New EAGLE licensing

[jorge_garcia]

Hello Everyone,

In this post we will be briefly describing how the new subscription model for EAGLE works.

Firstly, the Autodesk licensing model is subscription based and the EAGLE paid license will require that you install the SW and then generate an account on accounts.autodesk.com to retrieve your license entitlement.   

If you lose your network connection, the SW has a 14-day heartbeat that will enable you to work offline for 14 days.

All of your data is stored locally, so you are in complete control of your data.

We will continue to provide the freeware version of EAGLE. In order to use it you will still need to register an account with Autodesk.

In an upcoming release we will be adjusting the software so in the worst case scenario, where internet is unavailable past 14 days, the software will revert to free mode. That way you can always review your designs.

You can review the current EAGLE pricing by visiting this page.

[Anonymous]

That is why I do not like things connected to the internet, I do also not like cloud and such, I need freedom who I do feel that is not so with software dependent of the internet, this problem is such one.

[Anonymous]

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@jorge.garcia wrote:

Hi @Anonymous,

I hope you're doing well. You are going to have to contact the sales department for this information. You can reach them by going here.

Let me know if there's anything else I can do for you.

Best Regards,

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Yes : Change the licencing system ! Please.

Yesterday, I needed a video editor and found one quite nice... but it was a subscription licence : so I went to another software. I agree to pay for a product : when I want a bike, I buy it : why should I pay all my life for the bike in my garage that I use once a month ?

Please stop this licencing politic.

[Anonymous]

Hi

The situation at our company is like this:

Eagle is dead and we are stuck with v6...

We can not have a subscription based model for software that are not part of our core business. We used v4, then upgraded to v6. We will never ever use a subscription based model for our PCB tool, for several reasons.

1. In the future we may want to switch cad tool. With a subscription based model, we would no longer be able to open and look at older designs made in Eagle. With the old model, we would always be guaranteed to have access to the software we used for designing a PCB.

Sorry Autodesk, but we will simply continue using v6 until something better appears and then we will leave Eagle.

2. A licence model that requires internet access!!?? Simply out of the question...

[jorge_garcia]

Hi le.autodesk,

Thank you for participating. Just want to make one small clarification on point #1. If you let your subscription expire EAGLE will revert to Freeware mode it won't just stop working. In that scenario you could always review your files and generate gerbers if necessary.

You know your business better than anyone, so we understand if this model doesn't fit at this point time.

Feel free to let me know if there's anything else I can do for you.

Best Regards,

[bmeyer8J5TU]

The situation at our company is like this:

Eagle is dead and we are stuck with v6...

We can not have a subscription based model for software that are not part of our core business. We used v4, then upgraded to v6. We will never ever use a subscription based model for our PCB tool, for several reasons.

1. In the future we may want to switch cad tool. With a subscription based model, we would no longer be able to open and look at older designs made in Eagle. With the old model, we would always be guaranteed to have access to the software we used for designing a PCB.

Sorry Autodesk, but we will simply continue using v6 until something better appears and then we will leave Eagle.

2. A licence model that requires internet access!!?? Simply out of the question...

I have no doubt that quite a few others (and organisations) are in a similar boat in regard to technical problems that their new licensing scheme has imposed.  

Autodesk has displayed a "stunning" lack of good form in keeping their current user based appraised in regard to what to do if the "new" rules and constraints that they want their user base to operate on don't fit.  

They simply don't say anything which has to be one of the most gutless, and spineless approaches to a PR problem that I have ever seen in my life.  

If they want to screw over the existing customer base, then at least be upfront and honest about it so that the customers can at least make plans and not sit on the sidelines.  

Now in regard to your problems with the software ... the "always connected" part sounds like it's the real sticking point (at least it was with us).  

As odd as it may sound, I wasn't so much bothered by the subscription model (though the way that they have done it by crippling the software after the subscription is over is a pretty low and unethical thing to do in my opinion ... but hey .. this is Autodesk ... can you expect anything less).  

So .. if the "new" model doesn't fit, and my now I'm about 99.9% sure that Autodesk isn't now gong to change their minds on this one, I would say that you need to a similar strategy as what we have ultimately done ... and that is to change product.  

I'll warn up you front though - if you've been working with Eagle for any length of time on any significant number of projects migrating isn't going to be a easy, simple, painless or cheap process (regardless of what others would like you to believe).  

There is going to be no shortage of pain, misery and suffering ... and lets not forget a not insignificant cost involved ... at least that is my experience so far.  

So all I can say is ... "good luck".  

In so far as Autodesk goes ... yeah ... this is their forum and I can't really say what I would so dearly *love* to say in regard to them but lets say it would be less than complimentary (it would include a multitude of "colourful metaphors" about them, their management, their PR and *especially* their licensing).  

/BGM

[Anonymous]

If you use Microsoft Windows, you don't really have any reason to complain about the relatively benign Autodesk. Will Autodesk become another Microsoft? I don't know, nor do I care, I won't be around anymore when that happens.

