Advance Volume

rsalastopografia
Advocate

Advance Volume

rsalastopografia
Advocate
Advocate

Good afternoon dear community, I turn to this forum in search of help on a topic related to advance volume by the surface comparison method. In the file I have 3 surfaces (1. Initial land surface, Design surface and progress surface in work) and I need the appropriate procedure to obtain a precise volume by the mentioned method, in such a way that when calculating by sections it returns the same data. Currently, the company with whom I collected data requests that the surface purchasing method be applied to obtain volume measurement. Below I detail with images:

 

rsalastopografia_0-1729980688954.png

In this image cut from a longitudinal profile we can see 3 lines (corresponds to the initial surface, design and advance) and a fill hatch, I want to obtain my advance volume (red line) by the surface comparison method which is It makes it complicated for me with 3 surfaces.

 

rsalastopografia_1-1729981133447.png

In the following image cut from a longitudinal profile we can see 3 lines (corresponds to the initial surface, design and advance) and a cutting width, I want to obtain my advance volume (red line) by the surface comparison method taking as data 3 surfaces. Additionally, I was wondering if in 3D civil, using the surface comparison method, I can obtain measurements only of cutting and independently of filling, or in any case what would be the appropriate procedure in this case to obtain my volume and that it does not differ with the cross-section method? . I hope you can read my case and provide me with the timely help; Greetings, Attached Dwg file.

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Joe-Bouza
Mentor
Mentor

Hi @rsalastopografia you are welcome.

 

What to you mean by variations? It has always been my understanding that surface to surface surface comparison is the most accurate. It is pure integration. 

 

What are you comparing it to, Average end area? You will never get these to match.

 

It has been my experience if the resulting volumes are not in the range I expect , it can almost certainly be traced to a bust in one or more Tin surface. One errant triangle can change the order of magnitude.

 

Turn on you triangle, view from different perspectives

 

I would view these areas as suspiciously inconsistent, compared to the rest of the triangulation.

  I believe these are in the FG : REPERFILADO 4TA ETAPA

JoeBouza_0-1730398981044.png

 

Joe Bouza
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rsalastopografia
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Advocate

What do you mean by variations? I was referring to the volume results obtained when making the comparisons that you indicated, they are not precise, the results are many hundreds of cubic meters different. I must cube my advance surface only within the FG (4th stage reprofiling), so I make longitudinal profiles projecting the initial terrain, design (FG) and advance surfaces. The advance surface outside the design (FG) is clearly observed in some sections; Therefore, it is required to cube the volume only within the design. I hope you understand my answer, greetings.

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Joe-Bouza
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the triangulation interval are mostly uniform except those area. might throw off results.

 

what are you comparing to that you can say it is off by a great amount?

 

https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/civil-3d-forum/how-accurate-are-the-calculated-volumes/td-p/8533260

Joe Bouza
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rsalastopografia
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Advocate

A question, with the calculation that you made through your surface comparisons; Did you get the volume I require from my advance? I will upload images below (the volume outlined in blue is required). I hope Google is translating correctly.
1. brown line: initial land surface (EG-TN PAD).
2. magenta line: design surface (FG-REPROFILATING 4TH STAGE).
3. red line: advance surface (Advance Sup).

CORTE 01_A.png

 the volume outlined in blue is required

RELLENO 01_A.png

 the volume outlined in blue is required

CORTE 02_A.png

 the volume outlined in blue is required

RELLENO 02_A.png

 the volume outlined in blue is required

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Joe-Bouza
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I looked at it differently.

make another volume surface with 

EG as base and advanced as comparison and you will have that volume 

Joe Bouza
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rsalastopografia
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Advocate

When comparing surfaces (EG vs AVANCE) according to your suggestion, the result would not be the volume I require and you can analyze it with the images I uploaded and even with the DWG file. It is a special case that cannot yet be resolved by the surface comparison method. It is not about choosing any surface and comparing it with another, it requires more analysis.

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Joe-Bouza
Mentor
Mentor

Not sure why not. You first picture clearly shows the comparison of EG vs advance.

 

then each of your subsequent  sketches show the volume between two surfaces.

