of a product without improvement

[Alfred.NESWADBA]

Hi all,

just because I just got quite angry again ....

I'm waiting for years now to be able to do (normal) development based on Visual Studio ... as since Windows 8 it's not possible any more to run Map 3D in debug mode (acadmap.arx blocks all that). >>>more details about that issue<<<. I short words: new version of product (2017), new operating system (Windows 10, all together an environment as described in the system requirements) same bug (for many years now).

I reported that as bug, I placed this in the idea station, and all that is ignored by Autodesk for years now, not any response from them (ZERO response!). My conclusion: Autodesk ignores the Map 3D application developer, Autodesk is not interested in any application or tool the developers are working on and indirectly help Map 3D to be sold.

Now I looked to the list of current ideas in the idea station. I have not looked in every detail of every single idea, but my feeling is that I'm correct with that statement: not any of the ideas are implemented in 2017 ... am I right or is there any idea now working in Map 3D 2017 in the way the idea was placed (and I overlooked that)?

Please let me know if I'm wrong .... then I would be interested in which one is now working.

As developer Map 3D seems to be more and more a platform with the risk of beeing cancelled. Getting no real improvements for years now makes me quite sceptical about the future of this product.

Would love to get feedback to that!

If I'm correct (well, let's see the response here) my plan is to get someone from Autodesk (Product manager for Map 3D) to an WebCast session and let him/her describe what's going on, or better why is there nothing improved during the last years, why are all the ideas ignored, whatfor do they have an idea station if they ignore all content in it.

At least customers are paying for updates (with the subscription) and someone has to declare what the money of the last years was used for (and not for AutoCAD new functions, because the subscription yearly fee for Map 3D is more than for Vanilla AutoCAD)

- alfred -

[Pointdump]

Alfred,

You are one of the most patient people I know. When you get angry, it's with good reason.

You're right. Kinda seems pointless to put an idea in the Map IdeaStation. I think I'll remove the link. No reason to go there anymore.

Looks like the age-old irreconcilable problem:
1. More to do
2. Fewer people to do it
3. Stockholders demand greater profit

Dave

[Murph_Map]

This is why I'm glad I'm not with a reseller any longer. I hate to tell the customer that there is nothing new in this version again and again year after year. At one time I had a good inside look and part of the Map3D product team now I don't even know who is the product manager. 

[Cadguru42]

I've been looking to see what's new in Map 3D 2017. I couldn't find anything on the main website. I had to do a Google search for Map 3d 2017 help to look up what new features are available. The fact that Autodesk isn't even bragging about it or putting it on their main site speaks volumes. They fixed some symbol stuff and that's about it. Autodesk Map 3D is dead. It's been dead for years, but we've given Autodesk the benefit of doubt. No longer will I give them that. 

It's clear that after talking with some support personnel that there isn't anyone in Autodesk actively working on Map 3D anymore. They've all moved to InfraWorks or other cloud based crap. It's similar to C3D in that there's not really any development of C3D anymore, just cosmetic changes like what's going on with Map. It's one reason we're actively looking into other non-Autodesk software after 25 years of being an Autodesk customer. 

[Murph_Map]

Sad isn't it!.  Map3D is the stepping stone to Infraworks yet Autodesk doesn't want to support it anymore. 

[kajar]

So its seems Autodesk is cosmetic company now not a software developer.

Last two-free years I havent seen any M3D new features, all have been  cosmetics. 

I think Autodesk must stop selling dead product to costumers.  

[scheel]

You are right it's a stepstone to the way Autodesk wish to go.

So stop crying all together and let us start working.

Map 3D in the actuall version has so many funtionallity.

And what we are missing, we can build self. In Osgeo.org or as our own product.

I develope in our company our Tools for GIS over years, ever with missing functionallity in Map 3D or Civil 3D.

Our users wait everytime of a new version of our tools, before they make a update. They love it.

When we all do this, it will bring much more new functions then waiting on Autodesk.

 And we will have many fun with Map 3D. It will be dead, when we do not longer invest in this product.

For those, who search for new functions, have you ever tryed the industrie model functions together with map server

to work with more gis functions. There is a great new world for you.

Thorsten

[Alfred.NESWADBA]

Hi,

>> So stop crying all together and let us start working.

That's exactly what I try to do, I just need a bit more people in this thread so we can start to be active.

If there are just 4 people beeing active I won't get a chance to be heard.

>> And what we are missing, we can build self. In Osgeo.org or as our own product.

Well, I think we need first the decission if FDO will survive with/within Map3D/Civil3D,this will make us working in different ways.

Also all the topology creation within Map3D is nothing built in a few days and I guess noone will develop a replacement as long as it's available.

>> have you ever tryed the industrie model functions

Interesting point. I would be really curois about how many people use the industry models that were not working with Topobase or c-plan before?

May feeling is that only those companies use industry models which worked with Topobase before. If anyone today buys Map3D and install's it you'll see some options for industry model even not enabled by default.

But great that this thread here is growing now (and so the number of peoples interested in some activities)!

- alfred -

[kajar]

Actually there must be point why to pay for subscription.

Subscription give us access to the latest product releases and enhancements like Autodesk advertising.

Subscription owners wish to get some benefit for it, but all they will get is new year number at the end of software name.

M3D is mostly one and only GIS software from Autodesk so why not to develop it further. I think there is lot of potensial for doing it. 

Also Industry Models are not well known, but actually this is quite good platform to move on. 

I have used Autocad since the 10'th version and M3D also 10 years and it really sad to view that development have stopped.

