Electrical Hangers and Hardware

[TBridgeG488B]

When creating electrical hanger families, what category would be best.

Same question for hardware. Strut, strut brackets, nuts, bolts and other hardware used to build electrical prefab assemblies.

Generic models become half tone under the Electrical discipline.

So should these be Electrical Fixtures, or Pipe Accessories?

The other electrical categories do not see appropriate.

Pipe Accessories are not an electrical category, but it seems to be the appropriate category.

What do you guys think?

[smbrennan]

I’ve opted to use Generic Models for our hanger components. I found that structural type families were not showing me what I wanted to see based on my view range, and I didn’t want to change my view range (I believe it was the cut plane? ) in order to see our traps, but sacrifice seeing the door swings. 

There is one thing to keep in mind though. Generic models are architectural families. If your view disciplines are electrical you can’t select them. I use coordination for my view disciplines. 

[timlove]

We opted for the same open as Shawn's office and use generic models and use the coordination view discipline when showing them.  It was a toss-up between generic and specialty equipment.

We also have object styles for strut and and hangers to give us the ability to turn on and off selected types of generic models as you can end up with so many of them; clearances, penetrations, and such things.

[djforemandesign]

I always used Pipe Accessories. 

I did start using Specialty Equipment, but changed because of all the headaches that category caused with visibility in views. 

I have attached a screenshot of an example at the bottom. I created a quick hanger family that is strut with two rods going up. Then made this hanger three families of different types (Specialty Equipment, Pipe Accessories, Generic Models). 

The multiple views are the different view Disciplines. You can see how they all show the hangers differently. The reason Specialty Equipment doesn't show up is because the view range cuts off before the end of the rod. I always cut my views off before they get into the 2nd floor slab. Since all the hangers are in the floor so that doesn't allow them to show up. You may do things differently just telling you my reasoning. Below you can see a 3D view and the view range settings (These are the same for each view).

***You also mention modeling nuts, bolts, strut straps, etc. I obviously don't know what you are wanting to do, but my advice is don't detail out all your families with nuts/bolts/etc. 

If you are wanting to get a count for prefab/ordering you can add the data to the family and have schedules total things up. 

Adding more detail is going to eventually cause performance issues in your model. This won't happen with a small number of elements. I'm talking large jobs. Also it will depend on your computer.  In all fairness data/formulas in families will eventually cause performance issues (with a lot of calculations). 

I know everyone is pushing for details, but I've found the data in the family more powerful than the 3D model.

[apjones]

Okay, dumb structural guy question here, but why couldn't you create a new sub-category under Electrical Equipment called "Supports" or something similar.  Would that solve the issues? 

[smbrennan]

There could be several reason why someone doesn't want to.

For instance, there are categories that add parameters to families. Electrical equipment brings on these parameters:

Which really have no place for something like Hangers. 

Then there's dealing with visibility. As a previous poster said, some categories don't work with view ranges as nicely as others. I've found the 'Generic Models' is a good "catch all" for families like trapezes, penetrations (since I can't make voids in walls/slabs in a linked model), and a couple of other odds and ends. On the plus side, you don't get any "bloat" because of unnecessary parameters. 

[djforemandesign]

@apjones 

Unfortunately Revit doesn't allow you to create a custom Family Category. At least not yet.  So any family you make you have to choose from a list.

[smbrennan]

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@djforemandesign wrote:

Unfortunately Revit doesn't allow you to create a custom Family Category. At least not yet.  So any family you make you have to choose from a list.

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To be fair, he did say sub-category. 

[timlove]

Pipe Accessory seems like a good option for a lot of things.  I'm just electrical so it is something completely unused for me that I could use in a different way.

When you grab Electrical Equipment or Electrical Fixtures Revit tracks all of them for connections and other information.  It will cause the model to slow down much faster than just using Generic models with a object styles (fyi. object styles when applied to 3D elements creates a "sub category")

[djforemandesign]

That's one of the reasons I always used Pipe Accessories. It doesn't really go with anything at least for me.

I haven't really used Object Styles, but I see what you mean now.

My apologies for the misunderstanding @apjones 

I was thinking about sub categories in the 'Family Category' selector.

You can't schedule by Object Style sub-categories can you? 

[smbrennan]

You can not schedule sub categories, at least not natively without API/Dynamo (and to that I'm not sure what's possible). 

I heavily rely on Description and Type Comments for my filters with all of my 'Generic Model' families. 

[timlove]

You can grab the Category and SubCategories with the API, I don't know if you can use that to create a schedule in Revit though.  I find it much easier to use some Shared Parameters to keep track of all of that information.  We use "Classification" and "Name" all the time so we can have useful information.

For something like hangers you can have a Class of "Support" and then use Names like "2" Hanger" "3 hanger 7/8" Back to back" and know what materials you need for everything.  We also have Length and support length as parameters that can be scheduled and totaled up for ordering estimates.   Using the API I will usually populate a custom level parameter and then be able to make a materials list of what needs to be packaged together to be taken to each level of a building. 

[djforemandesign]

Thanks. 

[TBridgeG488B]

I am using Conduit Fitting with sub categories for Strut and Hardware.

I create sub categories and will put the strut and strut fittings under Strut and the Nuts and Bolts under Hardware.

I am modeling to this detail for electrical prefab drawings and not on the coordination drawings.

I detail out only certain pieces for prefab.

I don't know Dynamo or any other API stuff.

I taught myself how to build families and am trying to use best practices, but I am finding them out slowly and by trial and error.

[alaa.farhat]

Hey everyone,

I've been trying—quite tirelessly—to create a Dynamo script
that can automatically place hangers in any model I work with.

I’ve explored different tools and approaches, but I haven’t been able to achieve the results I’m aiming for.

Could someone point me in the right direction or suggest where I should start looking?

Thanks in advance!