Nested Beam/Header in a Window Family

[DrakeCanyonArchitecture]

I'm trying to create what seams like it should be simple but I'm missing something. I'm creating a window family with a header using beams. I have the header set so that the height adjusts to be where the top of the opening is. I also have the width constrained so that it flexes with the width of the window with a parameter so that I can adjust how much the header extends past the opening. The issues that I'm not sure about are:

1. How do I select different beams? I'd like to have a drop down with some predefined headers sizes.

2. How do I make these beams tag-able? I've loaded the family into my project but can't seem to make a tag work. The window size tag works but not the beam tag. I've tried tabbing through but it doesn't see the header.

I'm kind of surprised that this isn't already a thing. literally every opening needs a header of some sort. Unless there is another solution that I'm unaware of.

Here is a pic of what I have so far. I have just used an empty window family template as I don't need the window components for what I am doing, just the opening.

[zeulrick]

I have created them as an extrusion with parameters for height and width set to the wall thickness. This option, however, doesn't allow for tagging. 

[barthbradley · Accepted solution]

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@DrakeCanyonArchitecture wrote:

I'm kind of surprised that this isn't already a thing.

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It is a "thing".  

Part of the "thing" is related to Shared, Nested Components. Have you learned about this yet? 

https://knowledge.autodesk.com/support/revit-products/learn-explore/caas/CloudHelp/cloudhelp/2015/EN...

[_Vijay]

I think can use shared family for tag and scheduling....

[ToanDN · Accepted solution]

https://knowledge.autodesk.com/support/revit-products/learn-explore/caas/CloudHelp/cloudhelp/2014/EN...

[DrakeCanyonArchitecture]

@barthbradley I'm referring to headers being a standard component of windows and doors. They aren't included as a standard option for openings. Thanks for the link, I think that covers everything that I need to know for what I am doing.

[DrakeCanyonArchitecture]

I have another question regarding this. As I nest the beams into my window or door family, everything appears to work fine when flexing in the family. When I load the family into a project, things change a bit. The beam will be offset from the opening in the x direction (looking at the window from the exterior/interior). I have constrained it to the reference planes, yet it will still behave this way. In the beam family, there doesn't appear to be a way to lock the x direction. Any ideas on how I can constrain the beam to the center of the window? 

I have nested my own trim in my window families in the past and constrained the trim to the centers of the windows and tied the window trim parameter to the window width parameter so that they worked with one another. I think it may have been one of you that posted in this thread that helped me with my window trim. There doesn't appear to be a way to constrain to the center of a beam. 

[ToanDN]

What is the beam family made out of? A structural framing family?

[DrakeCanyonArchitecture]

@ToanDN, yes, the stock dimensional lumber family. 

[ToanDN]

Structural framing /column families don't work well when nested inside another family by nature. You need to create your own families from Generic model template then change the category to Structural.

[DrakeCanyonArchitecture]

Just as a quick recap of that process. I'll create that family using an extrusion, share and save as a structural framing member, then nest that into my door and window families. Will the sharing and saving as structural framing allow me to tag as it does in the stock structural framing family? Does that pretty much cover it?

[ToanDN · Accepted solution]

Yes you can tag and schedule any shared / nested components in project.

[DrakeCanyonArchitecture]

Thank you @ToanDN , I am making some progress now. I think @zeulrick eluded to this yesterday and I didn't pick up on his solution (*edit*, minus the tagging). At any rate, thank you all for your help.

[DrakeCanyonArchitecture]

My brain is fried on this. Incredibly frustrating. Anybody interested in building this for me for a price? I've spent a days time trying to make this work and off the clock because the company that I'm doing the work for didn't hire me to do this, I'm trying to accomplish this to save myself a lot of time in the future by adding it into the projects that I'm working on. 

Apparently sharing a family adds another set of issues when nesting it? 

[barthbradley]

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@DrakeCanyonArchitecture wrote:

Apparently sharing a family adds another set of issues when nesting it? 

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What "issues" are you talking about?  Also, it isn't really clear where you are struggling. Maybe seeing your file would help us to help you. Post it.  

[zeulrick]

Here. I did it with a window - double Hung. Please send the window you would like it done on if you don't want to edit this one. FREE! I'm bored at night. Besides, I'm too expensive. Happy to help. Also Tell me the Beam sizes you would like in the family.

I see that you're using Revit 2020. You won't be able to open my family 😕

[DrakeCanyonArchitecture]

The issues that I was referring to was from this thread https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/revit-ideas/associate-type-parameters-for-shared-nested-families/idi-..., sorry, I should have taken the time to post this earlier. 

I recreated what I have been working on from scratch after your message above. This one works better than any so far. I get confused with what should be Type or Instance parameters when working with multiple families. Especially when I am building everything from scratch. 

The issues with this one so far are that I can't tag it when loaded into a project and even though I set the discipline to structural, the header displays as solid lines instead of hidden. It will also disappear altogether depending on where the view range is set. 

The worst part about it is I'm not 100% sure how I made this work as well as it does. I would have to redo this for several different families, and I don't have a solid understanding of what I am doing. Being in a rush because I have a lot of work that I need to do just adds to the stress. I'm perplexed as to why openings just don't have this functionality as literally every opening has a header or lintel. Even if they are non-bearing. 

I have attached my Header Family, Window Family (Minus an actual window), and the project that I was using for testing. They are ugly, so my apologies. 

[zeulrick]

Here is the revised window with nest header. I've added a couple parameters to clean it up.

[zeulrick]

Here is your window with nested header. It's saved in 2021. I'm not sure how you can save down to 2020 without being a dwg or something

[DrakeCanyonArchitecture]

Thank you @zeulrick, I very much appreciate the help. I'll have to figure out how to make the tags work but I know there is a way. I'll save this and upgrade to 2021. I tried once and had issues so just went back to 2020. Thank you very much for your help!