Stair path arrow is incorrect when not using "End with Riser"

[joseph.scherer]

When a stair run element ends in a tread (i.e. it's not set to "end with riser"), the stair path annotation shows the arrow going past the last riser to the edge of the tread. Since Revit always shows the lines defining the edges of elements (unless you manually hide it per-view), this means in plan it looks like the stair has an extra riser (the line between, for example, the stair tread and the adjacent floor element, even though these surfaces are coplanar.)

I know that I can force Revit to show the stair arrow correctly by having my stair end with a riser, but (a) in most cases that isn't how stairs are built and (b) this will result in an inaccurate section because the edge of the adjacent floor element will not show a nosing.

Is there any way - short of faking it - to make it so that Revit draws the stair path correctly, i.e. only showing the arrow to the last riser of a stair that ends on a tread?

[barthbradley]

I don't know if I'm following. Are we talking about the Auto Up/Down Direction Annotation Arrow which is based on the Cut Plane of the View?  

Stair DOWN Arrow seems to start at the point where the Stair goes DOWN.  Makes sense to me.  

..and the UP Arrow seems to end at the point where the stairs stop going UP.

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[joseph.scherer]

Yes, but in confirming I understood the clarification you're asking for, I uncovered that a fresh file (with the same view range/cut plane settings) doesn't have the same problem. So now I'm wondering if there's a setting or something odd about the family. Any ideas on what might cause this difference in how the arrow extent is displayed? See attached screenshots. The one with the green check marks is a clean, fresh file showing the same stair, but with one set to end in a riser and one in a tread. The arrow goes the same distance, which is correct. The second screenshot is part of an enlarged plan from the drawings I'm working on with one of the stairs that ends on a tread - but the arrow incorrectly goes to the end of the tread instead of the nosing of that top tread. We have two stairs (different types!) in this project that end on a tread and both show the arrow going too far like this.

[barthbradley]

the "improper" one is a screenshot taken in Edit Mode.  That's a completely different thing.  That's the Stair Arrow and it must be the entire length, or you can't close out of edit mode.  

Regarding the annotation ("proper"), that's controlled via the View Range Cut Plane.  Many times, we enclose the stairs with a Plan Region so that we can use different View Range Settings for the Stairs in a View.  

[joseph.scherer]

That screenshot is not in edit mode. 

[barthbradley]

No? My Bad.

So, you are trying to understand that arrow behavior?  Post the file so we can examine.  

[ToanDN]

The 'improper' one looks proper to me.  You clearly have 4 steps and the path extends exactly those.  If you would tick end with riser then you will have one more tread but the path stays the same because the number of steps don't change for the stair to reach the designated height.

[joseph.scherer]

Hopefully 3d (see capture.png) will help clarify, because I think you're misreading the plan in my "improper.png" attachment as a result of the exact problem I'm describing. The behavior shown in my "proper" post does not match the "improper" image - that arrow is one tread longer than it should be because the top tread in that image is at the top elevation of the stair, not 1 riser down from it. In the "proper" behavior post (and barthbradley's response), you can see the arrow correctly stops at the top riser when the stair ends in a tread, not after the tread.

"If you would tick end with riser then you will have one more tread"

This doesn't match Revit's behavior. Ticking 'end with riser' doesn't add a tread to a stair; it removes the last tread while retaining the (last) riser that gets you to the top elevation.

I'm not sure what you mean by "4 stairs", since that leaves tread and riser counts ambiguous. I need (and have) 4 risers. Ignoring the graphical consequences (which I'm trying to solve), the number of treads in that situation can be either 3 or 4, depending on whether I have "end with riser" checked or not; either would have me at the correct top elevation. The problem is that in my project file, when I uncheck "end with riser", Revit is drawing the stair arrow as though the last tread has a riser after it, rather than stopping it at the last riser.

[ToanDN]

Can you select the stair itself, NOT the run, and show its properties?

[joseph.scherer]

Sure - and thanks (2x and counting) for being so responsive. See attached.

I also realized (I'm still trying to figure this out myself) that I missed a key detail in assessing my test results vs. barthbradley's earlier, and that I wasn't successfully recreating their results. I can get the same (correct) result with UP arrows, but can't get DOWN arrows to work (i.e. start from the first riser rather than an at-floor-level tread) - neither in my real project file nor in my test file. In this test (test2.png), I have two stairs going up to an elevation of 2', with the only difference that the one on the right has "end with riser." The down arrow for the left stair is, to my understanding, "starting" at the tread instead of where it should be, i.e. at the riser. What I am hoping for is what barthbradly described: "Stair DOWN Arrow seems to start at the point where the Stair goes DOWN." I'm getting the down arrow starting before the stair actually starts to descend.

[ToanDN · Accepted solution]

See if this explain it to you.