light fixtures move when ceiling edited

[kgatzke]

In the attached RVT there is a ceiling with some linear and can fixtures that needs to be modified to fit the walls.

When I edit the boundary to align the edge and cut out the column enclosures Revit shifts or rotates all of the light fixtures causing some of them to no longer cut the ceiling.  

Since this error cannot be ignored I have to discard my edits, go back and copy the fixtures to the clipboard, delete them, re-edit the boundary and paste them back in.  

I don't always get this error but it happens often enough to be distracting and add inefficiency to my work.

I'd like to know why this is happening and what I can do to prevent it. 

[cbcarch]

In sketch mode, see if any of the sketch lines are locked (padlock symbol) to any walls, grids, etc.

Sounds like there maight also be some locked dimensions or other constraints which are causing the ceiling to move.

Check if the lights are "hosted" or "unhosted" families--the hosted type should move with the ceiling, face-based (un-hosted) will not move with ceiling.

[kgatzke]

None of the ceiling sketch lines are padlocked, or rather, I can't tell.  I don't see any padlocks open or closed when I select them.  I turned on Reveal Constraints both in and out of sketch mode and there are no visible constraints.

I'm not sure how to check whether or not the lights are hosted.  I would like to be able to pick a family and ask Revit to identify or select the host but they didn't think we would need that ability.  I know the fixtures dissappear if I delete the ceiling so I'm assuming they're hosted.  I can't seem to move this pattern the same way I can with a grid so I can't check to see if the fixtures move with it.  

I've discovered that they do move with the edges if I drag them in sketch mode even though there are no apparent constraints.  The fixtures move radically out of position when I break an edge to insert new edges for the column enclosures.  Deleting the left edge and drawing new edges causes the same problem.  If I delete the edge near the linear fixtures they relocate to the center of the new edge.  Creating more edges seems to cause the fixtures to associate some unobservable constraint with a new edge on the side of the column cover which is moving and/or rotating them across the ceiling and off it.  The edge does not appear to affect the position of the pattern, which is odd because fixtures typically move with the pattens like ceiling grids.

[lostagain]

Did you find a way to work around this? I'm having the same issue and see no apparent logic behind what makes light fixtures move when the boundary is changed. Therefore I know of no way to get past this, short of deleting and recreating objects (with the resultant possibility of not reproducing the existing or proposed conditions exactly, including scheduling), which I'd really prefer not to do. I have enough actual tasks in front of me today.

[kgatzke]

Pinning all the fixtures worked for me on all but one ceiling which suffered an extrusion failure every time I tried to close the sketch.  I had to copy-paste-aligned-to-view to get them back.

[lostagain]

Thanks for replying. Your solution worked for me.

I've found elsewhere this may be preemptively resolved by recreating ceiling based fixtures using the face based template (or by changing the family to face based via instructions at http://thatbimguy.blogspot.com/2013/04/converting-wall-ceiling-or-floor-based.html ).

[kgatzke]

I've done that.  It's a helpful method for getting wall hosted fixtures (sconces, step lights, etc.) to host in non-wall models like complex in-place concrete constructions for auditoriums or site work.

[RileyBunn]

Pinning the hosted light fixtures works for me.

[egorUMWM3]

Thanks for sharing the link.
Seems odd to need to go through the pain of changing lights from one type to another after a whole project is done. This should simply work. Another glitch we can hopefully get resolved by the Autodesk team.. 

If a ceiling plane moves up and down and even side to side, the lights should come with it. But if a ceiling boundary is changed the lights shouldn't shift around.. This is incredibly volatile, especially if people don't notice, and then all lights are in misalignment. 

this sounds like a 2D lighting plan is just more of an appropriate solution, as it remains where drawn.

[tnguyenDES2S]

It works for me too.

[spbourke]

I found that by copying the ceiling to the clipboard then deleting it and then pasting it back 'Aligned to Same Place' disassociated the face based family from the ceiling. You could then adjust the ceiling however you needed too.