[Anonymous]

Hi all

I did download the newest eagle version but it do not open, just a white screen with a black sqaure in it where it hangs.

regards

kees

[jorge_garcia]

Hi @Anonymous,

I hope you're doing well. Thank you for posting on our forums. At this point there are a few things to try.

1) Try starting eagle using the eagle_SW_openGL.bat file that comes with EAGLE. You'll find it in it's installation directory.
2) Make sure that you don't have any Lavesoft software on your machine.
3) Do you have any special IT restrictions on your machine?
4) Update your video drivers.

Please let me know if there's anything else I can do for you.

Best Regards,

[Anonymous]

I agree 100%.  I feel like Cadsoft threw us all under the bus.  I've already spent a ton of money on the full version Eagle.  I'm not doing that again with Autodesk, nor am I going to start paying a monthly subscription fee.  Seems like KiCad might be the way to go now.

[Anonymous]

Folks!

There are several companies where I get my boards produced which accepted only Gerber and Eagle flies. All of them announced to accept KiCAD as well during the recent weeks. They are all located in Germany and Austria, where Eagle still has (had) a strong installed base there. Now more and more developers start moving away. The only pain is to covert several years of development to another platform. I hope Autodesk will offer traditional licensing as well. If that happens soon I'm willing to stay with eagle, and I'm willing to pay for upgrades as the years before. I started building up knowledge on KiCAD, the concept is quite different compared to eagle. If I'm forced to move over I will definitely not move back!

I have several customers who have a strict offline policy for their development department. The companies do that for security reasons - so no discussions about drilling holes in a firewall. There is no firewall they are unplugged! Some of my own development places are out of reach of an internet connection. What is the answer for this?

Arnold

[Anonymous]

I have move to kicad however it has not so much components as eagle, I do still not now why cadsoft do go to internet supporting software, I do nothing on designing through internet, I have a non internet pc for that.

There are more programs however components is sometimes a problem and need to make by yourselfs.

Diptrace is also nice.

regards

[jorge_garcia]

Hello Arnold,

I hope you're doing well. For now we don't have any solution for circumstances that are 100% air gapped(unplugged, no internet access period). The move to a subscription model is in-line with the rest of Autodesk.

Few places are truly air gapped, even government agencies and fortune-500 companies with very tight security have internet access (though restricted) for most of their engineering departments. We can work in a restricted environment but some level of connectivity has to be available for the new subscription model to be able to function.

More often than not the issue with the subscription model is not technical but rather ideological and there's nothing we can do about that other than to prove that the model is viable and that the tools we are providing justify working with this model.

Thank you for your comments, this forum is read and monitored by those in decision making positions.

Let me know if there's anything else I can do for you.

Best Regards,

[Anonymous]

'More often than not the issue with the subscription model is not technical but rather ideological and there's nothing we can do about that other than to prove that the model is viable and that the tools we are providing justify working with this model.'

The problem is when Autodesk introduces this model against the will of the customer, when the comapnies ideology gets imposed on on the customer. Being an Eagle user for years for me this is just a kick in the teeth. So many working hours will be lost and so many working hours will have to be spent on transfering the designs to the new non-Eagle platform i will have to use due to the ignorance of Autodesk.

[rachaelATWH4]

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@Anonymous wrote:

The problem is when Autodesk introduces this model against the will of the customer, when the comapnies ideology gets imposed on on the customer. Being an Eagle user for years for me this is just a kick in the teeth. So many working hours will be lost and so many working hours will have to be spent on transfering the designs to the new non-Eagle platform i will have to use due to the ignorance of Autodesk.

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I'm sorry but you don't NEED to spend any working hours migrating to another package. Your existing EAGLE licenses will still continue to work so there is no NEED to do anything else. If you don't like the subscription model then don't have a subscription and you can stick with what you have. Alternatively feel free to throw years of experience out and start fresh because you don't like the Autodesk model. It's ultimately your choice.

You might not like the subscription model but you can't deny that Autodesk has put more development into EAGLE in the last 6 months than had gone into it in many years previously, so they aren't just fleecing the customer for the subscription cash, they are putting their money where their mouth is.

There is a large amount of flogging of dead horses going on on this thread. It's about time people accepted that the subscription model is here to stay so we can all just move on.

Best Regards,

Rachael

[Anonymous]

Agree, I do mis the dos version of ultiboard, I have still have it.

But people can revert back to the older eagle version, where it is not yet on autodesk.

regards

[Anonymous]

@Anonymous wrote:

I agree 100%.  I feel like Cadsoft threw us all under the bus.  I've already spent a ton of money on the full version Eagle.  I'm not doing that again with Autodesk, nor am I going to start paying a monthly subscription fee.  Seems like KiCad might be the way to go now.

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How did Cadsoft throw anyone under the bus? Cadsoft was purchased by AutoDesk. They no longer have direct control over the licensing of the software. Consider the common argument here:

"I purchased this software and should be able to do what I want with it" <-- Great! That applies to your Version 7 license up until V8 came out as was always the case with the previous perpetual licence. "Perpetual" only for that major revision.