[Pointdump]

Kajar,

"...all they will get is new year number at the end of software name."

Pretty much sums it up.

Dave

[Anonymous]

Hi,

You cannot - at least not in normal circumstances - force a company to further develop or enhance their products. If they don't want to, they won't. Getting in touch with PM is most likely pointless as they cannot decide whether to invest or not in a product. Obviously Autodesk decision makers have set the company strategy and it doesn't involve GIS right now. 

my two rappen worth

Rob

[guenther.perchthaler]

Alfred,

You´re right !!!!!!

[braudpat]

Hello

I am using MAP since the beginning which was MAP R1 (the Worst ACAD ever released) and before It was the optionnal ADE with ACAD R12...

I am Beta tester since many years and every year I send my wishes to the "famous MAP development Team"...

MAP 2013 was the latest released with a few minor improvments...

MAP 2014-2017 is ONLY a RE-COMPILATION of the Previous Version with a few minor improvments and minor bug corrections concerning ONLY TopoBase Industry Models...

I have posted FOUR MAIN wishes into the MAP Ideastation Forum which were very successful...
This wishes list is always the SAME that I sent every year to the MAP Team...

SO NO COMMENT...

French Humour: Long Short Life to ACAD MAP !!

I am very SAD because ACAD MAP is (but soon was) very popular in France and in some European countries...

Regards, Patrice (Poor ACAD MAP old fanatic)

[Alfred.NESWADBA]

Hi Pat,

>> I am very SAD because ACAD MAP is (but soon was) very popular in France and in some European countries... 

Fully agree with that ... and worst at all: it's Autodesk itself letting the product die. It's not the user's base who try again and again to hold that product alive.

- alfred -

[Anonymous]

Hi,

so what's going to happen next? After all those complains...

I think a nicely phrased letter to the upper echolon, signed by AutoCAD Map users representing a significant number of licenses might be worth trying.
There are local user groups in Germany and Switzerland - I guess many of their members would be inclined to sign. There is also a Map forum in german language where further users could be reached. Overall I think they won't represent many licenses ( a few hundred maybe). So, where would the rest come from?  "A signficant number of licenses" - don't know how many one would consider to be "significant". I would start with 5000+.

Rob

[Alfred.NESWADBA]

Hi Robert,

>> so what's going to happen next? After all those complains...

>> Overall I think they won't represent many licenses ( a few hundred maybe)

In principle I wanted to get more feedback here, you are right, havong 5 or 10 users here to proceed with the next step's is critical.

"User Groups" is a great option, if such groups are already communicating with Autodesk and have more/betterirect connections then it would be great they take also this platform as an advantage and possibility to do more. Looking to the idea station (besides of PAT, who seems to have some users behing him in France) I have not seen any ideas placed by any user groups. At least if ideas exist, but are not posted on the vendors idea site how should Autodesk see them as important.

Robert ... as well as others beeing part of such user groups: Place your ideas on that idea station (even if they are hundred's of times discussed), but so we do have a central place (as well as a platform for everyone to give kudo's to the ideas, which one is more and which one less important) ... and having then a quite large list would also be a correct step into the direction to get in contact with the product managers if there is no reaction to that.

- alfred -

[Anonymous]

Hi Alfed,

I thought the discussion was heading into a different direction. My impression was, that Map users here feel, that Autodesk doesn't invest much in Map/GIS right now and that Autodesk should put effort and money into the product. If I got that right then adding further wishes to "idea station" will not help with that.

Just some information about Map / GIS user groups - if anyone else is interested:
There are Map user groups in Germany and Switzerland, propably representing 200+ organizations (municipalities, companies etc.). Both groups have traditionally their focus on "Topobase" / "Enterprise" or as we call it now "Industry Models". There is some contact with Map product management with regards to improving product quality (e.g. bug-fixing). Here are links to their websites: http://www.autodesk-geospatial-usergroup.eu/ / http://www.agu-ch.ch/ Would be interesting to see if there are any Map user groups in other countries as well. Are there any?

Rob

[Alfred.NESWADBA]

Hi Robert,

>> My impression was, that Map users here feel, that Autodesk doesn't invest much in Map/GIS right now and

>> that Autodesk should put effort and money into the product. If I got that right then adding further wishes to

>> "idea station" will not help with that.

For me it makes sense, otherwise we have the situation like "we users have not told Autodesk what we need, but we are waiting for Autodesk to get it done", I guess that we have to start (maybe again), to use the Idea Station to show Autodesk how important some points are, the more ideas and the more Kudo's these ideas get will raise on one side the priority and on the other side the possibility to get the people from Autodesk really listening. (my hope).

Thank you for showing User Groups, maybe someone else around the world also know such groups and can add the info here about them (and add their ideas about Map 3D they are waiting now for a long time).

- alfred -

[Alfred.NESWADBA]

Hi,

looks like just 2 handful of people are interested in "how to improve the development", quite sad ... and not really powerful to make something working ;(

- alfred -

[Anonymous]

Hi Alfred,

for Map there are 44 ideas, for Civil 900. You can have a long discussion why this is. Anyway - Civil IdeaStation has:

- 33 accepted,
- 5 comments requested,
- 12 solution provided,
- 27 implemented.

- 17 classified as duplicates

Map - zero / null / 0.

As 44 is a managable amount of ideas someone from Autodesk should go through them and accept/request comments, provide solutions or even starting implementing. Autodesk should make a move now if they are serious about Map development... When we see Autodesk is moving more user might be inclined to add further ideas. But what is the point of providing "ideas" if ADSK just ignores them.

Rob