Create Wall Families or Wall Types

[brianwclayton1969]

Good afternoon,

I'm looking at the same client to create a wall family where I use the same wall size 3m, 5m or 4ft with storefront or curtain wall grids, when I place the walls, the grids are already in place, the door is in place the 3m wall I just draw and everything is there. 

These walls type are being used over and over again, I don't want to have to create the grid mullions every time.

BUT when I create the curtain wall with the grid/mullions the way I want, and then draw a the 5m curtain wall, all I get is the glass no mullions or anything.

See pictures attached on what I want to stay every time I create the wall and what I want when I draw the wall.

Thanks all help is greatly appreciated.

[brianwclayton1969]

Good afternoon,

I'm looking at the same client to create a wall family where I use the same wall size 3m, 5m or 4ft with storefront or curtain wall grids, when I place the walls, the grids are already in place, the door is in place the 3m wall I just draw and everything is there. 

These walls type are being used over and over again, I don't want to have to create the grid mullions every time.

BUT when I create the curtain wall with the grid/mullions the way I want, and then draw a the 5m curtain wall, all I get is the glass no mullions or anything.

See pictures attached on what I want to stay every time I create the wall and what I want when I draw the wall.

Thanks all help is greatly appreciated.

[barthbradley]

Hey Brian. So, we're back to trying to hamstring the Architect, huh? Kidding. 😉 

So, in this scenario, you can't use the Basic Wall as Curtain Panel approach I suggested in your previous post. Curtain Walls are defined by a UV pattern; one Vertical and one Horizontal Grid.  Grid/Mullion Segments, like those above Doors/Windows, are generally defined by placing Independent Curtain Line Segments via Add/Remove Segments.  

Help | Curtain Grids and Panels | Autodesk

[barthbradley]

Hey Brian. So, we're back to trying to hamstring the Architect, huh? Kidding. 😉 

So, in this scenario, you can't use the Basic Wall as Curtain Panel approach I suggested in your previous post. Curtain Walls are defined by a UV pattern; one Vertical and one Horizontal Grid.  Grid/Mullion Segments, like those above Doors/Windows, are generally defined by placing Independent Curtain Line Segments via Add/Remove Segments.  

Help | Curtain Grids and Panels | Autodesk

[lucdoucet_msdl]

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@brianwclayton1969 wrote:

I'm looking at the same client to create a wall family where I use the same wall size 3m, 5m or 4ft with storefront or curtain wall grids, when I place the walls, the grids are already in place, the door is in place the 3m wall I just draw and everything is there. 

---

The statement that the door "is in place" when you create the wall is not normal. Typically, the wall family type for curtain walls can only have a single type of panel family assigned to it. So the door has to be created in a second step by changing the middle panel of the bottom row to a "door" panel type.

From the rest of the description, it seems that the mullion types for the U and V directions are set in the "3m" wall type.

---

These walls type are being used over and over again, I don't want to have to create the grid mullions every time.

---

This is understandable, so as in your "3m" wall type, when the mullion types are assigned to the U and V directions, the mullions are automatically created on their associated mullion grids.

---

BUT when I create the curtain wall with the grid/mullions the way I want, and then draw a the 5m curtain wall, all I get is the glass no mullions or anything.

It seems as though your "5m" wall type is not setup to associate a mullion type to the U and V directions, thereby creating the panel and the mullion grids but not mullions on the grids. To check, edit the "5m" wall type and check the vertical and horizontal spacing and mullion type assignments. If the mullion types are empty, then select the mullion types you what for each U and V directions.

Hope this helps,

-luc

[lucdoucet_msdl]

---

@brianwclayton1969 wrote:

I'm looking at the same client to create a wall family where I use the same wall size 3m, 5m or 4ft with storefront or curtain wall grids, when I place the walls, the grids are already in place, the door is in place the 3m wall I just draw and everything is there. 

---

The statement that the door "is in place" when you create the wall is not normal. Typically, the wall family type for curtain walls can only have a single type of panel family assigned to it. So the door has to be created in a second step by changing the middle panel of the bottom row to a "door" panel type.

From the rest of the description, it seems that the mullion types for the U and V directions are set in the "3m" wall type.

