Door doesn't cut joined walls properly

[ahmet.aslan.opm]

Hi Guys,

I have created some door families.

When i use them on layered walls(doesn't matter how many), I don't have any problem. It cuts the geometry very well. Everything looks super nice. (Picture 1)

On the other hand, we don't use layered walls, we model the wall layers separately. When I join the wall layers, the door cut them all but not properly. (Picture 2)

The door frame should also needs to be extended. Does anyone know how to fix that?

(By the way, I don't have a problem with wall thickness. I constrained them to the exterior and interior referance planes.)

[hmunsell]

You will probably need to edit your door family to allow you to modify the Frame Depth and the Frame Offset. 

out of curiosity, why do you model each wall layer separately? why not make the wall type with layers and then use the Parts tool of you need to separate the layers for some reason. 

[barthbradley]

Post your family here and let us look at it.  Then we can tell you exactly how to make it work the way you want it to work.  

[mhiserZFHXS]

@hmunsellhas covered why its not working. The door can only read the thickness of its host. If there are three separate walls, its unable to read that, so the thickness only matches its host wall.

[barthbradley]

Try this method:

Say you have a several Wall Types sandwiched together to make a total Wall Assembly that is 1'-0" thick.  Create a Wall Type that is 1'-0" thick to just host the Door and that Wall Type is sized to the size of the Door.  

That's the gist of it.  Get it?  

[barthbradley · Accepted solution]

Oh, I forgot to mention. The "Door" Wall is embedded into each of the "Sandwich" Walls.  Use Cut Geometry to Embed Walls. 

Door Wall Embedded.png

https://knowledge.autodesk.com/support/revit/learn-explore/caas/CloudHelp/cloudhelp/2020/ENU/Revit-M...

[ahmet.aslan.opm]

''You will probably need to edit your door family to allow you to modify the Frame Depth and the Frame Offset. ''
Yes, i figured out that i can fix it by editting my family. I can add some frame offset parameter. The problem here is I already used many constrain on them, they all attached to each other. And I have created about 12 doors. So it really needs so much effort to fix it. I was hoping maybe there was a different way.

''out of curiosity, why do you model each wall layer separately? why not make the wall type with layers and then use the Parts tool of you need to separate the layers for some reason.''

It is not my decision. This is how it was decided. Both ways have their own advantages and disadvantages. And I couldn't predict that I would face such a problem.

[ahmet.aslan.opm]

Yeah, but isn't it weird that it cut all the seperate walls but only frame doesn't work properly. I mean, at least there could be an option to pick more than one wall as host or joined walls could behave like layered walls.

[barthbradley]

It all about Opening Cut vs. Void Cut. Which one are you using?

[ahmet.aslan.opm]

To be honest I didn't get the point. Thickness is not the issue here. Even if the wall thickness is more than 50cm it still works perfectly, but not working on joined walls.

[barthbradley]

Like I said above, post your family - or better, the Project and Family so we can familiarize ourselves with your methods. Then we can intelligently advise you.  Otherwise, we just throwing out ideas that may or may not land.  That could last days.  😉 

[ahmet.aslan.opm]

I have added one of the doors that i created. You can check it out.

And thank you all so much for your interest. I really appreciate that.

[ahmet.aslan.opm]

In the orignal door family template it was Opening Cut, I also deleted it and used Void Cut but still didn't work.

[barthbradley]

I'm not clear what the issue is. 

In this screenshot, I have your door penetrating through four separate walls - using the approach I recommended above.  From what I understand, that's how your Project's Wall Assemblies are constructed. Each Wall Type represents a layer.  Right?

Door on Host Wall Embedded.png

[ahmet.aslan.opm]

Are they seperated walls? I mean did you create 4 different walls and joined them or is it just one wall with layers?

[barthbradley]

Separate Wall Types.  Joined together or not, makes no difference to the method I'm suggesting. 

Exploded:  

Demo Host Wall.png 

[ahmet.aslan.opm]

''Try this method:



Say you have a several Wall Types sandwiched together to make a total Wall Assembly that is 1'-0" thick. Create a Wall Type that is 1'-0" thick to just host the Door and that Wall Type is sized to the size of the Door.



That's the gist of it. Get it? ''

You mean this method?

If it is. Is it possible for you to explain process a little more in detail?

[barthbradley]

What don't you understand? The embedding part?  I posted a Link above about how to embed Walls.  

Just create a separate a Wall Type that is the thickness of the combined wall thicknesses of all your separate Walls Types - and embed this Wall Type.  This Wall Type will be the one your place your door on.  Size the Wall to the size of the Door and it will automatically be demolished.  

[ahmet.aslan.opm]

I got the point. Tried it out, it is working.
But I have doubt abouts which way is better, editting doors again or using embedded walls. Because there are many different doors and windows in the project. We are gonna use these families again and again on future projects. So maybe editting/re-creating them in correct way( with frame offset/depth) could be better as an permanent solution.

Thank you so much for your help and interest.

[barthbradley]

Well, you either do it the way I described, or you rebuild all your door and window families to work with the way you are modeling.  Your door and window geometry cannot be constrained to host wall faces. They need to be constrained to Ref. Planes that are driven by labeled dimensions.  Then you can control the depth parametrically.    

Personally, I'd opt for a solution that wouldn't necessitate rebuilding every family.  But that's me.