Problem with annotative text placed on paperspace when DWGUNITS = meters

[kostastomp]

Hi everyone.

I am having a problem with the size of annotative text objects which are inserted directly on the paperspace.

It seems that if you set the DWGUNITS variable to meters (option No 6), then any annotative text object that you place directly on the layout (paperspace) will not be displaced correctly..

Try a annotative text with let's say 5mm and see for yourself. Insert some text on the model space and then go to the layout and add some text there too.

One way I found to work around this it is to chage the page settings of the layout and define the scale equal to 1:0.001, instead of 1:1, but then the paper size instaed of being in milimeters, it is measured in meters, which is not ideal and may cause issues in some printers.

Another work around would be to have a seperate text style with the annotative option turned off. But I guess this solution becomes quite cumbersome because you will need to do that for every annotative object.

Is there any "proper" fix? I mean the whole purpose if annotative text is not having to maintain different text styles or to check the sizes of object when changing scales.

Thanks for your time.

Attached is the drawing, created with ACAD 2021

[kostastomp]

Could somebody confirm whether he/she as the same issue please?

[Pointdump]

Hi Konstantinos,
I guess I don't understand the problem. My drawing attached.
Dave

[kostastomp]

Hi David,

thanks for taking the time to answer.

On your drawing, the text that you have inserted on paperspace has an annotative scale of 1:1000 which is the same as the scale you have on page setup. If I inserted some more text objects, they recognize the 1:1000 scale of the page set up and they are displayed correctly.

However, on my drawing, where I also have 1:1000 on the page set up, when I insert annotative objects on paperspace, instead of recognizing the scale from the page set up, the still get the "1:1".

Shouldn't they "see" what scale I have on the page set up when they are inserted?

You would you mind checking my drawing please?

[kostastomp]

I also notice that I cannot edit tge ratio of the 1:1 scale (I can change its name though), although I do not have anything using that scale at the moment. I even tried deleting all the annotative objects, however that scale persists and I cannot change it or delete it.

[Pointdump]

Konstantinos,
I looked at your drawing but have no idea what's wrong or what to change. I don't do much plotting, so maybe someone here who does can weigh in with something.
Dave

[kostastomp]

David,

as shown on the first photo you uploaded, the page scale you have, is set to 1:1000 (which is 1mm = 1 unit).

The text you instered has an annotative slace of 1:1000. When you inserted the text object, did it take this scale automatically, or was it 1:1 and you changed that later, upon insert?

I believe it probably took the correct scale from the page set up, because on your drawing, if I add more text objects, they automatically take the 1:1000 scale.

On my drawings however, although my page set up is the same as yours (1:1000, 1mm=1unit), the text objects I insert they all take the scale of 1:1. I can change the scale of those objects manually afterwards, which is a little bit annoying, but I am wondering, how did you manage to make it work on your drawing? 

[Pointdump]

Konstantinos,
My drawing was a straight-out-of-the-box metric template. I created a new text style with the default Simplex Font and checked the "Annotative" box, and when I made those Mtexts I typed in "5" when it asked for size. I did nothing else.
Dave

[kostastomp]

Then I guess it's a bug.

[kostastomp]

I did some reseach and found that other people are having the same issue.

When you are on a Layout tab, without having anything selected, on the properties palette there is a parameter "Annotation Scale". At first I believed that it is the scale that you set from the PageSet up dialog window, however this is not the case. Try setting another scale to the Page set up and you will notice that the Annotation Scale of the Paperspace doesn't follow this change. No matter what scale you assign to the PageSet up, the paperspace annotation scale will always have the "1:1" assigned to it. This "1:1" scale cannot be edited either. You can change its name, but that's it, you cannot change the relationship between the paperspace and the drawing units and unfortunately the Paperspace is stuck with it. When you insert Annotative objects on paperspace, they take the Annotation Scale of the paperspace, which is "1:1" in our case. If you are working in mm, this is all fine, you shouldn't have any problem

The problem starts when you try to work in different units.

       

However, if you want to change the dwg units from mm to m here is what happens.

1. Type -DWGUNITS on the command line

2. Select option 6 for meters

3. Select option 2 for decimal display format

4. Type the number of decimal figures you want (let's say 4)

5. Scale objects from other drawings upon insert? Select either Yes or No, it has no impact to the problem I am describing, but I guess that "Yes" would be more approprieate method of working

6. Match INSUNITS to drawing units? Select either Yes or No, it has no impact to the problem I am describing, but I guess that "Yes" would be more approprieate method of working

7. Scale objects in current drawing to reflect change in units? The answer to this question is critical.

If you select "Yes", then not only the drawing object will be scaled with a factor of 1/1000 (changing from mm to m), but also the same will apply to the scales. This means that the "1:1" scale, which was 1 paper unit = 1 model unit, will now become 1 paper unit = 0.001 model unit. However the names of the scales on the list will not be changed.

If you select "No", the drawing objects will remain unaltered and so will the scales.

In our case, we have an empty file so we don't really care if the drawing objets will be scaled, as we don't have creating anything yet, however we would want the scales to reflect the change in units and the "1:1" scale to become 1 paper unit = 1 model unit and then go to the Layout and set a scale of 1:1000 for the PageSet up scale and also for the Paperspace annotation Scale. We can definately do that for the PageSet up, however annotation scale of the paperspace cannot be changed. This IS a problem because now any annotative object you insert on paperspace will have the 1:1 scale of the paperspace, however the 1:1 scale corresponds to 1p aper unit = 0.001 drawing unit.

If we could somehow change the Annotation Scale of the Paperspace, this would solve the problem, however we cannot. And we cannot edit the scale itself either.

Here is a work around though, unless someone can suggest a more appropriate solution.

On step No7 of the -DWGUNITS command select "No", so that neither the drawing objects nor the scales are affected.

This way, the "1:1" scale will correspond to 1 drawing unit = 1 model unit.

Then, type SCALELISTEDIT to bring up the scale list window.

There, select the "1:1" scale and change its name to "1:1000". 

The last step will be to edit the rest of the scales in the list as follows:

For example "1:50" should be edited so that 1 paper unit = 0.050 model unit

etc.

And if for some reason you need an actual 1:1 scale, you can create a new scale. The name "1:1" no longer occupied, it's free to use. Just make sure that you set 1 paper unit = 0.001 model unit.

Now the Paperspace, which will still be assigned to the origninal "1:1" scale which we renamed to "1:1000", will have the correct annotation scale and any annotative object that you insert on paperspace will have the correct scale too.

Last but not least, do not forget to change the scale on the Page Setup dialog.

       

I hope this makes sense to anyone reading.

Similar issues on these forums:

https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/autocad-forum/annotation-scale-in-paper-space/m-p/6804230#M334726

https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/autocad-forum/annotation-scaling-in-paperspace/td-p/7084695