Pipe fitting looses connection when direction reversed

[fawzimasri7137]

HI,

i am trying to reverse the direction of Combination Wye that is already connected to pipe, but it errors out.

please see attached....

it might be related to my previous post (Re: Pipe angle changed when i replaced fitting) on a similar problem, involving changing an elbow to a Combo, and the issue there was family origin (per fabiosato).  i think i got the family origin correct now.  i have it on the vertical axis of the vertical branch of that fitting in the attached.

thanks

[jrobrador19]

Hi there.

The reason why Revit produces this error is that it cannot draw lines (in this case pipes) that are less than 1/32" which can be caused by various reasons. 

Can you share the file so we can observe the behavior of the pipes and fitting?

Thanks

[fawzimasri7137]

@jrobrador19  sure thing... please find attached test file and short sweep and Combo Families.

I am using Fittings downloaded from AB&I.

Sadly i found that i have more problems with these fittings... namely when i am using slopped pipe, cannot even convert a Short sweep into a Combo.

SO You will see 2 rows in the file. The first row has Sloped pipe. the second row does not have a slope.

i appreciate any insight on how to debug such a problem/s.

thanks

[jrobrador19]

Hi,

I tested the file and here are my findings:

1) The flanges are the issue. It seems that if I set the Flange to None in the Routing Preferences, I can flip the fitting without any errors. Downside is you don't have any flanges. I tried other flanges and it still gives the same error. It seems that the fitting has and issue when flanges are used in the routing preference.

2) I also tried deleting the flanges on the horizontal pipe. Then I flipped it then connected the pipes again to the fitting. The flanges are back again (due to the routing preference), and now I can flip them without any errors.

I think there is a bug on the family which could be geometrical or parametrical. Either way it will be hard to trace.

I hope this helps.

[aeidAEEEF]

I'm using Revit 2020 and I can easily rotate this fiiting without any problem see video below.

[jrobrador19]

Hi,

I'm using Revit 2021.1.1 and the same goes for me. But the problem occurs when you form a tee connection (a pipe intersecting another pipe perpendicularly). 

[fawzimasri7137]

@jrobrador19, @aeidAEEEF 

thanks guys for your quick response.

i have been testing with your insight since morning... still no luck.  but definitely confirmed that the Flanges are causing the issue.

All i confirm right now, is that since the fitting is not symmetrical in pipe length on the horizontal run, Revit has to shorten one pipe and lengthen another so as the fitting can be drawn in place.

the Lengthening of the pipe does not seem to be an issue.  But shorting a pipe is an issue.

still debugging.. any ideas, please let me know

[fawzimasri7137]

i attached a file where the combo flips direction correctly using the husky flange, or a TK flange that i have in the file.

But i am not sure why or how they work.

I cannot duplicate what i did.

so i saved the file hoping that someone out there can decipher it .

we did notice one other thing, that when you turn a bend into a combo, one of the pipe runs attached to the bend should be without a slope.  if both pipe runs on that bend had a slope, the combo will not be created... i don't know i f this has any connection to flipping the fitting.

[jrobrador19]

Hi again @fawzimasri7137 ,

Sometimes, it does work when you turn a 90 degree bend to a combo. Then you draw the pipe, and you can flip the fitting. It does not flip when you create a tee as I explained in my last reply to @aeidAEEEF.

Which also produces the problem for sloped pipes. It seems that the flanges are still the problem. When you remove your flanges in the routing preferences, the 90 degree bends can turn into combos without errors.

I think the best workaround here is to integrate the flanges into the combo family. I mean, create a combo type with the flanges and without the flanges, instead of having problems with them when they are separate and assigned in the routing preferences.

I hope this helps again.

[fawzimasri7137]

hi @jrobrador19 

i am tempted to include the fitting in the combo, but i am still resisting that, since 1- it i don't want a band-aid solution, since i am giving this template to the design team and would rather it be whistle clean 2- i would have to add the bands to all other fittings, or else i will have double bands drawn.

I will spend more time on it today and see what i come up with.

did you check the fittings that actually worked in there?  i am still not clear on why these do work while anything else i draw does not.