 

sorry I’m not full understanding but it looked clear to me

Joe Bouza
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rsalastopografia
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Advocate
Requiere mas análisis para resolver mi caso, no es correcto su sugerencia; saludos.

fcernst
Mentor
Mentor

You don’t say what your section sampling interval is.. the smaller your delta x sampling interval is.. the closer it will approximate your surface composite volume calculation. 



Fred Ernst, PE
C3D 2025
Ernst Engineering
www.ernstengineering.com
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rsalastopografia
Advocate
Advocate

In my case, the volume calculation by the method of cross sections is not applied. The question is to resolve my case by the surface comparison method by performing a good analysis. The calculated volume should be similar if the method of cross sections were used. ; This is the only way to guarantee that the result of the surface comparison is optimal. The longitudinal profiles were generated to project the surfaces and perform an analysis to obtain the desired volume by the aforementioned method, greetings.

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Joe-Bouza
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Mentor

I know we have a small language barrier but you have not explained why the volume surfaces are incorrect. Saying they need more analysis is confusing 

 

Requires more analysis required more explanation.


Volume surface compared two surfaces no more. The accuracy of the surface comparison is completely based on the accuracy of the surfaces.

 

you can read up on the accuracy of each method. 

I still don’t understand why the comparison shown are not correct. They are the comparison you sketched. Not all but some.

 

what exactly is the answer you are trying to get? I am very interested 

 

is my interpretation of “advanced surface” = to earthwork progress in the field?

Joe Bouza
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rsalastopografia
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Advocate

To clear up any doubts, calculate the volume by the 2 methods (comparison of surfaces, cross sections), you will notice that your suggestion is quite wrong, it is not about comparing any surface without analyzing what you want to obtain. Explain through images (blue hatching-volume required) what you want to obtain, you can also see in the dwg file; A thorough analysis is required, observing the projections of the surfaces in the longitudinal profiles to finally see how what is requested is achieved (real volume within the design), I hope it is understood.

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Joe-Bouza
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Mentor

No it is not understood. And I do not think I am alone. We have had several very experienced users try unsuccessfully. I’m afraid we don’t understand your goal.

sorry

Joe Bouza
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Joe-Bouza
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Apparently this is the wrong way of thinking if it

Joe Bouza
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teerawat.pSCHYQ
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Advocate

if you would like to know how obtain volume that need to go, basically yo can do comparison surfaces as following like this.

1. you have the existing ground surface that call "TN-PD" , this surface not need to edit anything

2. you already have design surface that call "REPERFILADO 4TA ETAPA" this is no need to edit

3. then you have progress surface that call "Sub_Avance" this surface also do not edit anyting.

4.  then you make a new surface that maybe call "Existing Ground + Progress surface" 

5. then Edits "Existing Ground + Progress surface" by paste surface "TN-PD" first

6. Then Edits "Existing Ground + Progress surface" again by paste surface by "Sub_Avance", then your "Existing Ground + Progress surface" updated.

7. do Surface Analysis between "Existing Ground + Progress surface" and Design surface "REPERFILADO 4TA ETAPA"  

8. after that you will see current cut and fill, after that you will comparison these value with original value.

 

these process should be meet your question.

 

Joe-Bouza
Mentor
Mentor

I believe this will give good answers. Sounds similar to making three volume surfaces as I earlier described, leaving a simple hand calculation in the end.

 

very good 

Joe Bouza
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rsalastopografia
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Hello dear, thank you for taking the time to resolve my case. Please could you be more detailed in the last points, carry out the entire process up to point 6. I attach the image.

rsalastopografia_0-1730736152526.png

 

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rsalastopografia
Advocate
Advocate

Keep in mind, the volume you want to obtain is shaded in blue with lines (I hope Google translates well), I attach images.

1. brown line: initial terrain surface (EG-TN PAD).
2. magenta line: design surface (FG-reprofiled 4TH STAGE).
3. red line: advance surface (Advance Sup).

CORTE 01_A.png

 volume shaded in blue (lines) is required

RELLENO 01_A.png

 volume shaded in blue (lines) is required

CORTE 02_A.png

 volume shaded in blue (lines) is required

RELLENO 02_A.png

 volume shaded in blue (lines) is required

Previously, make the observation by comparing the initial land surface vs. advance surface; However, it was not possible to obtain the volume explained in the images. With that comparison you are going to calculate in a general way and that is not the point; I want to obtain the volume that is within the design (blue shading with lines). I hope your method is more effective and meets what is required, thanks for the contribution (I am using Google Translate).

