Problem Printing Revit Analysis Visualization Framework Points

[Anonymous]

We develop an add-in (ElumTools) that uses the Revit Analysis Visualization Framework (AVF) to display discrete point-by-point values for the purpose of reporting lighting calculations.  

The AVF displays the results on the screen without any issues. However, we (and our customers) consistently see problems with the AVF results when you go to print (either print to PDF or a physical printer). 

Please see the attached PDF for an idea of the types of problems we see. 

Here are the steps to reproduce in Revit 2016 (although this has been a problem since Revit 2012):

1. Download and install ElumTools 2016 from the Exchange Store or from our website.
2. You can reproduce the problem without licensing the software, but we can provide a license key if desired.
3. Download the example Revit file.
4. Open up the example Revit file.
5. Open the Sheet A3-3rd Floor RCP view.
6. Click “View Results” button on the ElumTools ribbon (the point-by-point results should be shown on screen).
7. Print the sheet using a size A0 sheet size (other sizes may work too).

The challenge is that the problem is not consistently reproducable.  Changing printers, PDF drivers, paper size, views, etc can all cause the problem to appear.  In most cases, simply printing the same sheet/view multiple times is enough to reproduce the issue.

The main issue is why the markers and text look correct on screen, but are clipped when printed to a printer or PDF.

We (and several clients) have contacted Autodesk before about this issue but were quickly rebuffed with the Autodesk representative saying that it is a problem with our Revit addin or with the printer/PDF drivers.

The problem is plainly not caused by our addin because Revit is soley responsible for displaying the points on screen.  Our addin only interfaces with the AVF API.  

The problem occurs on almost every printer we have tried (albeit a rather limited set), Adobe Acrobat Professional PDF printer, and on every free PDF printer we have tried (no less than a half dozen). 

Any ideas about what's going on or any Revit settings to prevent this issue?

Thanks for all your hard work!

Joel Spahn

Software Developer

Lighting Analysts

[Anonymous]

couple of quick thoughts:
1. Have you tried using a colored surface instead of markers?
(I'm wondering if there is z-fighting between the face and the markers which might be more apparent with colored surface)
2. What happens if you try a smaller text size for the text?
(will all print, or do they still get clipped?)
3. What if you don't show all but show every other one
(AVF allows you to specify which points get text, I'm curious is there is a masking thing going on)

On your point, If, basically, all you are doing is using the AVF, I would tend to agree with you that this is not your addin. One thing I seem to remember about this was that there will be z-fighting between AVF and the surfaces in the view. One thing I remember is some discussion around hiding the surface thought I thought that was what AVF was supposed to do though perhaps we were supposed to do it.

[jeremytammik]

Dear Joel,

Thank you for your report and sorry to hear about this issue, and how long you have been struggling with it, and how hard it has been to get Autodesk to take it seriously.

I would like to submit this to the development team for further analysis.

However, a simpler reproducible case would make it much more palatable to them:

http://thebuildingcoder.typepad.com/blog/about-the-author.html#1b

How did you create the sample image in the PDF file '2016-Advanced Sample Project_Print Problem.pdf'?

Was that also using your add-in?

Would it be possible to reproduce the issue in a simpler way with code that can be shared?

Thank you!

Best regards,

Jeremy

[Anonymous]

Hi Jeremy –

Thanks for helping me with this!

I understand having a simple reproducible case is important.  That is why I have provided (minimal and simple) steps to reproduce the issue that should take less than 15 minutes to execute.  The only thing you are missing is the code.

I am happy to provide a working sample add-in which demonstrates the issue.  However, if Autodesk is unable to reproduce the issue, then I would rather not waste time (much more than 15 minutes) writing another working add-in. 

The code my addin uses to generate the AVF points is not very different (if at all) from the examples in these links using the FieldDomainPointsByXYZ class.

http://thebuildingcoder.typepad.com/blog/2013/02/whats-new-in-the-revit-2012-api.html

http://www.slideserve.com/cybil/presenting-your-analysis-data-in-autodesk-revit-architecture-2011

>> How did you create the sample image in the PDF file '2016-Advanced Sample Project_Print Problem.pdf'?  Was that also using your add-in?

By following the 7 step process above (which includes the use of our addin).