---

These walls type are being used over and over again, I don't want to have to create the grid mullions every time.

---

This is understandable, so as in your "3m" wall type, when the mullion types are assigned to the U and V directions, the mullions are automatically created on their associated mullion grids.

---

BUT when I create the curtain wall with the grid/mullions the way I want, and then draw a the 5m curtain wall, all I get is the glass no mullions or anything.

It seems as though your "5m" wall type is not setup to associate a mullion type to the U and V directions, thereby creating the panel and the mullion grids but not mullions on the grids. To check, edit the "5m" wall type and check the vertical and horizontal spacing and mullion type assignments. If the mullion types are empty, then select the mullion types you what for each U and V directions.

Hope this helps,

-luc

[brianwclayton1969]

lucdoucet,

Some of it makes sense....for my client....the 3m and 5 m walls will never change is length....when I draw a curtain wall, whether it be "CURATIN WALL: CURTAIN WALL" or CURTAIN WALL: STIREFRONT" (which this one is nightmare to modify), I need to be able to just draw a 3m or 5 m wall w/mullions or 3m or 5m wall w/mullions and door, the everything shows up.

Right now when I setup a wall or try to setup a wall the way I want it, and then select the wall and draw it, like a "CURTAIN WALL: CURTAIN WALL" it is just the piece of glass at what ever length, no mullions, etc.

I'm trying to make this a very efficient project/template, where no one has to do anything but draw the 3m or 5m wall and roll with it.

Thanks Brian

[brianwclayton1969]

lucdoucet,

Some of it makes sense....for my client....the 3m and 5 m walls will never change is length....when I draw a curtain wall, whether it be "CURATIN WALL: CURTAIN WALL" or CURTAIN WALL: STIREFRONT" (which this one is nightmare to modify), I need to be able to just draw a 3m or 5 m wall w/mullions or 3m or 5m wall w/mullions and door, the everything shows up.

Right now when I setup a wall or try to setup a wall the way I want it, and then select the wall and draw it, like a "CURTAIN WALL: CURTAIN WALL" it is just the piece of glass at what ever length, no mullions, etc.

I'm trying to make this a very efficient project/template, where no one has to do anything but draw the 3m or 5m wall and roll with it.

Thanks Brian

[brianwclayton1969]

barth, I would be just happy with the Curtain Wall holding what I create, I could careless about a basic wall. I just want to make this as efficient as possible. The wall lengths will never change and the door placement will always be in the middle.

Thanks Brian

[brianwclayton1969]

barth, I would be just happy with the Curtain Wall holding what I create, I could careless about a basic wall. I just want to make this as efficient as possible. The wall lengths will never change and the door placement will always be in the middle.

Thanks Brian

[lucdoucet_msdl]

@brianwclayton1969 

What if you offered them three model groups  with the 1,2m, 3m and 5m sections of curtain wall premodeled with the correct wall type, mullion spacing, mullion types and panel types ( x 2 groups to include and exclude the door)? The user just drags and drops the group from the project browser.

If all they should be able to do is adjust the curtain wall height, they could then create a duplicate of the group and edit the new group adjusting the height for each instance of the same height. The user could then append a height suffix to the group name.

Not fully understanding the use case scenario, I am guessing it is a modular system only available in fixed dimensions (except height).

Another alternative would be to eschew curtain wall types altogether and create a parametric family with required family type to interact with the model and allow documentation of the building system. Can you expand on the use case if you are open to using other family types?

-luc
<edit first paragraph>

[lucdoucet_msdl]

@brianwclayton1969 

What if you offered them three model groups  with the 1,2m, 3m and 5m sections of curtain wall premodeled with the correct wall type, mullion spacing, mullion types and panel types ( x 2 groups to include and exclude the door)? The user just drags and drops the group from the project browser.

If all they should be able to do is adjust the curtain wall height, they could then create a duplicate of the group and edit the new group adjusting the height for each instance of the same height. The user could then append a height suffix to the group name.

Not fully understanding the use case scenario, I am guessing it is a modular system only available in fixed dimensions (except height).

