After the June update, graphics performance on my MacBook Pro running MacOS Mojave has become terrible. I'll post the specs for the MacBook Pro below. The more zoomed on a part I am, the worse the graphics lag. This computer also is partitioned to run Windows 10 using Bootcamp. I've made a comparison video showing the graphics in macOS Mojave vs. Windows 10 Pro 1903. I know OpenGL and DirectX aren't an apples to apples comparison, but just wanted to show the difference in performance on the same hardware, macOS vs Windows. The graphics lag I am seeing running macOS has never been an issue until the June Fusion 360 update.
Autodesk, I was told that the graphics team tweaked OpenGL in the June update. Is there anything I can do to get things working smoothly again?
Fusion 360 Graphics Diagnostics macOS Mojave:
[GPU Information]
GPU Device: NVIDIA GeForce GT 750M
GPU RAM: 2048 MB
GPU Driver API: OpenGL Core Profile
[Graphics Effects Settings]
Use high-resolution graphics: Off
Anti Aliasing: Off
Ambient Occlusion: On
Object Shadow: Off
Ground Shadow: On
Ground Reflection: Off
Selection Display Style: Normal
Transparency Effect: Better Performance
[Limit effects to optimize performance]
Off
System information About this Mac:
macOS Mojave
Version 10.14.6 (18G87)
MacBook Pro (Retina, 15-inch, Mid 2014)
Processor: 2.5 GHz Intel Core i7
Memory: 16 GB 1600 MHz DDR3
NVIDIA GeForce GT 750M 2 GB
Sorry, I didn't realize the link was bad. I'll correct it in original post and post the link again here.
@kellings Thanks you for posting this. I've been procrastinating in doing this but the difference in graphics performance between the Windows and macOS implementation is really quite pronounced.
It starts with the file opening dialogue and continues with the collapsing/expanding of the data panel, both of which are pathetic.
Gestures are basically useless on macOS due to the terrible lag.
I also run a 2017 MacBook Pro and and Win10 installation using bootcamp and the difference on this same hardware is really pretty disappointing!
This goes along with recent degradation in the ability to select things after swiping to another app in full screen mode, inability to select the view cube etc.
@TrippyLighting I don't see all the same behaviors that you describe, but not being able to click on things in the UI like the viewcube is driving me nuts. I pretty much work with two designs (tabs) open at all times even if the second design is completely black. So when I can't click the viewcube or draw a line etc. I switch to the other design tab and then back to the one I am working in and everything works again.
This is strange as many of us here us our macs as either primary support or work computers, @paul.clauss, @James.Youmatz, @jeff_strater and @Phil.E to name a few. And i'm very curious of their input on this one too.
I've not experienced that lag or really any lag with gesture navigation. Focus loss happens to me, where i switch applications and eventually fusion can't get focus back but Phil has gone over that many times.
I'm regularly in many different files some of my own and customers files all in varying degrees of complexity and rarely see a performance lag - save for the files of extreme outliers and problems.
@kellings, the lag is clearly shown in your video i am curious if you are using a peripheral mouse/spacemouse rather than the touchpad
I don't have much to add except that I use a 13" MBP with intel graphics. I do all classes with this, at AU and Fusion Academy. Recently, for a large model performance class I had over 1 GB of model data loaded and the machine performed well. Obviously when there are several thousand components on screen, some sluggishness was seen, but nothing that would stop or slow any workflows. This included full demos of modeling workflows.
I think one thing that is very different for people who work in Fusion development is that we tend to do things like restart our computers*, we don't have chrome open with dozens of persistent tabs, we don't install a lot of extra apps that are constantly running, and probably many other computing habits that vary from typical user machines. We get live updates for development builds up to 3 times a day too.
The other factor at play here is repeatable bugs. In order to fix any bug we need a few ingredients: a repeatable case, the right hardware, and the time to do it all. Graphics issues defy all of these factors. There is a dedicated graphics team that has recently expanded a little and are getting a lot done, so there is hope for more improvements going forward. I've asked them to take a look on this post.
*believe it or not this works wonders.
@ryan.bales wrote:
This is strange as many of us here us our macs as either primary support or work computers, @paul.clauss, @James.Youmatz, @jeff_strater and @Phil.E to name a few. And i'm very curious of their input on this one too.
@kellings, the lag is clearly shown in your video i am curious if you are using a peripheral mouse/spacemouse rather than the touchpad
Hi Ryan. I was using a mouse in the video that I posted. I just tried doing the same thing using only the trackpad and the lag went away. I tried a second mouse and the lag was better, but still there.
I was using this mouse when I recorded the video. https://www.bestbuy.com/site/insignia-bluetooth-mouse-black/5709669.p?skuId=5709669
This is the mouse that I just tired with. https://www.logitech.com/en-us/product/m720-triathlon?crid=7
@Phil.E This is Kevin from your NYC CNC class. The issues with Fusion losing focus happen when Fusion is the only program or there may at times be another program like Outlook open. I don't know how to replicate the issue. The UI becoming unresponsive happens sometimes in the middle of command. For instance, I'll add a dimension. Then I'll go to draw a line. I'll click the line start point but the line won't appear as I move my mouse. I have to switch to a new design, switch back, and then the line will draw fine. This happens all the time in when I'm in class. I'll try to show a view, but the viewcube isn't selectable. I need to switch to a new design, then return, and everything is fine again. This same thing used to happen with the activate component radio button in the browser, or to switch units under documents in the browser but that problem seems to have gone away.