Cheers!

- Joel

[Anonymous]

Hi Ken -

Again, the main issue is why the markers and text look correct on screen, but are clipped when printed to a printer or PDF.

Obviously if the text were too large the values would overlap one another, but that is not the case on screen.

Your suggestions are all workarounds which may temporarily avoid the issue, but don't really solve the problem which is displaying/printing the points as desired with reasonable marker and text size.

[Anonymous]

Any more progress on this Jeremy?

[jeremytammik]

Dear Joel,

Thank you for your very valid reminder.

Awfully sorry, I am rather snowed under right now, sitting in a room with twenty people at the Munich Cloud Accelerator:

http://thebuildingcoder.typepad.com/blog/2016/01/devday-conference-in-munich-and-wpf-doevents.html

Submitting a case for you is really high on my list pf priorities!

The BIM programming meeting in Madrid next week is higher still:

http://www.bimprogramming.com

I will not forget, I promise!

And I will let you know as soon as I get around to it.

Thank you for your understanding!

Cheers,

Jeremy

[Aaron.Lu]

Hi Joel,

I tried to reproduce, but got this error, any idea?

Could not show calc points results visibility.

Exception:
Autodesk.Revit.Exceptions.InvalidOperationException: forbidden in view
at Autodesk.Revit.DB.Analysis.SpatialFieldManager.CreateSpatialFieldManager(View view, Int32 numberOfMeasurements)
at ElumTools.ViewResults.GetSpatialFieldManager(View view)
at ElumTools.ViewResults.ShowResults(View view)
at ElumTools.ViewCalculationResultsCommand._Lambda$__205()
at ElumTools.RevitTransactionWrapper.InvokeMethod[T](Object method)
at ElumTools.RevitTransactionWrapper.PerformTransaction[T](Document doc, Object method, String transactionName)
at ElumTools.RevitTransactionWrapper.InvokeTransactionWrapper[T](Document doc, Object method, TransactionWrapper wrapper, String transactionName, String errorMessage)

ElumTools 2016 Release 4 (2016.4.0.3)
RevitAPI (16.0.0.0)
C:\Program Files\Autodesk\Revit 2016\RevitAPI.dll

[Anonymous]

Hi Aaron --

Try selecting the graphical view (i.e. focus in the graphical view rather than the Project Browser, etc) before using the "View Results" command.

FYI  This error is fixed for our upcoming release.  

- Joel

[Aaron.Lu]

unfortunately, still have the same exception even if I focused on the view or selecting title block or viewport in the view.

[Anonymous]

My apologies.  I missed a step.

• Select the "Reflected Ceiling Plan: 03 - Floor view" on sheet "A3 - 3rd Floor RCP".
• Select the ElumTools -- View Results command.
• Select and print the sheet "A3 - 3rd Floor RCP" (or you can probably print the plan view directly as well).

Here's a video showing the steps:

[Anonymous]

Aaron or Jeremy, 

Was anyone able to reproduce this issue after my last post (video showing the steps)?

Thanks!

[jeremytammik]

Dear Joel,

Sorry for the delay and thank you for your patience.

As you probably noticed, I was pretty busy elsewhere:

• DevDay Conference in Munich and WPF DoEvents -- http://thebuildingcoder.typepad.com/blog/2016/01/devday-conference-in-munich-and-wpf-doevents.html
• Tracking Element Modification -- http://thebuildingcoder.typepad.com/blog/2016/01/tracking-element-modification.html
• BIM Programming Madrid and Spanish Connectivity -- http://thebuildingcoder.typepad.com/blog/2016/01/bim-programming-madrid-and-spanish-connectivity.htm...

It is a shame that you are unable to produce a simpler reproducible case, and also that the detailed steps to reproduce the problem are somewhat confusing with the various enhancements and additions.

I hope the development team will get it anyway.

Next time, please simply update the entire set of instructions instead of adding bits and pieces as you have done in this case, because I have to submit the whole set of instructions in one single go.

Thank you!

Anyway, I now finally logged the issue REVIT-85289 [Analysis Visualization Framework Points are cropped when printed -- 11411965] with our development team for this on your behalf as it requires further exploration and possibly a modification to our software. Please make a note of this number for future reference.

