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Rotatable/Transformable Scale Tool. Necessary!!

Rotatable/Transformable Scale Tool. Necessary!!

We need a scale tool that does more than scale on world Co-ord it should be able to scale locally or rotable to whatever degree is needed. You already have it in the Transform(move) tool PLEASE make this ASAP. There are too many times i want to scale something i have recently rotated and forced use the push tool as a sad excuse for a workaround, and thats IF it works on the face that hopefully has a flat face to select from and not a curved/fileted surface...Please?

20 Comments
cekuhnen
Mentor

I made some ideas for those tools a long ago aswell. I am not sure if such a workflow is not common for parametric modelers. Coming from Alias this is a very specific tool I miss dearly.

It's crazy to think that in the current state, you'd have to rotate the body to world axes, scale, and rotate back.

 

I desperately want something that auto-infers the principal axes of bodies / components. Would be great to see those availiable for this.

Dunndor
Enthusiast
I have multi hundred parts scenes how do you think that makes me feel?

--
- Hunter Rosenberg
brianrepp
Community Manager
Status changed to: Gathering Support
 
donsmac
Collaborator

I agree 100%. First, I am amazed and perplexed that this even needs to be put out as a suggestion for people to vote on. 

 

Meaning that it should already be implemented, at least in the process of being implemented once it was realized it was missing.

Some things should be obvious that it needs to be implemented and should not require users to vote on them. 

I have made a few suggestions in the idea station that also should not have to accumulate support. Things that already should be.

 

 

It shows me that there is something missing in this whole process.

 

 

Imagine if the program did not have an Extrude tool, for example. Someone suggests it and we vote on it until it has enough support, it becomes a future consideration until one day we finally have an extrude tool. This is an obvious example where the functionality should have already been there, and if it was missing, should not requiire further support or votes to have it implemented. 

 

Fusion360 still feels like a toy. Things keep being added to the program like crazy but the basic functionality in my opinion is to make models, and that part of it is in dire need of maturation. And should not require us users to be telling you (fusion) this.

 

I suggest that this be implemented without any further votes required, like who do you got to smack. LOL.

 

I love the program and what can be done with it, but it's a real mix of 95% genius and 5% not so much. 

 

 

 

cekuhnen
Mentor

try to find scale in sketch good luck when you have SVG imports

donsmac
Collaborator

Hi cekuhnen, 

 

Exactly,

 

Unscalable Scalable Vector Graphics  

 

lol

 

@brianrepp see: @donsmac's comment

brianrepp
Community Manager

Hey guys - we're putting in place a new process for the IdeaStation by which all ideas will automatically go into Gathering Support (and no such thing as "New" category).  So, when I moved this idea to Gathering Support it was part of our effort to groom the backlog of New ideas and most importantly, archive ideas that didn't conform (bug reports, multiple ideas in one post, etc).  While I see how our behind the scenes processing of the backlog may have seemed a bit off, please understand that it doesn't necessarily mean we aren't technically waiting on votes to Accept or Implement some of these ideas, we simply haven't completed processing.  And to be clear, the IdeaStation is just one source of input to the Product Roadmap.  We're constantly having direct engagement with customers, active on the Forums, etc. to help direct our product development and prioritization.  Hope that helps clear things up a bit.

cekuhnen
Mentor

@brianrepp

 

Because Fusion is such a hit an miss very good tools and features and then so rudimentary and basic tools are missing it might be a good idea to think about a rough roadmap for the public where certain features are listed with a possible due date.

 

For example it is honestly crazy to think Fusion still has no rotate tool in sketch. I asked for that around 1 to 2 years ago?

 

The problem I see if after the initial wow of Fusion when you are envolved in a deep project things like extreme sketch engine refresh rate lag or no sketch rotate tool are honestly plain show stopers.

 

Just today we worked on a project and I wanted to do it in Fusion and in the end went back to Rhino because Fusion was just not able to do it.

 

With a public list or roadmap I htink you could better prepare prospect users for what to expect and current user to see when relieve is coming.

donsmac
Collaborator

Thanks a lot Brian.

 

Hi again cekuhnen, in the last couple of hours I have figured out how to scale an inserted SVG. I made a screencast. But here's the simplicity of it: get out of the timeline, turn it off. This also doesn't work if you try it in 'create base feature' mode.  

Here is a workaround to scaling an SVG:

1/ turn off the TimeLine History
2/ create a New Component in the browser
3/ activate the New Component
4/ create a sketch
5/ insert the SVG
6/ choose the New Component in the browser
7/ choose the scale tool and scale the SVG. You can also rotate it around and move it anywhere in 3D space using the 'Move' tool
If you want you can add a point anywhere in the sketch and choose that to scale around.

 

The same process can be used for rotating and scaling any sketch elements. I just tried it and works good: 


1/ turn off the TimeLine History
2/ create a New Component in the browser
3/ activate the New Component
4/ create a sketch coincident (or not) with the sketch that has the element you want to scale or rotate
5/ select 'Project Old' from the toolbar and click on the sketch elements to put them on the new sketch.
6/ choose the New Component in the browser
7/ choose the scale tool (or rotate tool) and scale (or rotate) the sketch element.


