In need of some new Electrical Equipment Part Types

[PerryLackowski]

There are a few commercial/industrial electrical elements I'm finding myself constantly struggling to replicate in the MEP system, and I think they could potentially be incorporated as new Revit Electrical Equipment types. If not, I'd at least like to bring them to the developer's attention so they see the pain points we are encountering.

"Transformer and Panel" - This would be a combination of a transformer feeding an electrical panel. So it would have a primary and secondary distribution system like a transformer, but it would also allow you to produce a panel schedule.

• I have not currently found a way to replicate this as a single electrical element, so many items like Power Distribution Units, Mini Power Zones, Mini Power Centers, all need to be modeled as two separate elements, even if they are housed in one box.
• If you try nesting the panel inside the transformer, or vice versa, you run into problems setting up the electrical circuit.
• This forces you to name and circuit two separate elements, and if the name changes you need to rename the panel, the transformer, and both circuits.
• You also have to be mindful that if the items are moved, they are moved together as a unit.
• You also typically need to make the transformer hidden so you don't have two elements in your plan views, but then others are confused when they go to make changes.

Alternatively, this could be solved by allowing nested electrical equipment to be pre-circuited internally. That would be a better solution since you could then use it to model entire substations as well, with a primary disconnect, a transformer, and multiple secondary compartments represented by a panel schedule.

"Busway" - Busway poses the opposite problem. Instead of using one family to represent multiple objects, we have a need for multiple families represented by a single panel schedule. My proposed solution would allow multiple busway segments to have the same busway name with different segment names. All the loads with the same busway name could be displayed in a single schedule, and the segment lengths could be used to calculate the voltage drops.

• Currently we have a hidden panel for circuiting the busway loads, and the busway segments are all modeled separately.
• This runs counter to the idea of BIM modeling. How do I calculate the voltage drop for each load on the busway in this scenario?
• I could circuit each bus segment, one-to-the-next, but then there's no way to display all the loads in a single busway panel schedule.

Alternatively, this could be its own Type Category that would function more like mechanical duct, so you could chain the segments together and have a single panel schedule represent the entire chain.

[Tom_Kunsman]

Some of these I have ran into myself. This sort of suggestions really should go in the Ideas forum (sadly). You would need to break it up into smaller posts. 

Might want to check out this forum post also: https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/revit-mep-forum/research-request-calling-global-electrical-users-your...

[PerryLackowski]

Thanks for catching that Tom! My computer lost internet while I was writing the post and when I reloaded the page it kept my post but not the correct forum. I'm aware there's a collaboration with Schneider to implement better electrical tools, but I fear these are items that could still fly under the radar since they are less common. Unfortunately that survey appears to be closed, but I'll do as you suggest and try splitting into two posts in the ideas forum.

[RSomppi]

Have you tried any of the manufatcturers of these devices? A lot of them provide families and even software designed to for these kinds of situations that Revit cannot handle. You will probably get some sort of responce with them. It's probably a better approach than making a request to Autodesk and hoping it will be addressed in some future version. 

[Tom_Kunsman]

A bit of both might work better. Talking with the manufacturers and the resellers letting them know your issues might get somewhere. Sure, some companies outsource their content making to another company, so then might not even know who or how to contact Autodesk, but then others do.

It sort of suck that we are still faced with these uphill battles. And yes it does get tiresome email vendors and they say "we dont offer 3D" . 

[dtiemeyer]

although if Revit cannot support the desired functionality, then manufacturers could not make content to support their equipment, like Isolation panelboards. 

Pre-circuited nested equipment would be great (or even the ability to use multiple electrical connectors within one family). This might even improve the abilities for lighting control as well.

[RSomppi]

There are companies doing some pretty cool stuff with content and add-ins. I haven’t done electrical in a while but I’m pretty sure that you can get more out of Revit sooner if you look down that avenue instead of complaining about Revit’s lack of functionality.

[PerryLackowski]

Some manufacturer's do make parts for these elements, but they usually fall short in one of the ways I have described; for example, I've seen many busway elements that are built using the Mechanical Duct type category. That makes it easier to model, but impossible to build a Revit panel around, let alone assess voltage drop. I have seen other companies offer add-ins for busway, but I have not been inclined to try them because of the time it takes to train up staff on new tools (You have to convince IT and Project Managers before you can even test it out on a project, then, if it works, you can roll it out to others at the company, but you'll face resistance from those who like the old approach, and if it's anything like other add-ins I've used, it will add extra behind-the-scenes parameters that you may not be able to easily purge later). I don't pose this post as a complaint, but merely as a feature request to further expand the use/functionality of the native software.

[RSomppi]

Feature requests belong in the IDEAS forum. This forum is for solutions. I guess if you’re going to come up with excuses for not using the available solutions, I’ll stop offering them.

[dtiemeyer]

@RSomppi please read message 3 to see why this is not in the Ideas forum.  If a moderator is around, perhaps move this to the ideas forum?

@PerryLackowski I've had some success creating a linear box as electrical equipment panelboard then circuiting to it with face-based Plugs. (there is also a non-circuitable linear box for hosting plugs, because entire network is essentially one panel, then a single stick of the run is chosen as the panel and the rest are just for graphics & hosting)

[RSomppi]

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@dtiemeyer wrote:

@RSomppi please read message 3 to see why this is not in the Ideas forum. 

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I already did and it doesn't change the fact that it should be there.