DWV Piping and Tee Intersections with dual slope

[lee.imbimbo86EM4]

So I'm having this issue specifically with TEE intersections, were they work fine will pipes that are all straight, but they don't play nicely when adding slopes to those same pipes.  For example, I want a TEE intersection were the both the pipe from the right and left are draining to the TEE and then going down a pipe to the main sanitary drainage line.  But when I add the slope the it basically breaks the connection with the TEE fitting.

Now this kind of stuff is done all the time in the field, but basically the only workaround I've been able to come up with is to initially draw the pipe straight out of the fitting, and then angle it up with a union fitting.  Which is not at all how it would be constructed in reality, but seems to be the only work around I've managed to come up with.

Any suggestions to mitigate this problem?

[iainsavage]

It will probably be the way that the family is configured which constrains the angles of the branches.

You could try drawing the pipework on the flat, then select the run and use the slope tool to apply the slope.

Or you can edit the connectors in the family to allow slope adjustments, so the pipes don’t need to enter the tee at exactly the correct angle to align with the planes in the family.

Or you might need to customise the family or use a different family.

If you upload the family someone could take a look at it.

[ToanDN]

If you want a 3D Tee (left and right slope to the center) then you need to model a custom Tee family because all the OOTB Tees are flat. 

Or perform a magic trick as shown below.

[lee.imbimbo86EM4]

@ToanDN did you just in effect connect two elbows, and just have them overlap each other?  While I'm only diagramming for my purposes at this time, so this method would work for me.  I wouldn't mind later on getting into increasing my knowledge on the analytics tools in Revit.  Wouldn't this create a conflict with let's say a analytics tool in Revit for analyzing flow in the home design?

[ToanDN]

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@lee.imbimbo86EM4 wrote:

@ToanDN did you just in effect connect two elbows, and just have them overlap each other?  While I'm only diagramming for my purposes at this time, so this method would work for me.  I wouldn't mind later on getting into increasing my knowledge on the analytics tools in Revit.  Wouldn't this create a conflict with let's say a analytics tool in Revit for analyzing flow in the home design?

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Yes I did.  I am no Revit MEP user so I can't tell you if it affect the analytical calcs.

By the way, shouldn't the routing be like the below so for proper flowing?  Or at least you would have a Y instead of a T.

[lee.imbimbo86EM4]

@ToanDN that's honestly up to me Plumbing Engineer.  On this project he isn't in Revit, and while we thought that wouldn't be an issue at first, clash detection and routing proved more difficult and something we needed to model to resolve.  So I'm the Architect and I'm modelling it to coordinate basically routing, locations, runs, etc.  I've been led to believe that I could use a fitting like this one to bring the two runs together and then drop them in the wall from the third floor to the main drain out of the home.  

LINK:  https://www.supplyhouse.com/Spears-P500-030-3-PVC-DWV-Double-Fixture-Fitting

The middle connector would be setup as a cleanout.  The the slopes for each run coming in either side is 1/4" per foot, but in effect they both slope up from this fitting.  Revit just throws a fit when I try to do it.  In effect, I've resigned myself to just getting the pipe in the right location, but it isn't actually connected to the fitting.

[iainsavage]

The problem is that in the family the branches and main run will be tied to the reference plane so you are asking the family to flex in too many planes at once.

As I said earlier you should be able to set the Allow Slope Adjustment parameter in the connectors in the family so that it will allow the pipes to meet the connectors slightly askew.

Alternatively you would need a custom family in which the branches are angled at the required slope rather than being on the reference plane.

I would also agree with @ToanDN that its not good practice to use double branches on horizontal soil pipes due to risk of cross-flow and the offset arrangement sketched by @ToanDN is a more reliable arrangement. I followed your link to the fitting - I personally would only use that on vertical pipe.

[lee.imbimbo86EM4]

@iainsavage  I looked in both the Family for the Fitting and in the options for setting the fitting or drawing a pipe out of the fitting and I don't see a reference to the "Allow Slope Adjustment" setting that you referenced.  Can you point me in the right direction?

Regarding the fitting selection, it meets horizontally to then very quickly discharge into a long sweeping elbow that directs it down the wall into the main discharge for the house.  the pipe diameter is actually 4".  But admittedly it was my Plumbing Engineer's initial thought that we could use that fitting type.  We could also use a Wye Style Fitting that is more direct, like this one:

LINK:  https://pvcpipesupplies.com/4-double-comb-y-1-8-dwv-fitting-d507-040.html?gclid=Cj0KCQjwy5maBhDdARIs...

[iainsavage · Accepted solution]

There’s a workaround to change the connectors.

Select the connectors, change them to Global. The allow slope adjustments check box will appear. Tick it. Then change the connectors back to Fitting and reload the family into the project.

[lee.imbimbo86EM4]

@iainsavage that did it.  Thank you.