Now take that "right" and extend it to Autodesk. They purchased a company/software platform. They too have the right to market it as they choose once the obligations under the version/license that existed at the time of acquisition have lapsed. I personally have chosen<--keyword to stay with version 7.7 for now. I am looking into KiCAD and possibly contributing to it's development. Also, Circuit Studio, which, along with Altium, looks like the future of PCB design to me. However, as a Mac user, I'm not keen on having to run Windows based SW.

[Anonymous]

Do not make the mistake of attributing the additions to Eagle by Autodesk to the licencing scheme.  The additions came from the engineers and the company, not the licensing model.  The additions would have and will come regardless of the licensing model.  

If perpetual licences for the version at the time of purchase were given, people would be happy to pay.  This is how Pycharm licencing is done.  Once you pay for a version in their subscription model, the functionality of the software you purchased never changes.  If you don't continue paying, you only miss out on new features.

I believe that licencing in a way that cripples if you don't continue paying is morally wrong and here's why:

AS IN ANY RELATIONSHIP, IF ONE TRIES TO CONTROL THE

OTHER, THEY ARE NOT CONFIDENT IN THEMSELVES OR WHAT

THEY OFFER ENOUGH TO BELIEVE THE OTHER WILL STAY IF GIVEN

THE FREEDOM TO LEAVE.

Autodesk is controlling you by saying, if you don't pay, we'll take things away from you.  It is a tactic used by controlling individuals to curry loyalty, by abusive husbands to control wives, by inept bosses to control employees ,etc.  It's unhealthy and creates an environment of mistrust and anger.

If Autodesk believes in its products; if they believe that by what they bring to the table alone that customers will voluntarily stay, they they should show that through their agreements with their customers.

As an auto mechanic, one would expect to own their tools.  If they get laid off or somehow become unable to pay, a rental of tools would mean that they would be unable to move on.  I believe ephemeral services are perfect fits for non-perpetual licencing and fees.  Things like Netflix, Amazon Prime, etc. fit into this category.  I believe tools with specific uses and capabilities do not fit this model.  In this case, someone buys a utility, it should continue to work, un-tethered, without restriction as a physical tool does.

It's obvious here that Autodesk does NOT believe the products they offer will stand on their own and provide enough value that their customers would be loyal if given the opportunity to leave.

[rachaelATWH4]

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@Anonymous wrote:

Do not make the mistake of attributing the additions to Eagle by Autodesk to the licencing scheme.   

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I'm not.

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@Anonymous wrote:

The additions came from the engineers and the company, not the licensing model.  The additions would have and will come regardless of the licensing model.  

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Yes I agree, and Autodesk have likely thrown a lot more money at EAGLE than they have currently recouped in license subscriptions. 

All your arguments against the subscription model, and I don't necessarily disagree with them, have all been said before, many many many times, it's just rehashing the same thing over and over and over, and you know what? It'll make absolutely zero difference as subscription licensing is the way Autodesk license all their products, it's a company wide decision and not just something the EAGLE team decided to do on a whim.

So continue to flog the dead horse of the licensing debate if you like, but it'll likely make absolutely zero difference.

Best Regards,

Rachael

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:

Folks!

There are several companies where I get my boards produced which accepted only Gerber and Eagle flies. All of them announced to accept KiCAD as well during the recent weeks. They are all located in Germany and Austria, where Eagle still has (had) a strong installed base there. Now more and more developers start moving away. The only pain is to covert several years of development to another platform. I hope Autodesk will offer traditional licensing as well. If that happens soon I'm willing to stay with eagle, and I'm willing to pay for upgrades as the years before. I started building up knowledge on KiCAD, the concept is quite different compared to eagle. If I'm forced to move over I will definitely not move back!

I have several customers who have a strict offline policy for their development department. The companies do that for security reasons - so no discussions about drilling holes in a firewall. There is no firewall they are unplugged! Some of my own development places are out of reach of an internet connection. What is the answer for this?

Arnold

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I'm not sure why any board house would need the source Eagle design files. PCB fab machinery generally use Gerbers, or the newer ODB++ formats to "photo plot" the board layers. Perhaps the board house is doing additional design rule checking for you, but they should have tools that can do DFM directly on the Gerbers. The many layers in the design software are a tool for the designer to keep things separate until ultimately "flattening" groups of layers into Gerbers that machines use for fabrication. Ideally, a Gerber exported from Eagle, Allegro, Altium, KiCAD for the same design should be identical or at least contain the same collection of apertures and "objects". There should be no need for them to "Accept" KiCAD when they need only the Gerbers to create the fab layers. The place I order Fabs from only needs my copper layers, drill, solder mask, and silkscreen Gerbers zipped up. Milling layer if applicable, and paste layers if I order a stencil. I generate Fab and Assembly drawings for my own archival, but never send them to the fab vendor. If I'm getting SMT assembly, I also send a centroid, or "XY" file.

[Anonymous]

" So continue to flog the dead horse of the licensing debate if you like, but it'll likely make absolutely zero difference."

But its the most popular topic on the forums 🙂

It just goes to show how little this company cares about end users. I will not be upgrading or using any Autodessk software in the future.

I will also encourage others to do the same.