Scheduling Profile-driven Elements & Exterior Finishes in One Schedule?

[jstipanovich]

Backstory:  My firm is accustomed to documenting exterior finishes using Generic Annotations and Note Blocks.  My goal is to embed finish parameters into the model elements to make this smarter and more automated.

I created custom Shared Project Parameters for Materials and applied those materials to my model elements and used a material takeoff to schedule them.  This worked great, however I quickly discovered that material takeoffs do not schedule objects driven by profiles such as sweeps, facias, gutters, etc.  So it seems in order to capture those elements, they must all be scheduled separately.  This is not a practical solution from a documentation perspective.  Also, we've discovered the Revit bug which causes Material tags to inexplicably lose their associations when tagging layered assemblies in elevation.

So I figured I would instead apply the Shared Project Parameters to walls, wall sweeps, facias, gutters, etc. and use a Multi-Category Schedule to capture just those parameters.  But none of the parameters I create are available as Fields to add to the schedule. (Shared parameters I've created for Doors are available.  So, maybe they only work with loadable families?  But that doesn't make sense.)

Does anyone know how to capture all of the elements that material takeoffs do not, and display them in a SINGLE schedule with custom shared parameters?

Or is Generic Annotations and Note Blocks my only option for scheduling this info in one schedule?

Attached references:  Custom Material parameters and resulting schedule

[jstipanovich]

Backstory:  My firm is accustomed to documenting exterior finishes using Generic Annotations and Note Blocks.  My goal is to embed finish parameters into the model elements to make this smarter and more automated.

I created custom Shared Project Parameters for Materials and applied those materials to my model elements and used a material takeoff to schedule them.  This worked great, however I quickly discovered that material takeoffs do not schedule objects driven by profiles such as sweeps, facias, gutters, etc.  So it seems in order to capture those elements, they must all be scheduled separately.  This is not a practical solution from a documentation perspective.  Also, we've discovered the Revit bug which causes Material tags to inexplicably lose their associations when tagging layered assemblies in elevation.

So I figured I would instead apply the Shared Project Parameters to walls, wall sweeps, facias, gutters, etc. and use a Multi-Category Schedule to capture just those parameters.  But none of the parameters I create are available as Fields to add to the schedule. (Shared parameters I've created for Doors are available.  So, maybe they only work with loadable families?  But that doesn't make sense.)

Does anyone know how to capture all of the elements that material takeoffs do not, and display them in a SINGLE schedule with custom shared parameters?

Or is Generic Annotations and Note Blocks my only option for scheduling this info in one schedule?

Attached references:  Custom Material parameters and resulting schedule

[ToanDN]

Create parts and schedule parts.

[ToanDN]

Create parts and schedule parts.

[jstipanovich]

Thank you.

That works for sweeps, gutters, soffits, and most facias, however curtain walls, mullions, and railings can't be broken into parts.

Also it seems that once Create Parts is applied to one of these elements, Show Parts gets locked into the view settings.  Not sure if that could ultimately be problematic.

[jstipanovich]

Thank you.

That works for sweeps, gutters, soffits, and most facias, however curtain walls, mullions, and railings can't be broken into parts.

Also it seems that once Create Parts is applied to one of these elements, Show Parts gets locked into the view settings.  Not sure if that could ultimately be problematic.

[barthbradley]

So, the bottom-line issue is that you can't pull all this data in one Schedule?   

[barthbradley]

So, the bottom-line issue is that you can't pull all this data in one Schedule?   

[jstipanovich]

I suppose that's the gist of it.  Mind you if it was completely up to me, I would just tag the elements and let the specifications define the rest.

I guess I could have a material takeoff schedule defining everything except sweeps, gutters, facias, and soffits and schedule those with a Parts schedule.  So then I'd be looking at a wall schedule for curtain wall elements, a material take off schedule defining materials in layered assemblies, and the parts schedule. 

Railings, if applicable, would be another.  I would love to whittle this down to 2 schedules max.  But, I don't think I can get our staff to compromise on scheduling curtain wall finishes.

I used to love Revit but BIM Management is slowly making me hate it.  

