Inventor Groove Welding Saddle Joint Tubes 90° Without Coping

[Anonymous]

how should I approach welding  2 tubes together when in the following configuration?

kelly.young has edited your subject line for clarity: Welding question

[TheCADWhisperer]

Attach your assembly here.

[TheCADWhisperer]

More information is needed.

Do you want to fill the entire area as though the tube had a coped end?

Do you want a limited fillet weld tack on each side of contact?

Do you have a photo of a real world connection that you are attempting to emulate?

Are you using Inventor 2019?

[Anonymous]

It is a situation a student has in the real world. It's where the company are using the welder like a glue gun to fill the void, rather than shaping the end of the adjoining tube.  (They say it's cheaper than profiling the end)

So it needs the weld to fill the gap  around the pipe, but without any further cutting to the pipes.

[Frederick_Law]

Better look into welding code.

We usually cope all pipe and tube.  Probably stronger weld.

[TheCADWhisperer]

I think I know what you want, but a picture of an existing sample weld might keep me from wasting time.

I suspect the "solution" is going to involve a simple Split Face feature.

In general though - I ask my welding documentation class, "Is this really needed, is it worth the effort?  Or will the Weld Symbol on the 2D documentation suffice?"  Kind of like using true threads or cosmetic threads in documentation.

[Anonymous]

It isn't the way I would make it, but it apparently doesn't carry much load & the wire in the mig is cheaper than the guy cutting the saddle. The world is a funny place

So it's a saddle joint, but without cutting the saddle.

[TheCADWhisperer]

Well, a Groove Weld is simple to fill up the gap, but I suspect the real world weld bead doesn't go all the way to the apex and also includes a bead along the two edges where there is contact rather than gap.

Split Face will allow these modifications, but I would want to see image of actual weld before I would spend time on attempting to model the geometry.

[ToddHarris7556]

+1 for @TheCADWhisperer's comment - 

What is the end goal?

Communicate design intent? A welding symbol probably accomplishes that. 

Physically modeling the situation? For what? Stress analysis? I'm not sure you'd get anything meaningful out of trying to simulate filling a huge gap with a MIG gun. If it were a critical code joint, then there would be a weld procedure that would have to be followed. If it's a misc fabrication out in the shop, then it's simply a cost analysis that results in this approach, and it's probably fine all day long. 

If it's an academic exercise... i.e. 'how would we model this situation?' then that's valid discussion - on an academic level. 

It's all good, as long as it's kept in perspective. 

[Anonymous]

Sorry I wasn't very specific about the end goal.

Neither he or I could convince Inventor to fill the gap with a weld. Groove weld seemed to be the obvious answer, but we couldn't get the OK button to "ungrey".

What did I/we miss?

[TheCADWhisperer]

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@Anonymous wrote:

Sorry I wasn't very specific about the end goal.

Neither he or I could convince Inventor to fill the gap with a weld. Groove weld seemed to be the obvious answer, but we couldn't get the OK button to "ungrey".

What did I/we miss?

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Attach your files here.

Or at least a Screencast of the steps you are attempting.

[Anonymous]

Well now I feel stupid, I thought I did exactly that many times and couldn't get it to work, yet this time it did. User error! 

[ToddHarris7556]

Sorry - I missed @TheCADWhisperer's screenshot earlier. 

That is EXACTLY how I suspect it would be done in the real world. 

99% of welded handrail joints (this isn't a process pipe connection) would be coped to achieve good fit. If someone wanted to 'cheat' and not do a proper cope, then they typically disguise it by filling it all in and grinding it to make it look like it was done correctly. Disadvantages would be that outer/full member would bow like a banana due to welding, and it would take 1/2 of a grinding wheel to blend it in. 

Even if it weren't 'properly' coped, most fitters will at least do a rough cope with the grinder. Grind away 1/4" on either side at the tangent points, and you've cut the amount of weld (and subsequent post-weld finishing) down significantly. 

[ToddHarris7556]

A 'cheater' cope is done very fast and the objective is only to get the weld gap small enough to fill in a single pass. 

It's definitely not 'the right way' to build railing (or car frames) but it's done all the time. 

[ToddHarris7556]

Alternatively, if the fabricator had a portaband in their hands instead of a grinder, the cheater cut would look like this with 2 quick cuts by eyeball.