You can also add a point anywhere in the sketch and choose that to scale around.

 

 

cekuhnen
Mentor

Hi Donsmac that might work but I am not a big fan of workaround and hacks - things should work a common standard way specifcially when it is a simple function that is basic and a foundation.

 

For example it is honestly crazy to think Fusion still has no rotate tool in sketch. I asked for that around 1 to 2 years ago?

 

@brianrepp - that's a perfect example of a no-brainer that shouldn't require a vote or even any discussion. You should just see «there should be a rotate tool for sketches», think «oh yeah of course there should be», and immediately add it to the backlog. 

donsmac
Collaborator

I agree 100%. It's basic functionality that should have been there from the getgo, not ever an upcoming feature for a 3D modeling program, that's ridiculous. The ability to scale a body in world space and object space and to scale sketch geometry both uniformly and non-uniformly is basic. It does boggle the mind almost to the point you don't know what to say. 

cekuhnen
Mentor

when you go back to Alias to do the wirework then all this parametric talk and 2D sketches sounds like an archic and narrow process.

 

Obviously the 2D constraint solver has some terrific function like making sure lines are always vertical and such but honestly after two years in Fusion I feel this sketching process is not really the best tool or process for all projects. However to be fair this is not a Fusion only issue. I feel many of those tools are stuck in a workflow I as a designer do not want to be forced into.

 

As long as I create something the tools are good for perfect - but the moment you step out of the cube sphere geometry I feel this all falls apart like a card house.

 

A former student at a quite large US company now has to make a jump to ProE so it is easier for the engineers and the designers are shocked about how slow you can now only work when doing conceptual work there compared to Rhino.

 

 

Personally I dont mind the 2D sketch engine for areas where it fits perfectly into the need. So I am very curious about what next year will bring with the advanced modeling sketching tools.

 

If you ever touch Siemens NX or have a chance try it and you will see that it is a perfect hybrid of 2D sketch engine with real 3D freeform surfacing.

 

But I am not a programmer so I have no idea how hard things are. Plus the industry is incredibly slow to adapt.

haughec
Autodesk

There are a few enhancements being discussed in this thread.  To add a bit of clarity,

 

  • We do have the ability to rotate objects within a sketch (the Move tool provides a rotational manipulator)
  • No, we don't yet have the ability to rotate an entire sketch (but you should be able to rotate all entities within a sketch)
  • The original request in this submission, if I understand it correctly, is to be able to reorient the triad within the Scale command, correct?  This is a common workflow for form creation (and is possible on T-spline bodies using the Edit Form command), but it's less common in mechanical design (because your part/assembly is often aligned with the Origin).  I agree that that it's a good idea - we just need to prioritize against other projects & requests.

 

Thanks,

Charles

cekuhnen
Mentor

@haughec

 

He also mentioned scale and lets be honest that you cannot scale a sketch element in Fusion is odd.

 

AD also has to ask yourself do you want to make this a typical engineer like modeler or more accessible to designers.

 

 

I think with Fusion you have the change to break out of that stuff way of thinking nearly every of my design friends simply hate

hate because it is not efficient.

I don't expect things to be at the level of NX yet (though they should aspire to be there if not better) and I've not tried positioning an SVG logo in about a year (and I still can't launch F360 on my machine) so I can't speak to the current state of the app, but I do notice a bit of a meta thing that always bugs me. 

 

Very often with things like this, someone complains about some part of the app and then a team member shows up to placate them with something along the lines of «you can do X already and Y is important but we have to prioritize it».

 

I wouldn't even say not to say that, and maybe this is just me, but the general feeling I always get on reading those things is defensive and dismissive, bordering on blaming the user. It's not necessarily user-hostile, but it's definitely got the flavor of «this is just an id-ten-T problem» which, even if it is, suggests there is something wrong with the UI/UX of the app that you could actually improve. You don't have the power to fix the users but you can improve the app (and your response to user complaints).

 

Perhaps a better approach is to try to understand the source of their frustration - even (especially?) if it's just not being able to find something that's already there in the app, and then ask «what can we do to alleviate this?».

 

If one person is complaining, there areprobably countless others suffering in silence or giving up on the app. In a case where the frustration is just not finding something that works in the app, solving that removes a source of frustration and costs much less than building something new.

 

That's low-hanging fruit you should grab whenever possible and practical.

 

You could find and fix most of those things before even releasing the product into the field if you'd just do more (any?) internal testing with naive users. I told Srinath that at least a year ago and I'm convinced that (a) it'd find almost all of the crashes and nuisances that I've run into and (b) you're still not doing it.

cekuhnen
Mentor
I think you are too critical. I assume they just try to provide a walk around. Sure walk around are not ideal when a tool should be there for it specifically when it is basic. I stated before that o thing ad runs to fast trying to do cool things before making sure the foundation is good but we'll I trustbthemthat in a year fusion will be a killer with the planed advanced modeling tools.
promm
Alumni
Status changed to: RUG-jp審査通過

Thanks for submitting your idea! We're going to archive it due to the lack of votes and is not high on our list of prioritized projects. Combining the two tool is a good idea, however we are focused on functionality that completes workflows that we are missing right now.


Cheers,

 

Mike Prom

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