ref text in structure label missing when xref'd

[Anonymous]

I have a structure label consisting of 3 reference text, inverts in and out, and name.  Two of the reference text are for existing grade and proposed grade (referencing the respective surface).  The third is alignment station (for reasons that made this the easiest way to handle multiple alignments). 

All the profiles are in one file and built from surfaces, alignments, and pipe networks data sourced in from other base files.  All the labels with reference text populate correctly in the profiles dwg. 

When I xref the base files into production files the labels with reference text in the profiles are missing the values for the existing and proposed grades.  The reference text for the alignment station are fine. 

I have not yet understood why these surface references are broken.  I tried data sourcing the surfaces into the production files to no avail.  I have promoted the surfaces in the profiles base file which brought no joy either.

Does anyone know what is breaking the reference or logical next try?

Many thanks,

Fred

[Jay_B]

What happens if the file containing the structure labels is xrefd into a blank new drawing created from the same dwt?

[Anonymous]

Just followed your suggestion to see but had the same results.  A good idea though, thanks.  Do you have another?  I'm at a loss thus far.

[Mike.M.Carlson]

This is strange/frustrating.  Is it possible to annotate these structures from within the production sheet when the profile xref is attached?

If not, my only suggestion (which sucks) is to use Design Center to insert the production Layouts into the Profiles XREF and add these new layouts as the formal production sheets.  

Mike

[Anonymous]

It is aggravating to the point of making me say bad words.  LOL

Good idea.  I DS in the surfaces and tried to label the structure selecting the DS surface for EG and FG respectively and had the same results.  Arggg!

I've attempted several other "tries" including opening on other workstations to rule out those variables but still no joy.

I like the workaround you mentioned.  I've never worked with the design center so not sure of the sequence.  I'm thinking of bringing in the other xrefs, make a copy for each plot file, and adding the layout from the uncooperative plot file.  Yes it sucks but it will get it done.  

Would love a better way.  Recommendations?

[Mike.M.Carlson]

Ok good luck!  Just some follow up info on Design Center route.

You find it here:

Then you navigate to your Production Drawings that have the layout you want to bring into your Profile XREF dwg.  Continue to drill into the Production drawing itself and select Layouts.  Then you right click on the layout your want and insert into Profile drawing.

 

It should save some time bringing over all the plot settings etc for the Production Layouts already set up...you're just updating your Profile XREF with these Production Layouts for publishing.  

I hope this helps.

[Anonymous]

Yes it did.  I'll check out the design center, see it mentioned frequently.  In the mean time decided the quickest fix was to explode the problem labels down to mtext for this production round.  When/if design changes I'll just have to re-label.  I just don't have the time to fully rebuild the P-P sheets that have been done to date.

Many Thanks for the assist and info

[Anonymous]

Are the "reference surfaces" DREFed or XREFed into the original drawing?

This behavior would be expected if they are XREFed.  They do not travel.

If they are XREFed, DREF them into the drawing, you should be able to select the labels and change the reference surface.

It appears to be working for me by DREF.

Hope this gets it for you.

[Anonymous]

Originally the surfaces were data sourced into the "base profiles".  I have tried promoting them which I would have thought would cure all ill but that did not correct the issue either.

The "base profiles" is then xrefd into the production file where the reference label broke for the surface refs but not the station ref.  Then I tried to DS the surfaces into the production file, then promote them all with no luck.

I would like to understand this dynamic for future use however at this point must push ahead with production.

It almost acts as if the DS surfaces in the base file are overlays?  Some how those two references are broken when xrefd into another file.

[Anonymous]

Just want to put this back out there.  I'm back to it and have not found a fix.  Does anyone have any new thoughts on how to resolve this?

Many Thanks,

Fred

[Anonymous]

Any chance you can post some files?

[Anonymous]

I've cut these down pretty hard but left an example of the problem.

thanks for the help

[Anonymous]

So I looked at your drawings and here is what I think is going on:

Choosing a "Reference Surface" works on the plan view in the XREF (verified), because the Surface exists there.  I think in the Profile view, the surface exists as a sort of  reference rather than a representation of the surface.  When it is Xrefed, it loses the "reference".  Why Station still work, I am not really sure.

I don't know if I have a solution for you and I do see what you are trying to accomplish.  

You can for sure create the Finished Grade as it exists as part of the structure (along with the Station) This is easier than using reference surfaces (Insertion Rim Elevation). 

How you get the Existing Rim, is more of a puzzle.  You might consider adding a property to the part (haven't tried this myself, but I think it is in the XML in the Catalog) Or maybe two structures, existing and proposed.  You still wouldn't be able to create one label that showed both of these rims, at least by XREF.  It does work in plan though.

Hope that helps. 

[Anonymous]

same values "???"

[Anonymous]

Thanks for looking at it.  It's a pickle. 

[DarinSable6976]

Fred,

I know this is a late post.

I think it has something to do with the Visretain system variable in C3D 2017 & 2018.

If Visretain is set to 0 then all Civil 3D objects and labels display/load correctly when xreferenced.

After setting Visretain to 0, reload the xreference.

If you set Visretain back to 1 the problem starts all over again.

My preference is to have Visretain set to 1.

I am still looking for a solution to having Visretain set to 1 and have the source drawing display correctly when xreferenced.

Darin

[Anonymous]

I accidentally commented on wrong thing. I don't know how to delete this

[jade.samuel]

I know this thread is quite old, but I wanted to note that in C3D 2023, the issue persists.

I have created a profile label style for MH structures that includes reference text that references the floodplain elevation at a structure's location. Unfortunately, this reference text only works correctly within the dwg where the structure "lives" but does not work in a production dwg where that structure is shown through an XREF. Even if I data shortcut the floodplain surface into the production file, the label does not work, seemingly because the structure itself does is not hosted in the production dwg.

I wanted to point this out so others running into this issue might have more information for updated versions of C3D and can build on this information and (hopefully) eventually work toward a solution.