Internal boring now not working after update to 2.0.14337

[simon5C5W6]

Hello,

Fusion updated to version 14337 yesterday and now i am having problems with internal boring toolpaths.

Up to now i have found two models, which existed and worked correctly before the update, which have different problems but both relating to internal boring. I am in no doubt that other similar models will also have problems..

In both cases i use a U-drill to make a hole, then use the edge of the same U-drill (with different tool offset of course) to bore out the hole.

Model 1:

The hole drills OK but the boring operation has the red diamond symbol and the note "Empty cutting area". The only way i can get this to work is if i set the depth of the bored hole to less than the model depth - but i want it to bore through the model area into the remaining stock and now it wont do it.

Model 2: 

This will bore past the model bottom face - but it bores too big. Outer diameter is set at 15.5mm and it wants to bore out to 16.5mm...

I set the outer diameter limit differently (from the model OD rather than a specific diameter) and this kept it to 15.5mm final diameter but now the tool does not retract from the cut surface until it is back at the front of the hole?!

Is there a known problem with these operations since this update or can i send a file to someone to verify / check please? 

Thanks for any help anyone can give!

Simon

[akash.kamoolkar]

@simon5C5W6 can you attach your file here so I can take a look?

Thanks,

[simon5C5W6]

Hi Akash,

Sorry for the delay, i am having some other problems with my PC too and perhaps it is all related...

I have moved to another PC and am installing Fusion on this machine too, to see if the problem appears here also.

One question i have - how do i attach a Fusion file as it is cloud based?

Regards,

Simon

[simon5C5W6]

Hi again,

I just tried on a different PC and the errors are still the same (also version 14337).

Regards,

Simon

[simon5C5W6]

I figured out how to add files..!

In Setup 1, the problem toolpath is "T5 Internal boring with 12.5mm U-Drill"

You can see that the outer diameter is set at 15.5mm but when simulated it runs to 16.5mm. Also it retracts down the bore from the 15.5mm size, without retracting first - all the passes previous to the 15.5mm retract correctly.

If you set the outer diameter to 'Model OD' - 5.25mm (model is 25mm diameter), it only cuts to 15.5mm but performs some odd retract moves too.

I hope you can shed some light on this! 

Thanks for the help.

Regards,

Simon

[akash.kamoolkar]

@simon5C5W6 i've replicated this issue and created a ticket for my team to take a look. i played around with it a bit and unfortunately cannot seem to find a workaround.

Regards,

[engineguy]

@simon5C5W6 

I had a look at your file and made some changes and it now works as expected, it is a little odd due to the Model shape I think, but, anyway have a look at the images below and the attached file, really just needed some different settings I think, anyway if it is classed as a "workaround" so be it, however if it may get you the job done that`s all that matters at the end of the day, well, plus getting paid for the job of course :):) 🙂

@akash.kamoolkar 

Question, would you consider what I have done as a "workaround" or just a different workflow/methodology ?

I would appreciate and value your input on this 🙂

[akash.kamoolkar]

@engineguy if you're referring to lowering the outer radius to compensate for the extra depth in the cut I would call it a workaround since the original outer radius should have worked in the first case and the modified one shouldn't. unless i missed something else you changed.

Regards,

[engineguy]

@akash.kamoolkar 

Thanks for the input, interesting and appreciated.

The issue with the weird toolpath was due to the Face Finish not run before the Bore Operation so it was trying to clear that small amount of material, I swapped the Face Finish and the Profile finish (as well just to reduce tool changes) to before the Bore and that was sorted.

Re the Outer/Inner, I just used the Model for the outer and worked inward  from there, just seemed easier to me, I had to remember that the actual inner Diameter was 15.88mm and the OP only wanted to go to 15.5mm as from what I could see the Milling Adaptive Operation was intended to clear that excess material, this meant that there was then no need for a "Stock to Leave" on the X axis, I left it on the Z to avoid a collision.

The above was my Theory anyway and it does work, even if it is classed as a "workaround", to me it is just a different workflow/method, no "trickery" involved IMHO 🙂 🙂

[simon5C5W6]

Thank you both for looking into this, i really appreciate it!

I have had a look at the modified file @engineguy posted and can see how this toolpath now works, but as @akash.kamoolkar pointed out, setting the outer diameter as a fixed dimension should work - and it used to! It is only since this recent update that the problems seemed to occur.

In the modified settings, the outer diameter is set as Model OD - 5.15mm which should leave a hole at 14.7mm (25-2x5.15) - but it actually cuts to 15.5mm (which is where i want it to end up, but I dont understand how the toolpath gets there!). If i set the outer diameter to Model OD - 4.75 (which should end up with a 15.5mm hole), it cuts to 16.3mm...

In my original message i mentioned another file which also has an internal boring problem, but is different again. This problem (see attached file) shows an empty cutting area when the tool is set to bore past the end of the model - if the 'back' setting is changed so it is within the model boundary then it works, but thats not how it should be...

Again, this problem only seemed to occur after the latest update, i have been making these parts with this file for the past 18 months.

The multiple boring operations are because we dont have a larger u-drill than 40mm and i need to get out to 71.5mm - if i use one toolpath to do the whole operation then the centre of the drill starts to rub on the bore, hence the multiple steps and retracting 1mm at a time. Hope that makes sense!

Regards, Simon

[engineguy]

@simon5C5W6 

Looked at your second file, yes, same issue when trying to use the "Diameter" method, definitely needs fixing, I can`t see anywhere that there is a setting that would cause the toolpath to overcut to the actual physical Inside Diameter by the 1mm from the 71.5mm setting to 72.5mm !!

I probably haven`t come across it as I use a different method so well spotted 🙂

There is an easy "workaround" for you if you want to continue to use the Diameter method as you are more comfortable with it, couple of things you can do, just set all the bore Operations to the same 71.5mm Outer Radius and the Inner Radius to the 40mm that you have drilled the hole with the U Drill, set the "Clearance" to -1mm from the "Inner Radius",  then keep the "Rest Machining" as it is for all subsequent Bore Operations and also your 1mm step over for the "Back" settings.

All OK so far, pretty much what you have been doing anyway 🙂

Now, you want to do say 5 Bore operations with the "Back" step over already set what you can do is use the "Stock to Leave" to have each Bore Operation only take a certain amount off with each Operation, what I have done in the attached file is to set the first Bore Operation to 12mm "Stock to Leave", next one to 9mm, then 6mm, then 3mm and the last one to 0.5mm, this last one is to compensate for the overcut.

Having said all that as far as I can tell the G Code is correct with a PP that I used, it only goes to the 71.5mm on the X so looks OK, try it with your own PP 🙂

Looks a lot at first but most of it you are already familiar with so shouldn`t be too much of a change in workflow for you until @akash.kamoolkar manages to get the Team that covers this involved and a proper solution for everyone sorted 🙂 🙂 🙂

This is what I ended up with, see attached file, may or may not help you 🙂 🙂 🙂

[akash.kamoolkar]

We've looked at this and it is, in fact, a regression that occurs when the front and back stock limits are off the model. We will be fixing this with the highest priority. I'll update this thread when the fix is out.

Regards,

[simon5C5W6]

Thank you @akash.kamoolkar for determining the cause and actioning a fix. That will be great.

Thank you @engineguy for creating a workaround in the meantime - really appreciate this!!

Regards,

Simon

[akash.kamoolkar]

This issue has been fixed in the update that went out recently.

Regards,

[simon]

Hello @akash.kamoolkar 

Thank you for the message and for getting this problem resolved, i can confirm all is working normally now.

Kind regards,

Simon