Custom Appearance Discrepancy

Custom Appearance Discrepancy

Anonymous
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Message 1 of 14

Custom Appearance Discrepancy

Anonymous
Not applicable

I have created an entire library of industry-specific materials/grades with accurate mechanical properties. Each one of these materials is assigned a default appearance which reflects the materials raw state.

I created many additional appearances to reflect how the finished part should look (paints, powder coats, galv, zinc, ect...) which can be applied to a part as an override to the default appearance.

 

I developed this entire material & appearance library in the "document materials" of a single part file and played with all of them until they were right. Now I have created a new Library and saved all custom materials and appearances to that library for company use.

 

When I start a new part and apply my FRP Grey appearance, it looks drastically different from what I created.

When I open the part file which was used to develop the appearance, it shows up properly. I have tried "Update Styles" and "Save Styles".. Also, I will try the same thing a few different times and one out of 5 or 6 times it will make the original part show up wrong as well.... or sometimes a new part will show up correctly....

Either way, my coworker has not been able to use the correct appearance yet (new part or original).Correct Original PartCorrect Original PartWrong New PartWrong New Part

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Replies (13)
Message 2 of 14

Anonymous
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I should also note that all of my custom materials and finishes were working properly a month ago. About 3 weeks ago they started showing up weird. Today I made a plywood appearance and the wood texture only shows up in realistic view style... however all of my other appearances with textures display properly in Shaded With Edges style.

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Message 3 of 14

Anonymous
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Also, we have company library files saved on our fileserver. If i save the document appearance changes to that shared library, the changes do not register for my co-workers. They must open up the document with updated appearances and save the styles to the library on their own. Why?

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Message 4 of 14

Anonymous
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Bump

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Message 5 of 14

Anonymous
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Nearly all of my appearances (colored paints, yellow zinc, bronze, ect) are now some shade of grey...

I spent several days developing these and it seems like they were destroyed without any type of human error or trigger that I can see... I had these saved in the material/appearance library for general use and I had them saved locally in a .ipt... all are behaving the same.

Can I get an Autodesk rep to weigh in on this? Any help would be appreciated...

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Message 6 of 14

Anonymous
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bump

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Message 7 of 14

WCrihfield
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Are you and all the other users using the same shared Project File stored on the File Server?  If so, within the settings of that project, is this new Material Library listed within its Material Libraries, and its Appearance Libraries?

If so, is it set to the default in each of those categories?

Keep in mind that one Material Library can contain both Material definitions, and Appearance definitions, so if all the new materials & appearances are all in one Material Library, you need to set list this same labrary in both locations within the Project, so that all users who have that project set as their active project, now have full access to that same library.

Also, remember that in order for all other pre-existing parts to use the new materials & appearances, the user will need to "Update" not "Save" the Materials in all those other parts, in order for to see the new changes.  When you use "Update", it overwrites the local (within the one file only) versions of those materials with the Global Library version of them.  But when you are in one of those other part files and you use the "Save" feature within the Update Styles dialog, that is saving the local material definition back to the Global library.

Also the "Visual Style" (exe. Realistic, Shaded, Shaded With Edges) settings is individually saved within each part file, so if one part file is set to Realistic, while the next part file is set to Shaded With Edges, both will look different from each other, even if both are fully updated.

 

If this helps any, please click Like.

Wesley Crihfield

EESignature

(Not an Autodesk Employee)

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Message 8 of 14

Anonymous
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We are all using shared projects. Once I had all of my materials and appearances finished in my test .ipt, I created a new library and put all of my materials and finishes in it. This new library was not set to default for about a month as we opted to test the new system on a few select projects. After tests were satisfactory, I set the new library to default.

 

We are quite familiar with the differences between Update and Save, however accidents do happen. My initial thought was that someone may have accidentally used Save. However, this was not the case... I went to the test .ipt and used Save to correct the library, but the part was already congruent with the library. Furthermore, the .ipt began to change a few days later. Please note that my materials and appearances don't share common names with the inventor appearance libraries, so overwriting them shouldn't be an issue anyways.

 

I have played with the visual styles. I attempted to set them all the same, though there may be some aspect of the lighting or visual styles that I am not understanding. Regardless, one document, when opened different times or by different PCs will appear differently. In this case, the visual styles are not a factor.

 

I have about 20 appearances. 2 of them always appear properly for everyone.

My coworker tried them last week and nearly all of them showed properly in a model he was using.

When I open the original .ipt, 9/10 times they dont work, 1/10 times they mostly work.

When my coworker opens the original .ipt, it's about 5/10 times that they mostly work.

 

I have a hard time believing that this is a result of a corrupted install since we have multiple workstations reflecting the issue. My best guess would be some sort of error in the method that I used to create things, or some setting in our projects/options that are causing issues... Or is this just because the Appearance/Material libraries are inherently buggy?

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Message 9 of 14

Anonymous
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BUMP

Can I get some more suggestions? Has anyone else had these issues? Is it fixable? Any idea what would cause this? Will Autodesk make a material library that doesn't suck?

Message 10 of 14

WCrihfield
Mentor
Mentor

Just thinking out loud here trying to help.

When you open the part, when it doesn't look right, is there a noticable delay while opening the file.