Another alternative would be to eschew curtain wall types altogether and create a parametric family with required family type to interact with the model and allow documentation of the building system. Can you expand on the use case if you are open to using other family types?

-luc
<edit first paragraph>

[barthbradley]

---

@brianwclayton1969 wrote:

barth, I would be just happy with the Curtain Wall holding what I create, I could careless about a basic wall. I just want to make this as efficient as possible. The wall lengths will never change and the door placement will always be in the middle.

Thanks Brian

---

Out of curiosity Brian, what is the big picture here? What are you hoping to accomplish in the long run? More consumers of your product?  

[barthbradley]

---

@brianwclayton1969 wrote:

barth, I would be just happy with the Curtain Wall holding what I create, I could careless about a basic wall. I just want to make this as efficient as possible. The wall lengths will never change and the door placement will always be in the middle.

Thanks Brian

---

Out of curiosity Brian, what is the big picture here? What are you hoping to accomplish in the long run? More consumers of your product?  

[brianwclayton1969]

Barth the big picture, is not to attract more customers, the big picture is the shell of a building that the client designs around is a tent structure and the exterior walls are consistent 3m and 5m walls, storefront wall, with mullions and some with doors. This will speed up the process and where you drag and drop, then the client can move on the designing the inside space. I have the inside walls created that was the easy part. 

See the attached picture.

Thanks Brian 

[brianwclayton1969]

Barth the big picture, is not to attract more customers, the big picture is the shell of a building that the client designs around is a tent structure and the exterior walls are consistent 3m and 5m walls, storefront wall, with mullions and some with doors. This will speed up the process and where you drag and drop, then the client can move on the designing the inside space. I have the inside walls created that was the easy part. 

See the attached picture.

Thanks Brian 

[brianwclayton1969]

Barth here is the picture

[brianwclayton1969]

Barth here is the picture

[brianwclayton1969]

Lucdoucet,

Can I make a group of the Curtain wall: Curtain wall the way I want? And then provide that?

With and without doors?

Thanks

[brianwclayton1969]

Lucdoucet,

Can I make a group of the Curtain wall: Curtain wall the way I want? And then provide that?

With and without doors?

Thanks

[barthbradley]

Well then, why don't you just build a Family that decides the length/width based on panel width and the user-inputted "desired" length/width?    

[barthbradley]

Well then, why don't you just build a Family that decides the length/width based on panel width and the user-inputted "desired" length/width?    

[lucdoucet_msdl]

---

@brianwclayton1969 wrote:

Can I make a group of the Curtain wall: Curtain wall the way I want? And then provide that?

With and without doors?

---

Yes, that is what I described in my last post. You would have groups: 1,2m wall, 3m wall, 5m wall, 1,2m wall+door, 3m wall+door and 5m wall+door.

From the example picture posted, the curtain wall height could be either attached to the level above or a set height. If you have different heights in the same structure, you would need to use the set height and duplicate the above groups adding a suffix for the heights different from the typical height.

Another advantage of this method would be the production of a schedule of groups to quantify the units required in each structure.

Hope this helps,

-luc

[lucdoucet_msdl]

---

@brianwclayton1969 wrote:

Can I make a group of the Curtain wall: Curtain wall the way I want? And then provide that?

With and without doors?

---

Yes, that is what I described in my last post. You would have groups: 1,2m wall, 3m wall, 5m wall, 1,2m wall+door, 3m wall+door and 5m wall+door.

From the example picture posted, the curtain wall height could be either attached to the level above or a set height. If you have different heights in the same structure, you would need to use the set height and duplicate the above groups adding a suffix for the heights different from the typical height.

Another advantage of this method would be the production of a schedule of groups to quantify the units required in each structure.

Hope this helps,

-luc

[brianwclayton1969 · Accepted solution]

I created 3m and 5m wall walls and added the mullions and did the same thing and added mullions with doors and created them as a group. This works the way I want.

They just have to ungroup if they need to make any height adjustments.

Thanks

[brianwclayton1969 · Accepted solution]

I created 3m and 5m wall walls and added the mullions and did the same thing and added mullions with doors and created them as a group. This works the way I want.

They just have to ungroup if they need to make any height adjustments.

Thanks