Adaptive Family on line Unwanted Rotation

[halfon.raphael]

Hi,

I've created :

- a generic model (the profile named P)

- nested in an adaptive component family (1 adaptive point orienting my profile Global (Z) then host (XY) named O)

- nested in an adaptive component family (named S)

In S I drew a spline driven by 3 points. I put various profiles along the spline. I want them to be always vertical and perpendicular to the spline in XY. When the 3 points are on the same plane, everything is fine. But when I move one adaptive point so that my curve is non planar, the profiles are not perpendicular to the spline any more.

[barthbradley]

Revit has a tool that can help you troubleshoot. It's called the Diagnostic Tripod, and there are several of them located in the Library's Mass folder.  I use them in situations such as yours when I'm trying to find the best "Orient to" setting for nested elements. 

[ToanDN]

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@halfon.raphael wrote:

Hi,

I've created :

- a generic model (the profile named P)

- nested in an adaptive component family (1 adaptive point orienting my profile Global (Z) then host (XY) named O)

- nested in an adaptive component family (named S)

In S I drew a spline driven by 3 points. I put various profiles along the spline. I want them to be always vertical and perpendicular to the spline in XY. When the 3 points are on the same plane, everything is fine. But when I move one adaptive point so that my curve is non planar, the profiles are not perpendicular to the spline any more.

---

How did you put the profiles along the spline? 

Divide the spline to create nodes, then place a reference point on a node.  Then place a nested profile family on the cross reference plane of a reference point. 

[FAIR59]

I think the placement of the profile-family in the family O is the cause of the problem.

You probably have used the default placement, ie placement on the Ref Level. In an adaptive family the Ref-Level behaves quite quirky, I can't make heads or tails of it.

Open the profile-family, in Family Category and Parameters check Work Plane-Based, and uncheck Always vertical.

Reload into family O.

Replace the profile, using the Place on Workplane option and select the appropriate  reference plane of the adaptive point.

Reload into family S.

[Alfredo_Medina]

@halfon.raphael Instead of placing the profile manually in some 5 or 6 places, divide the spline first, and use a high number of divisions. The more you put the easiest it is for Revit to create transitions of the form when the curve changes direction or elevation.  After creating the repetition, use "Remove Repeater", then immediately use "Create Form".

[halfon.raphael]

Hi,

I need the profiles to always be vertical. But with this method the profiles are perpendicular to the curve.

[halfon.raphael]

Hi,

thank you for your answer, but I'd like to define ONLY a few profiles, because defining them is partly a manual action. So the less definitions, the less time.

[halfon.raphael]

Hi,

thanks for your quick answer.

I attached a plan view of what you said. If I got it right, I get the same result by placing O on a reference plane or face-based". Did you get another result ?

[halfon.raphael]

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@FAIR59 wrote:

I think the placement of the profile-family in the family O is the cause of the problem.

You probably have used the default placement, ie placement on the Ref Level. In an adaptive family the Ref-Level behaves quite quirky, I can't make heads or tails of it.

Open the profile-family, in Family Category and Parameters check Work Plane-Based, and uncheck Always vertical.

Reload into family O.

Replace the profile, using the Place on Workplane option and select the appropriate  reference plane of the adaptive point.

Reload into family S.

---

Hi,

thanks for the answer

This is what I did at first. I double checked and it still doesn't work. Were you able to repeat the problem or did you get another behaviour ?

[halfon.raphael]

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@barthbradley wrote:

Revit has a tool that can help you troubleshoot. It's called the Diagnostic Tripod, and there are several of them located in the Library's Mass folder.  I use them in situations such as yours when I'm trying to find the best "Orient to" setting for nested elements. 

---

Hi,

thanks, very good thing to know!

But I can't find any orientation that fits my geometry with the 1-point-tripod... I think I'm gonna think of another method, maybe with more adaptive points...

[ToanDN]

Do you want something like the below?

[halfon.raphael]

Yes I do!
But then, when I make the extrusion, I'd need it to follow the guide curve. Which means that even if the profiles are far away from one another, the extrusion doesn't "jump" but follows the guide curve.

[halfon.raphael]

Hi @ToanDN,

I tried again with the diagnostic tripod and I still can't find the way... could you please send the example file ?

[FAIR59 · Accepted solution]

As you have discovered, using only 1 family you can have either a vertical profile or a profile perpendicular to the spline.

To find a horizontal line, perpendicular to the spline:

• Make a 1 point adeptive family containing a circle on the horizontal plane of the adeptive point, placement point orients to Host (xyz).
• Make a 1 point adeptive family containing a circle on the horizontal plane of the adeptive point (same radius), placement point orients to Instance (xyz), family property Always vertical checked. 
• Place the 2 families on the same point on the spline, the circle of the first family will be perpendicular to spline, the second will be horizontal.
• Place a reference point on the horizontal circle, click the [ Host Point by Intersection ] button on the option bar,  select the perpendicular circle. The point has now moved to the intersection of both circles, a line between the placement point of the families, and this last point is horizontal and perpendicular to the spline.

[halfon.raphael]

Thank you for the answer. I think I could make it work this way.

[halfon.raphael]

Hi @ToanDN,

is it possible for you to send the example file ? I'm curious about how you make it.

thanks

[Albert.Maduro]

Whoever you are, thank you for your reply, this helped me from my trouble

[onurcan_mizrakQXTQS]

Hi, I have tried the 2 main methods that you mentioned and there is a regeneration error everytime I try to move the adaptive points on the z axis, Solid is very different from just making profiles, can someone please help me on creating that, here is the error and the intended behavior an the other is without the error and correct profile orientation. The profile is a family with one adaptive point with Intance xyz orientation option.

Thank you!

[onurcan_mizrakQXTQS]

Hi, finally figured it out, just needed to redraw the profile in the profile family from the front view and put it on the last point which is the intersection point.