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Wall join problem with phasing and design options

Anonymous

Wall join problem with phasing and design options

Anonymous
Not applicable

I have this problem on every new project I start. I do all residential design and a lot of remodel type work. I continue to have the exact same problem when trying to use early stage design options to show different possible schematic designs based off existing geometry. I model the existing walls. I then add them to an option set. In my latest iteration I just added the entire building to the option set because I wanted to eliminate the possibility of an issue caused by certain elements being outside the set. The building couldn't be simpler, it's just a rectangle, and I want to demolish one wall on one end, and extend that end by 6'. I'm finally turning to the forum because in the past I always assumed there was something more complicated in my model causing the issue, but this time around it's too simple and it's repeatable. 

 

When I draw the new construction walls and connect them to the existing walls, they jump back and show a gap between them. I can clean up the join using the wall join tool in one phase if I want, but it will ruin the same join in the other phase. I cannot figure out any way to have it look the way it will be built in real life in both the existing view and the new construction view. 

 

Now that I write out the post I realize it doesn't necessarily matter if I have a design option or not. I generally do but the phasing is the real issue. Can anyone explain what is going on here?

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barthbradley
Consultant
Consultant

Have you Disallowed Auto Join? 

 

...Joining DO Walls with walls outside the DO can't be done, if that's what you're asking about.  

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Anonymous
Not applicable

No I haven't tried that. Do you think that would allow me to have different join conditions from one phase to the other. I'll try it right now.

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Anonymous
Not applicable

I tried disallow join and I don't think it helps with the problem. I am doing a fresh experiment right now, new project, no design options.

The fundamental problem is this: I have an existing corner. I want to demolish one side of the corner and build a new construction wall straight off the other wall. In other words, what was previously a corner is now an existing wall transitioning into a new construction wall. In the real world this is a situation that occurs on almost every single remodel, I'm just trying to make a room bigger.

 

The work around I always end up using is to just demolish the entire corner and build a new one but this is a bad solution because it then negates all the benefit of using phasing in the first place. I want the model to look the way it will be built in the field.

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Anonymous
Not applicable
Accepted solution

Ok, so not the most active thread, but I did figure this out. I know there are a number of threads out there related to this topic so I'll just share my solution in case anyone is making the same mistake I was.

 

I was trying to manipulate the wall joins but the trick, as was pointed out above, was to disallow the join. But you have to do it in a particular order for it to work right. You want the existing walls to join, so you need to leave that wall join the way it is. After you demolish the wall that will be removed, you create the new construction wall but don't drag it all the way to the end of the existing wall right away. Select the wall end using the wall join tool, and disallow join for just that end specifically. That's what causes it to jump to a different location than where you try to place it. Once you have disallowed that particular join you can drag it to meet the end of the existing wall and it will stay there. Good luck!

barthbradley
Consultant
Consultant

TMI. Basically what you are saying is that Disallow Join solved your issue.  You're welcome.  

 

 

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stephenjthomasdesign
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

I've had this exact same problem in the past and played around with disallow joint with no luck.  To know that there is a certain order to do this in so it works is the actual solution.  Time for me to revisit this as I have the same scenario in my current project.  

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stephenjthomasdesign
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

Success!  Thank you to the OP for TMI, my walls are now perfectly joined across phases 🙂

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barthbradley
Consultant
Consultant

@stephenjthomasdesign wrote:

To know that there is a certain order to do this in so it works is the actual solution.  


Huh? I don't know what you mean when you say that there is a "certain order" to disallow join so that it works correctly.

 

All that needs to be done is disallow auto join, adjust the ends of the walls so they align correctly and then use Join Geometry to hide the visible edges between walls.  That's it.  No finessing required.    

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stephenjthomasdesign
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

For your solution to be helpful the "TMI" of the OP was what was required for a novice like me to get this to work.  As I said, I've played around with disallow join in the past and could not get it to work in the way I needed.  Walls kept snapping back to where they were as soon as I tried to move them after disallowing the join.  Moving the ends out of the join and then disallowing the join on the wall end in question allowed me to move it back where it needed to be without re-initiating the join.  You obviously have the experience and knowledge of how this all works, and I've got a lot better idea of it now myself, but what you state as "TMI" can help us who are still relatively new to the program.  

charles.wermers
Contributor
Contributor

Not true, it work sometimes

 

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