Revit 2020 Custom floor pit for specialty equipment

[prichmond]

Hi,

I work for a commercial dish washer manufacturer. Some of our models require a floor pit to be constructed in a specific way. I can create the model and even the voids but it does not cut the floor and it does not warn the user they will need a floor pit when inserting.

Can this be done and what is the best practice for this?

Thanks.

Phill

[davinatkins]

For a family to cut a floor, that floor has to be a floor family. So step one would be to create a new floor family that just had the cutout. (Generic model floor based)

Then you can insert the washer in that family as a nested family. You'd want to align it to the bottom of the pit, and lock it.

I think the best practice would be to release this as two models. One called something like "washer without required pit" and the other as "washer with required pit". That way a user could build a combined pit manually if they want to.

[ridantuo]

Floor based and face based families - for example - can do it automatically when placed on the surface. Others can do it manually (after placing the family cut geometry tool) like this tub-family that has a void in it:

[prichmond]

Hi,

I can't really see what is happening. Can you send this to me so I can try it and see how it is constructed?

Phill

[prichmond]

This good information but I need to provide our customers with something they can use to cut the floor in their projects. I have no control over the floor family or anything in the project beyond my content.

That is why I was asking if I am doing something wrong or is there a best practice I can point to for customers who do not know enough about Revit.

Does this make sense?

Phill

[Mike.FORM]

create you family from the generic model - floor based or generic model - face based family template.

Then in your family you can either use the opening tool or a void form to cut into the floor or face (depending on the template you used. Then when you place the family in the project it will cut the floor automatically.

[SteveKStafford]

As you know, you don't really have any control over how the end user will model the floor that your family will sit on. The floor might be native to the model they put it in (architecture or kitchen consultant) or it could be present in a linked model (architecture or structural). If the floor is in a linked model then your family can't alter the floor element.

You could model some symbolic lines in elevation to indicate the proportions of the pit that is required so when it is viewed in sections/elevations it will be more obvious they need to plan for it. If you build in an offset that places it below whatever hosting surface is present it will also be more obvious that a recessed floor is required.

You can also provide a secondary family that is just a face based void (with symbolic lines X) that your end user can use to alter their floor or pass along to whoever controls the floor in a linked model so your equipment and pit can be coordinated closely. Define the void/pit family with names that correspond with the dishwasher types you offer so they can match up type/sizes logically.

[ToanDN]

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@prichmond wrote:

This good information but I need to provide our customers with something they can use to cut the floor in their projects. I have no control over the floor family or anything in the project beyond my content.

That is why I was asking if I am doing something wrong or is there a best practice I can point to for customers who do not know enough about Revit.

Does this make sense?

Phill

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The most flexible approach when you don't have control of the host is using a face based or work plane based family.

- Face based: add a void in the family and cut the solid hos with it so that when your place it in the project it will cut applicable host. 

- Work plane based: add a void in the family and set the family to cut with void when loaded.  After place the family in the project you can use Cut Geometry to cut what needs to be cut. 

Between the two above, work plane is more flexible because you can cut multiple elements with your family (think there are a finish floor and a structural floor below it).

[Mike.FORM]

@ToanDN You can do the same thing with a Faced Based family as long as the void in the family is not cutting the host in the family and then you have "Cut with voids when loaded" checked in the family

The "Cut with voids when loaded" allows the family to cut anything in the project (that is a cuttable category) as long as the void is not already cutting anything in the family.

Here is a quick example faced based family with a void around it. It is cutting a wall, a roof and a soffit.

[prichmond]

Hi,

Yes I see. I have not any problems with voids in walls, ceilings and pretty much anything else.

Floors however put me back on my heels.

I have tried all the generic models and I have tried openings and void extrusions and combinations of both. Nothing seems to be able to cut the floor. I was not expecting it to be this hard.

Thank you for your answers but I am running out of time. I have a couple of more ideas that I will try I just wanted others to know adding a voided family to a floor is problematic.

Phill

[ridantuo]

There is an example.

It is just a void that cuts the floor.

[prichmond]

Thanks for this. I opened it and put it in the project I created for testing. So I have a couple of questions.

1. When I put this in the project it turns red. Is this normal?

2. It does show "cutting" the floor, but when I render the scene it disappears. Is there a way I can make the cut in the floor stay?

3. What floor family should I be using for these sorts of testing?

OK maybe a few questions...

Phill

[prichmond]

So I just discovered something. When I insert a void family and mark it as new in a floor marked as existing the void is red and does not show up in render.

When I set the floor to new and add the family as new there is no red and the void shows in render.

Why does this happen? Is there a note somewhere that says warning voids for floors can only be added in new floors?

Phill

[davinatkins]

Ahh, this is normal Revit behavior. If you put a new (something) on an
existing (something) then it shows up bold on a view setup to show new
items. It shows cuts as red on a view setup as demolition.

I have a YouTube video that explains that if this is new for you.

https://youtu.be/7vrltKoFZV4

[prichmond · Accepted solution]

Very helpful. Thanks to everyone who helped me get this figured out.

Phill

[ToanDN]

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@Mike.FORM wrote:

@ToanDN You can do the same thing with a Faced Based family as long as the void in the family is not cutting the host in the family and then you have "Cut with voids when loaded" checked in the family

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Yeah but that eliminates the one advantage of Face based, which is cut the host automatically upon insert.