You are welcome to request an update on the status of this issue or to provide us with additional information at any time by submitting a new case through DevHelp Online quoting the change request number or this case number.

This issue is important to me. What can I do to help?

This issue needs to be assessed by our engineering team, and prioritised against all of the other outstanding change requests. Any information that you can provide to influence this assessment will help. Please provide the following where possible:

• Impact on your application and/or your development.
• The number of users affected.
• The potential revenue impact to you.
• The potential revenue impact to Autodesk.
• Realistic timescale over which a fix would help you.
• In the case of a request for a new feature or a feature enhancement, please also provide detailed Use cases for the workflows that this change would address.

This information is extremely important. Our engineering team have limited resources, and so must focus their efforts on the highest impact items. We do understand that this will cause you delays and affect your development planning, and we appreciate your cooperation and patience.

Thank you!

Best regards,

Jeremy

[jeremytammik]

Dear Joel,

Thank you again for your patience.

The development team analysed the issue REVIT-85289 [Analysis Visualization Framework Points are cropped when printed -- 11411965] that I raised for you and say:

1. Does the issue occur regardless of print setting? raster/vector processing.
2. I've attached cutepdf.pdf. The results seem to be much better using cutepdf. Also, exporting to DWF results in even better results in this case.
3. It seems to be a print issue.
4. I just printed a few free PDF drivers and then to XPS. The results were OK. I did this in Revit 2016 build 20150109_0715. I also just downloaded Elum tools, so i have the latest version of that.

Joel, have you tried this in the latest builds of Revit? We have been fixing a number of printing issues in the past few months.

Thank you!

Best regards,

Jeremy

[Anonymous]

Jeremy -

Thank you and your team for your effort in investigating this!

1.  Does the issue occur regardless of print setting? raster/vector processing.

Yes.  Furthermore the presence of AVF markers/text seems to always cause the print to be raster (see attached Raster Printing Message.png).  The message appears when vector processing is selected and also AVF markers and text are visible.  Selecting raster processing (see attached Print Dialogs.png) causes the message not to appear.  Also, hiding the AVF markers/text causes the message not to appear.

2.  I've attached cutepdf.pdf. The results seem to be much better using cutepdf. Also, exporting to DWF results in even better results in this case.

This morning I installed Revit 2016 R2 U1 (i.e. Revit 2016 build 20151209_0715) and generated the attached PDFs.

After doing so there were no changes in the results (i.e. there are clipped text values in all the attached PDFs).

Changing the page size, can affect which text is clipped.  Perhaps you can try CutePDF with both Tabloid and ArchE paper sizes.

3.  It seems to be a print issue.

By "print issue" I assume you mean "third party printer driver issue".  I would add that the issue only occurs when AVF markers/text are printed.  The factor here is AVF.  This issue does not occur with normal Revit text, lines, etc.  If it did, and even if it were due to third party printer drivers, Revit printing would be unusable, just as unusable as printing results from our add-in which makes use of AVF.

4.  I just printed a few free PDF drivers and then to XPS. The results were OK. I did this in Revit 2016 build 20150109_0715. I also just downloaded Elum tools, so i have the latest version of that.

See the answer to (2) above.

Thanks again!  Cheers!

[jeremytammik]

Dear Joel,

Did you see my previous reply to this issue?

I posted it a day before your last message.

Your last message does not make any refernece to it at all.

After analysing in depth the issue REVIT-85289 [Analysis Visualization Framework Points are cropped when printed -- 11411965] that I raised for you, the development team no closed it as 'Cannot Reproduce' and say:

Closing as cannot reproduce, printing to XPS and multiple PDF drivers all resulted in OK plots using the latest build of Revit 2016 and the latest update of elum tools.

I hope that the issue is resolved from your point of view as well.

If not, I would suggest that we start a new case, a new discussion thread, a new reproducible sample and raise a new issue for it from scratch to avoid confusion.

Even just this thread alone has had a couple of unnecessary twists and turns and back and forth that we can hpefully avoid in future.

Thank you!

Best regards,

Jeremy

[TAllenT75DB]

This is still an issue with printing sheets with point visible in Revit 2023. The point show up on screen view okay but have issues when printing/ creating PDF's.