I wonder if it's possible that some users machines are taking a longer time searching for the custom image files specified within the custom Materials/Appearances.  Are there any image files with duplicate names within the Project Workspace subdirectories.  Within your Application Options, File Tab, File Open options, is it set to "Skip all unresolved files, or something similar? Is the Design View Representation options set to "Associative", and "Last Active"?

 

Wesley Crihfield

EESignature

(Not an Autodesk Employee)

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Message 11 of 14

Anonymous
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I only have 5-6 materials that use images. They are ones that were included with the inventor software. They seem to be functioning properly. They open time is not longer than normal and no error messages or symbols in sight. Also, because the images are out of the box and I have no desire to create new ones, they are all pulling from our local C drives in the default location. I haven't moved or copied these directories so there shouldn't be duplicates elsewhere.

 

Some materials, such as my Hot-Dip Galvanizing, have identical appearance properties, lighting environment, ect and appear different. Many of my materials, such as my paint colors, have had their colors in the appearance properties changed to various shades of grey, as well as the rest of the properties (reflectivity, image fade, glossiness, ect..) scrambled to random values.

 

Skip Unresoled files is checked for everything. Everything is set to Last Active. I did not have Associative checked for parts. What does this option do?

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Message 12 of 14

WCrihfield
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You may already know some of these things, but since I don't know if you do, please forgive me if I attempt to explain too much. Like all of us I'm sure, many things I just picked up over the years through trial & error, that aren't explained very well within Autodesk's help files.

 

There is a folder that is installed with Inventor (and likely other packages) called "Textures".

If you go into your Application Options / File  Tab, the last line, shows you where Inventor is looking for this folder.

What we had to do, to ensure all users were sourcing the same set of appearances, was basically copy this folder to a network location, where we all had access to.  Then make sure that all users Application Options were set to look at the same folder.  Those little image files are used for tons of stuff.

The files located directly within this folder are used for workspace backgrounds and the "Reflection Environtment" on your parts (Application Options / Colors Tab).

There are two sub folders ("bumpmaps" & surfaces") which I'm sure your pretty familiar with if you've set up custom Materials & Appearances before.  Basically if your new images aren't located within these two sub-folders, and aren't the right file type, it's going to cause lots of problems down the road.  We found that out the hard way in years past.

Somehow some users had a few of these files that were a little different from other users versions, when sourcing them locally.  Or one person's local version of one of the custom images got updated, while others didn't.

 

The "Associative" check box is extremely useful.  It makes sure you are viewing the "live" or directly smart linked (for lack of better term) version of the part or assembly.

When this is set the following things happen:

When you insert a part or assembly into either another assembly or a drawing, it makes sure that the part or assembly's appearance as well as which sub-components (or bodies in Multi-Body Parts) within are visible (as saved within the active Design View Representation), and remains actively linked to its source file.

Then when the source part or assembly is modified it instantly also changes within that destination assembly or drawing where it is set to Associative.

When you turn the visibility of any component off within an assembly, and it is currently Associative to its source, you get a warning message that doing so will break this link.  Afterwards, if you want that component's Design View Reprenentation to update, you must select it, right click, choose Representation, that ckeck Associative again, to it will have that direct link again.

Yes, this setting is often less important for simple part files than it is for assemblies, but it made a huge difference for us.

Within drawings, when you edit the view, the Component tab / Representation area is the same way.  If you don't have that little check box above the View drop down checked, the View Representation of the component within the view won't update when it changes in the source file.

I believe that when you have that option checked within the application options, it automatically checks this box for you on new occurances, when appropriate.

I don't know if these things will help your situation out, but I hope it helps either you or others in the future.

Wesley Crihfield

EESignature

(Not an Autodesk Employee)

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Message 13 of 14

Anonymous
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@WCrihfield 

Some of this is known to us, some is new or slightly more in depth than what we knew.. thank you for taking the time to help out!

We do have the texture folders on our network and all workstations are linked to it.

 

Most of my appearances do not have textures. They are either copied from a default appearance and renamed/modified or they are created from scratch with the new material button in the bottom left of the appearance window. 

The few appearances that we use which do have textures are default textures that I thought were close enough to suit my purpose. Is it an issue to copy from default materials/appearances? Is it an issue to reuse default textures?

 

Something new that I did not notice before - all of my materials had their information removed or reset to "generic" or "default". I had specific information about material grades inside of the material descriptions about typical usage ect, this information was searchable. I could search "Shaft" and several grades used for shafts would show and they all had information about applications where they should be used.

It seems that both materials and appearances were reset to generic/default properties. They all have unique names that I created (they don't match any default inventor materials/appearances), so overwriting them with default content should not be an issue, correct?

 

All of our guys are very aware of Save vs Update styles and have been careful. Additionally, I had a .ipt saved with all the materials and appearances to restore from if our library were screwed up by a careless Save.

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Message 14 of 14

WCrihfield
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No. I don't think it's an issue to copy from default Materials/Appearances.

No. I don't think it's an issue to reuse default textures.

I'm pretty sure Autodesk even encourages those things.

You are correct, if your materials/appearances have unique names (different from Autodesk's items), and all your people are aware of the Save/Update use, then you shouldn't have to worry about them being overwritten.

I'm affraid I'm out of new ideas at the moment.

Hopefully someone else here on the Forums can help you further.

Sometimes the Autodesk employees themselves see these posts and jump in to help out.

Wesley Crihfield

EESignature

(Not an Autodesk Employee)

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