[jstipanovich]

I suppose that's the gist of it.  Mind you if it was completely up to me, I would just tag the elements and let the specifications define the rest.

I guess I could have a material takeoff schedule defining everything except sweeps, gutters, facias, and soffits and schedule those with a Parts schedule.  So then I'd be looking at a wall schedule for curtain wall elements, a material take off schedule defining materials in layered assemblies, and the parts schedule. 

Railings, if applicable, would be another.  I would love to whittle this down to 2 schedules max.  But, I don't think I can get our staff to compromise on scheduling curtain wall finishes.

I used to love Revit but BIM Management is slowly making me hate it.  

[ToanDN · Accepted solution]

---

@jstipanovich wrote:

Thank you.

That works for sweeps, gutters, soffits, and most facias, however curtain walls, mullions, and railings can't be broken into parts.

Use a combination of Parts schedule and category specific schedules, or a multi-category schedule.

Also it seems that once Create Parts is applied to one of these elements, Show Parts gets locked into the view settings.  Not sure if that could ultimately be problematic.

No issues.  Show Parts does not get locked to anything.  You can set any view to Show Parts or Show originals or Show both.  That also does not affect any schedules.

---

[ToanDN · Accepted solution]

---

@jstipanovich wrote:

Thank you.

That works for sweeps, gutters, soffits, and most facias, however curtain walls, mullions, and railings can't be broken into parts.

Use a combination of Parts schedule and category specific schedules, or a multi-category schedule.

Also it seems that once Create Parts is applied to one of these elements, Show Parts gets locked into the view settings.  Not sure if that could ultimately be problematic.

No issues.  Show Parts does not get locked to anything.  You can set any view to Show Parts or Show originals or Show both.  That also does not affect any schedules.

---

[jstipanovich]

@ToanDN wrote:

Use a combination of Parts schedule and category specific schedules, or a multi-category schedule.

A material takeoff can't be combined with Parts as a multi-category schedule.  

So I think you're suggestion is to assign the parameters only to the Parts category only and don't embed them into Materials at all.  Then I could create a multi-category schedule with parts, walls, railings etc.

I'll give that a try.

[jstipanovich]

@ToanDN wrote:

Use a combination of Parts schedule and category specific schedules, or a multi-category schedule.

A material takeoff can't be combined with Parts as a multi-category schedule.  

So I think you're suggestion is to assign the parameters only to the Parts category only and don't embed them into Materials at all.  Then I could create a multi-category schedule with parts, walls, railings etc.

I'll give that a try.

[ToanDN]

You CAN have parts in a multi-category material take-off schedule.

[ToanDN]

You CAN have parts in a multi-category material take-off schedule.

[jstipanovich]

Interesting.  So, I can't get the Category field to display Parts like yours is.  Nor are Parts a selectable category when I create a multi-category takeoff.  So I'm unclear how you got to that point.

However, I learned that if I Create Parts then turn off "Material by Original" and then assign a material with the parameters assigned, the material takeoff picks it up like any other material.  This also surprisingly works for CW mullions - if you select the mullion from the Project Browser and go into it's Type Properties and assign the material directly to the mullion, the material takeoff picks it up.  Although it'll be tedious creating new mullion types just to address a different color.

Oddly, this doesn't work for railings though.  You can assign a material and pick it up with a material tag, but the takeoff doesn't read it.

Regardless, I think I'm getting close to my goal!

[jstipanovich]

Interesting.  So, I can't get the Category field to display Parts like yours is.  Nor are Parts a selectable category when I create a multi-category takeoff.  So I'm unclear how you got to that point.

However, I learned that if I Create Parts then turn off "Material by Original" and then assign a material with the parameters assigned, the material takeoff picks it up like any other material.  This also surprisingly works for CW mullions - if you select the mullion from the Project Browser and go into it's Type Properties and assign the material directly to the mullion, the material takeoff picks it up.  Although it'll be tedious creating new mullion types just to address a different color.

Oddly, this doesn't work for railings though.  You can assign a material and pick it up with a material tag, but the takeoff doesn't read it.

Regardless, I think I'm getting close to my goal!