Trimming By Curved Boundaries (Ship Application)

[Anonymous]

Hello Revit Community,

Recently at work I have been tasked with creating the accommodation deck within a ship. This poses some obstacles that I can't seem to find tutorials on how to work around. My plan was to model the structural boundaries within Rhino 3D and then import into Revit to then generate the outfitted accommodations (joiner bulkheads, doors, windows, etc...). I am currently having trouble setting up my Revit project to have the decks as boundaries as they are curved with both shear and camber. Here are some screenshots of what I have so far:

Is it possible to trim joiner bulkhead by a curved surface? Is Revit the correct program for this type of task?

If anyone has any advice on my task or can point me in the direction of some good tutorials I would be greatly appreciative.

Braden

[ToanDN]

You can create a Roof by face from the curve surface and attached the top of the walls below (as you show in your second pic) to it.

[Anonymous]

How do you attach a wall so that it follows the curvature of the roof?

[ToanDN]

Select the walls, click Attach top/base button, select the roof.

[Anonymous]

I can't seem to select my rhino surface that was imported when using the Roof by Face command. I believe it has to do with something I may not be doing during the import CAD process. Here are the properties of the surface:

[ToanDN]

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@Anonymous wrote:

I can't seem to select my rhino surface that was imported when using the Roof by Face command. I believe it has to do with something I may not be doing during the import CAD process. Here are the properties of the surface:

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Oh you have to create an in-place Mass and import the Rhino in the Mass.  

[Anonymous]

That worked! I'm now trying to assign both upper and lower decks as boundaries (they are masses) although the lower deck is able to use the "Roof by Face" command on, the upper deck is unable to be selected for either the "Roof by Face" command and or the "Floor by Face" command. Here is what I have so far:
And here is the prompt I am met with when I import the Rhino surface within the "In-Place Mass" process:

Are you experienced enough in Rhino to give me some input on how to avoid this prompt?

Thanks so much for your help thus far.

[ToanDN]

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@Anonymous wrote:

That worked! I'm now trying to assign both upper and lower decks as boundaries (they are masses) although the lower deck is able to use the "Roof by Face" command on, the upper deck is unable to be selected for either the "Roof by Face" command and or the "Floor by Face" command. Here is what I have so far:
And here is the prompt I am met with when I import the Rhino surface within the "In-Place Mass" process:

Are you experienced enough in Rhino to give me some input on how to avoid this prompt?

Thanks so much for your help thus far.

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Ignore the warning because you don't need to compute any of the listed items.  The meaning of it is that Revit, by default, expects a Mass to be a sully enclosed 3D volume in order to slice Mass Floors.  You need none of that.

For what you are doing, do not use Floor by Face, use either Roof or Wall by Face.  It's hard to tell why you cannot create a roof for the upper deck.  Did you try to create one by one or multiple roofs at a time?  Try finish one roof then move on the other.

[Anonymous]

I still can't seem to make the surface a roof/wall. Are you aware of any limitations in Revit regarding surface complexity (double curvature within the surface)? I can't select the surface when trying to create these masses "by face". Here is what I have:

The lower deck I had no trouble with as I think it has to do with only having curvature in one direction. If you have any input on why I may not be able to select the singular surface during these commands I'd love to read it.

Thanks again for your help thus far!

[ToanDN]

Revit sure has some limitation when come to things like this.  Can you share the file?

[Anonymous]

Sure thing. Here is the Revit file I'm using.

[ToanDN]

I can only create a roof for 1/2 of the form by export it to a SAT and link it back.  I think you need to split the NURBS form to 2 or more pieces in Rhino and try again.

[Anonymous]

Seems like a very strange limitation to me. What are your thoughts on it? Fortunately, my supervisor just wants to see if this program would be beneficial to use within our office when updating technical data on the fleet. These bugs make me hesitant to want to implement this software.

[ToanDN]

My thoughts? I would not use Revit if I could not build things natively in Revit. With that said, the forms you show can be built directly in Revit conceptual mass. They may not be exact but can be close enough.

[cbcarch]

Perhaps it could be generated in Revit--

But I'm not so sure, if it is actually for a ship? It would be crucial to have the 3D geometry exactly as the ship manufacturer has laid it out, so the fit-out will align perfectly with the decks and hull/etc.

To the OP--is this indeed the case? Did you get a Rhino file from the ship mfr'. or owner?

[Anonymous]

We generated our own hull model/decks in our office based on the old original offsets (from a few decades ago...) and are working on ways to modernize the refit process using various architectural softwares like Revit. We have all the information required to generate an accurate model of the current deck (structure, outfitting, etc...). 

[cbcarch]

I think that starting fresh in Revit, using Massing and converting faces can work. But a ship is quite a different animal than a building--as there are dynamic forces in play, etc.

FWIW--I have done a few projects involving ships in the past--working with Coast Guard officials, shipbuilder/shipyards. On one such project, we cut a existing ship in half, welded in a center section, to maximize the fit-out of slot machines, table games and other amentities for a water-based moving casino! The fit-out was completed as the ship was driven from Mobile, AL to St. Louis, MO up the Mississippi River. That job was pre-Revit, and 2D Cad in combination with hand-drafting was used. All of the terminology is for building systems is different--stanchions, bulkheads, etc.

Good luck with it--I think Revit could work. It has some string advantages being a BIM platform.

[Anonymous]

I believe the upper deck is now correctly made into a mass. Can you check out this file and give me input on why the wall won't attach it's top to the deck?

[cbcarch]

-Can't Attach a Wall to a Wall--the upper deck is a Wall. For some reason, the upper deck will create Wall by Face, but  Not Roof by Face? Maybe the thickness of the roof needs to be thinner for it to resolve geometry?

-It needs to be a roof, then the vertical wall will attach to it.

-I could not get a Roof by Face to work on the upper deck Mass.

-Try editing the Mass of the upper deck, check joins at arcs, etc. Then see if Roof by Face will work.

[ToanDN]

See attached file. reveal the hidden geometry see how I did it.  It is sort of an unconventional way but it can be done.