Unable to lock something in a sketch for changing an offset

[eric_strebel]

I have built a nice model and want to make some changes in a sketch. Specifically I wan to change and offset form 1mm to 2mm. When I change the onset is moves things around in my sketch. I am unable to figure out why the onset causes things to move. I am also unable to figure out a way to lock/fix the original included geometry and keep it from moving.

See images

If i change the onset to 2mm this is what happens

I can share the file, just pm me and I will share it with you. It would be super excellent if fusion showed you why it changes things when it does so you can see what constraints are causing things to behave the way they do.

[cekuhnen]

@eric_strebel

hmm odd - the black lines indicate that your sketch is fully constrained.

but the second image shows blue lines meaning parts are not constrained.

put the file into our shared project so I can look into it.

[cekuhnen]

@eric_strebel @jeff_strater

Jeff seems a project bug in the first place the projected sketches move / update oddly when in the sketch

sending the offset command into crazyness but reality is that offset works it is just that what projects

the lines into the sketch causes the issue

Eric best collaborate with Jeff how you build this.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Byzv_NlyKp_2YkVMN1M5QlJVREU/view

[TrippyLighting]

Just the mention of "projectections" and "offset" in the same sketch makes me shudder and my neck hair raise!

I've seen that go wrong so many times that I've stopped reporting this because I've got other stuff to do.

[eric_strebel]

LOL,

I think I will just make a new offset then re extrude from that , much less waisted time I think.

would be nice to see that fixed

[eric_strebel]

I still need help here, I can not just create another offset as I had thought I could, that moves my geometry around too...let me know so I can share my file, I am stuck at this point..

This should be an easy thing to do, but it's not..

Thanks

[eric_strebel]

Still waiting for assistance on this...anytime someone from autodesk wants to help me that would be awesome!

[cekuhnen]

@TrippyLighting@eric_strebel@jeff_strater

Peter what do you mean with this bug? I sofar did not come across something like this with offset and project going crazy this way.

This is a pretty bad one as it breaks the design.

Eric you might be right to approach this by modeling it differently or with a different order of steps and see if that prevents you

experiencing the bug(s).

[TrippyLighting]

@cekuhnen

What I mean with that is that I've run into several bugs with the offset tool. Either when used on it's own but much more so in conjunction with other sketch tools. I've rin into problems with offset in combination with projected sketch entities as well. 

I'd simply try to model this differently!

Sometimes I don't report these things anymore. My own personal bug tracker is a sorry example of reporting bugs that then don't get fixed even when they are low hanging fruit. Today starting at 5:45AM I started tracking down a bug that kept me occupied until 10:00PM last night. It took me 4 hours to nail down the problem. Is it ever going to get fixed ? Probably not!

[jeff_strater]

Hi @eric_strebel,

Yes, if you want to PM me a link to the design we will take a look at it.

Jeff

[jeff_strater]

Thanks for the design @eric_strebel, @cekuhnen.  Am able to reproduce this.  Filed as FUS-34732.  Still not sure what is going on, though.  Pretty bad results...

[eric_strebel]

@jeff_strater so....what does this mean?

Should I expect a solution in the near future or look for a plan "b" and just modify the model in a non liner fashion??

[cekuhnen]

@eric_strebel

Look for plan "B".

[jeff_strater]

@eric_strebel:  Still not sure yet.  The sketch team and I will have to look at it.  I beginning to suspect that there is something strange about the projected geometry in this sketch.  Like, it should have been updated before, but didn't, and after the update, it is actually correct.  I'll try to take a look at it tomorrow.

Jeff

[jeff_strater]

Hi @eric_strebel,

Sorry for the delay.  I was able to take a closer look at this design over the weekend.  I think that the problem is not so much the sketch solve itself, as the fact that the sketch has not been updated to reflect the positions of the components that are driving the projected geometry.  The "jump" that you see when you add geometry to the sketch is really just the sketch "catching up" with the referenced component's positions.

here is a screencast:

So, if you are looking for how to proceed, I would start with a "compute all", then go into that sketch and fix it up as you need it.

We will look into what might have caused the sketch not to update, but if you have any hints about what you were doing before this, that would be great.

Jeff

[eric_strebel]

@jeff_strater Well, not entirely sure what I was designing at the time, It's been a while since I did that. Basically I build the compoments then add them, and probably moved them into he correct orientation that they needed to be, is my guess....

SO, I will do a compute all, and then, I will have to go and move the components to the correct location in space that they need to be?? OR, do I need to move them into he correct orientation first ??? and then do a compute all??

Thanks

[jeff_strater]

You would need to make sure that the components are in the right place in the timeline, before the sketch computes.  This means rolling back before that sketch, positioning components, then doing a "capture position" to capture the components' position before the sketch computes.  You can also reorder the capture feature to be before the sketch.  For instance:

Jeff

[cekuhnen]

@eric_strebel @jeff_strater

How this happened who knows but the fact is that when you edit the sketch you see a wrong projection result.

I guess by knowing the issues with Fusion that you made the sketch at one point but then moved the components later in the design process

and Fusion failed in the timeline to update the sketches with the projected geometry.

I just moved a line and you see the sketches adjusting but when you overlay it with the components they draw the projected lines from it looks right then.

The current sketch result is wrong.

This was a one minute check of the relationship of the design and sketch - little smack Eric this is something you should have noticed already since you are the

creator of the design 😉

[eric_strebel]

@jeff_strater I will check it out shortly. Thanks for the vid and looking into it and explain the concept of what is going on. Much appreciated. Hope you can figure ut why that happens so others don't have this issue.

I really can't recall what got moved or why or when. Basically it should not have happened, I really should not have to remember anything, since that is the applications job @cekuhnen Thats really the point of the application and the time line, isn't it?!, so I can concentrate on other things in life.

[eric_strebel]

@jeff_strater @cekuhnen I spent some time looking at the time line. and trying to fix and understand what is happening.

One of The components don't get it's position moved until after the that sketch in the time line. and both are in different places at that point in time where the sketch that references them are..

I don't understand how they could not be in the location they are in the sketch. I built the model some time ago, so I have no recollection of what I did.

I actually don't understand how to fix the issue. Thus I need assistance.

When I click on the "position" move in the time line the time line gets stuck and I can't do anything at that point.

I am in over my head, in terms of knowing how to move the components to the correct place so they line up with the sketch.

In theory, It's my understanding that the components should be moved to the place they are referenced in the sketch??

I believe that this is what my goal is to fix the issue at hand?

I am unable to do this and I need help to do this. Since the time line is now stuck and I am not sure I am doing it correct.

......