Window Family - problematic display in floorplan

[mlXLKPS]

Hi, I would like to ask for your help with an issue I am facing with my custom made Window Family and its florplan display. I am currently working on window families, that have quite high level of detail (user requirement). I am using nested families for frame a casements. It works good, exccept for the families, that have casements above each other. For example:

The problem is, that this kind of window should be displayed in floorplan in this way - screens are from RVT project file (no middle verical frame element, no upper casements):

But instead of that, it looks like this (middle vertical frame element, upper casements - the elements that are not insterserting the horizontal cut plane):

Please note that I made myself sure that the horizontal cutplane is set in correct position. I went through a lot of forums posts and tried some solutions for this isuue (but unfortunatelly unsuccessfuly).

I think that the problem might be in a use of nested families. Most frequent solution for this issue is to have the cutplane of nested families set correctly (so that in the nested family floorplan view, i see the frame and casements in the way I want). This is the solution that I applied:

Casement nested family floorplan and 3D view:

Frame nested Family floorplan and 3D view:

When the nested family are inserted into the "final" family, the floorplan display is still okay (it is displayed exactly like it should be, in the place where the horinzontal cutplane is intersecting the geometry):

It seems that the problem appears, when the "final" family is inserted into the project. Please, does anybody know what causes this issue and how to solve it? I went through many articles and discussions and so far no luck. I will be very grateful for the answer.

Of course, there is the possiblity of drawing 2D regions and "manually override" the grahic, but I would like to avoid that.

I am sorry for not attaching the family, but unfortunatelly I did not obtain permission to share the files. I will of course provide any additional info and screenshots when needed.

Many thanks for your help!

[RDAOU]

@mlXLKPS 

What you have shown in the above image from your OP are the either the detail components or symbolic lines used for swing direction .. there are several ways to solve that based on the approach you used in modeling that family and the categories used. Example:

Option 1: If the Detail components are in the Nested Window Panels, make those panels shared

Option 2: Treat the detail components as a separate nested component

1. model the detail components as a separate window family
   • Work Plane based
   • set detail line and regions to show only if family is cut
2. Nest into the main window and host each on a different work plane
   • One at the ref plane of the Sill
     • 
   • and the second above the transom mullion
     • 
3. Load into project and overwrite existing 

See GIF below and notice the different detail components at different cut plane height offset (Test family also attached)

PS: : - Not sharing your family will not really serve you any good so tell whoever is supposed to give you permission to attach it, it is just a window family! there are 100s of them online for free. 

[mlXLKPS]

Hi, thank you for your answer. I appreciate that. Unfortunatelly, I am not sure if you understand my problem. The detail components are just part of the nested family (I mean the casement arc). I think that we might actually ignore those in this moment). What I need is to generate the floorplan symbol (mainly the profiles of frame and casement) directly from the 3D model. In other words, i would need to see these elements displayed in floorplan exactly like the horizontal cuplane is intersecting them:

But, I am getting these elements despite i should not (1-middle frame profile, 2- upper casements):

But in the Family editor, it works like it should and I do not understand why.

The nested Families are modelled as sweeps with profiles.  I read somewhere, that this may cause the problems, but I was not able to find any further info.

Regarding the upload issue - I realize that it is not doing any good (believe me, I am reading through this forum a lot), but I am unfortunately not able to do anything about it.

Thanks for your help

[mlXLKPS]

I am sorry, I see you added some informations meanwhile if was writign the reply. Thank you for the solution. I think its pretty good, but I would like to try generating the floorplan symbol directly from the geometry. In case that it will not be possible, this is the solution that i will consider.

Thanks

[RDAOU]

@mlXLKPS 

If I understood you right, I believe that Symbolic lines placed directly in the host window family cannot achieve what you are asking for...I would be better if one may have a look at the family you modeled.

For the 3D geometry from the family to show, then you will need to do a couple of things

1. Remove any masking regions and unnecessary detail lines from the nested detail component
2. You need to adjust the cut plane of the window in the family editor.
   • Inserts (Doors and windows) have a different cut plane than that of the view in the main Model (ie: while the cut plane in the model may be at 1200mm or 4' from FFL, the window cut plane as set in the editor may be at 2000mm or 6.5')
   • to adjust the cut plane of the window/door, you need to select the Ref View in the project browser (Family Editor) and edit its view range
3. If you want the changing symbol at different cut planes in the main model
   • Either use shared nested Window Panels
   • Or the use Nested Detail Components hosted at different elevations as per previous reply

[mlXLKPS]

Hi, thanks you for your reply. I tried to maked nested families shared (though I woud prefer to not use shared families as I do not want to flood the project browser and cause potential clashes between nested families of different window families), but it does not seems to be solving the issue. These are the results I am getting (in project file):

(in the last one the middle frame is missing)

Regarding the cutplane settings of nested families, i believe it is set propperly:

- the window casement:

- frame:

Or should be the cutplane settings of nested families different? According to the theory i read it should be set in a way that the nested family floorplan view is showing the component in the way you need to see it in the project.

Anyways, I will ask for the permission to upload the family one more time a mabe I will be able to upload the family next week.

Thanks for your help

[mlXLKPS]

Hello, sorry for the long delay, but finally, I have the family ready for upload. Could we please revieve the topic.

@RDAOU would please have a look on the family?

Many thanks!

[RDAOU]

@mlXLKPS 

Not encouraging!! First thing on Load and Place is the following error. You should go through previous replies. None of what was recommended previously is in the last family you attached so I am not sure what to check.

Maybe someone else will have a take at it

[mlXLKPS]

Hi @RDAOU,

thank you very much for your reply. I am sorry for the error message. I am not getting any errors when I am loading and placing the family. If I would be getting any error messages, I would not be uploading the family, of course. If you could be more specific about the issue (what is the highlited element? what part of the window is deleted?), I will fix the family, so its not showing any error for you.

Regarding the previously discussed issue:

• in post 2, i think we did not fully understand each other; making nested detail component is a possibility, but I would really prefer to generate floorplan symbol directly by the 3D geometry. Of course, if all other possibilites will fail, I will use this solution. Regarding making the nested fmaily as shared, I do no prefer to do so, as I do not find convinient to fill project browser with shared families (at the end, I will be having 40 or 50+ families that can appear in the same project. Besides, making the nested families as shared is not working for me (see the attached family).
• in post 5, you recommended me to:
  
  • remove any masking regions and unnecessary lines (done)
  • adjust cutplanes  (i believe it is done, but i might not be right - this is for sure topic to check)
  • use shared panels or nested detail componenes - i described my point of view about these solutions above

What I would like to emphasize is that my main concern the floorplan symbol generated by the panel and frame profiles. I do not get why the family looks different in the project and in the family editor:

Project (rvt)

Family editor (rfa)

This issue is decribed in greater detail in post 6. The main questions I have and I need to resolve are those:

1. why the family (floorplan view) looks different in rvt file when placed and in family editor?
2. what difference I can make in the family or nested families in order to prevent this issue?

Many thanks for your help!

[RDAOU]

@mlXLKPS 

I told you previously you cannot... it is a family behavior . Windows and doors have their own view rang which is indepen from that of the view. Therefore was the suggestion to treat the nested 2D components separate from the nested windows. 

They would both be in the dame parent window just a different modeling technique.

Same way you would nest a shared cuttable family into a non cuttable one to make the latter appear as if it is cut!