@ryan.bales The first two mice I tried use bluetooth. I also tried a wireless USB receiver mouse that isn't bluetooth. No change in the lag. https://www.logitech.com/en-us/product/wireless-mouse-m510?crid=7
So a cheap bluetooth mouse, a midrange bluetooth mouse, and a low to midrange USB wireless mouse all provide the same results.
There is this one known issue, that technically cannot be fixed at this time due to dependencies on external apps.
When you go away from Fusion to another app, if you switch to Fusion using the dock icon, and it covers the timeline, this can lead to loss of most selection focus in Fusion. The remedy is to run your mouse over the timeline icons, not clicking just pass the pointer over the area.
So it does not happen with just the trackpad?
@ryan.bales No lag when using the trackpad. Lag when using a mouse wireless mouse (bluetooth and USB receiver)
@Phil.E For the UI to become unresponsive, I don't click on the dock or any other application. It just quits. I can't figure it out. I don't switch applications. I don't get a notification. I wish I could figure out what triggers it. It just stops. Click new tab, switch back and everything is fine. Never happens when I use Windows.
Could you share your design to us for further investigation. From the video, the performance dropped a lot when zooming into the model that applied “orange” appearance, or you can just create a simple deign with the same appearance applied and share to us?
And could you use istat menus to monitor the CPU and GPU states on Mac, and share us a screenshot like below when you running into this low performance issue:
Thanks a lot!
Hi @SallyYang. I did a little screen recording while using iStat menus to show the frame rate that you can find below. I tried the same things without using Camtasia to record my screen thinking that maybe it would tax the system and skew the results but there was no change in frame rate. I've also included the 4 files that I showed in the video. This test was done using a mouse. I couldn't make iStat stay on top of the screen while using the trackpad.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLigiJuSJBk
If I can provide any other info, let me know.
@Phil.E wrote:
I don't have much to add except that I use a 13" MBP with intel graphics. I do all classes with this, at AU and Fusion Academy. Recently, for a large model performance class I had over 1 GB of model data loaded and the machine performed well. Obviously when there are several thousand components on screen, some sluggishness was seen, but nothing that would stop or slow any workflows. This included full demos of modeling workflows.
I think one thing that is very different for people who work in Fusion development is that we tend to do things like restart our computers*,
*believe it or not this works wonders.
Yep, it does. But this is MS Windows like behavior and not acceptable to most Mac/Unix users.
I don't shut my Mac down for days, or sometimes weeks on end. I do fairly often have to shut down Fusion 360 because it still does not seem to release all of the memory associated with a design when that design is closed and over time the memory footprint gets bigger and bigger.
The issues I am experiencing I believe are mostly due to me using Fusion 360 often or really most of the time in full screen mode. I swipe to the side to look up a web site and maybe find a supplier model on Grabcad or 3D content central and load it down. When I swipe back I cannot select the view cube anymore. Fairly recently I had problems selecting sketch elements.
What I call "laggy" is really the performance difference between a Windows and MacOS installation in the same machine. The windows UI is noticeable snappier.
I recently started watching Alias tutorials from Handlebar 3D and looking how he works with the gestures in Alias I don't see that same totally lag free gesture behavior in Fusiosn 360 on the Mac, which is the reason I don't work with gestures anymore.
Thanks for the insights.
"The issues I am experiencing I believe are mostly due to me using Fusion 360 often or really most of the time in full screen mode. "
Thanks for sharing all the details to us.
We can finally reproduce this issue with the same Mac model like yours now. The interesting thing is when we ran Fusion 360 on High Sierra, we couldn't reproduce this issue; but, just after we upgraded the High Sierra to Mojave, it reproduced.
From the investigation, we found the graphics effect "Ambient Occlusion" consumed a lot in your case, so would you help to verify if turn off "Ambient Occlusion" can improve the performance. Thanks!
@SallyYang Hi Sally. I've linked a video below showing the difference in iStats with ambient occlusion on and off. You can see when it is turned off, the lag does go away and the FPS increases significantly in comparison. Is this something that you guys think you can correct while using OpenGL since DirectX doesn't seem to have any issues on the hardware?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyQOL437qS0
Thanks,
Kevin
Thanks for your confirmation, Kevin!
Development team is working on the fix. But just like I said, this issue couldn't reproduced in High Sierra, so this is actually Mojave's defects to support Nvidia Graphics well. As Apple had stopped maintaining NVidia drives for a long time, we can't expect a fix from them, so we can only fix it from product level which may only handle the cases like yours.
I have a Macbook Pro 13" with Mojave 10.14.3.
I just recognised that my Anti-Aliasing was off. Tried to turn it on again - but it is greyed out. The mentioned Ambient Occlusion is turned ON and greyed out as well.
How can I turn ON anti-aliasing and turn off Ambient Occlusion ?
Please try to turn off the options that may limit your effects in below areas:
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