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Joe-Bouza
Mentor
Mentor

you want the volume comparisson between design and progress. that is the volume surface to make.

 

I compared EG to Progress 

and EG to FG

 

if you subtract the two you get FG to progress

 

All your requirements are achievable, defining the stratum is all that has to be done.

keep in mind, when you create a stratum there is no calculation where one surface is and another surface is not

Joe Bouza
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rsalastopografia
Advocate
Advocate

Good evening, I appreciate your help in trying to solve my case. I carried out the procedure with your suggestions, however when reconciling volume measurement with supervision I came across a huge difference. I think the C3D surface comparison tool still needs to be improved to achieve a good calculation. I attach images.

Vol Real.PNG

 supervision volume measurement.

Vol Calculado.PNG

 calculated volume

I would appreciate if someone from the forum shares any C3D technique related to surface comparison to perform a good calculation, greetings.

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We use AgrantSEM to deploy digital advertising on sites supported by AgrantSEM. Ads are based on both AgrantSEM data and behavioral data that we collect while you’re on our sites. The data we collect may include pages you’ve visited, trials you’ve initiated, videos you’ve played, purchases you’ve made, and your IP address or device ID. This information may be combined with data that AgrantSEM has collected from you. We use the data that we provide to AgrantSEM to better customize your digital advertising experience and present you with more relevant ads. AgrantSEM Privacy Policy
Bidtellect
We use Bidtellect to deploy digital advertising on sites supported by Bidtellect. Ads are based on both Bidtellect data and behavioral data that we collect while you’re on our sites. The data we collect may include pages you’ve visited, trials you’ve initiated, videos you’ve played, purchases you’ve made, and your IP address or device ID. This information may be combined with data that Bidtellect has collected from you. We use the data that we provide to Bidtellect to better customize your digital advertising experience and present you with more relevant ads. Bidtellect Privacy Policy
Bing
We use Bing to deploy digital advertising on sites supported by Bing. Ads are based on both Bing data and behavioral data that we collect while you’re on our sites. The data we collect may include pages you’ve visited, trials you’ve initiated, videos you’ve played, purchases you’ve made, and your IP address or device ID. This information may be combined with data that Bing has collected from you. We use the data that we provide to Bing to better customize your digital advertising experience and present you with more relevant ads. Bing Privacy Policy
G2Crowd
We use G2Crowd to deploy digital advertising on sites supported by G2Crowd. Ads are based on both G2Crowd data and behavioral data that we collect while you’re on our sites. The data we collect may include pages you’ve visited, trials you’ve initiated, videos you’ve played, purchases you’ve made, and your IP address or device ID. This information may be combined with data that G2Crowd has collected from you. We use the data that we provide to G2Crowd to better customize your digital advertising experience and present you with more relevant ads. G2Crowd Privacy Policy
NMPI Display
We use NMPI Display to deploy digital advertising on sites supported by NMPI Display. Ads are based on both NMPI Display data and behavioral data that we collect while you’re on our sites. The data we collect may include pages you’ve visited, trials you’ve initiated, videos you’ve played, purchases you’ve made, and your IP address or device ID. This information may be combined with data that NMPI Display has collected from you. We use the data that we provide to NMPI Display to better customize your digital advertising experience and present you with more relevant ads. NMPI Display Privacy Policy
VK
We use VK to deploy digital advertising on sites supported by VK. Ads are based on both VK data and behavioral data that we collect while you’re on our sites. The data we collect may include pages you’ve visited, trials you’ve initiated, videos you’ve played, purchases you’ve made, and your IP address or device ID. This information may be combined with data that VK has collected from you. We use the data that we provide to VK to better customize your digital advertising experience and present you with more relevant ads. VK Privacy Policy
Adobe Target
We use Adobe Target to test new features on our sites and customize your experience of these features. To do this, we collect behavioral data while you’re on our sites. This data may include pages you’ve visited, trials you’ve initiated, videos you’ve played, purchases you’ve made, your IP address or device ID, your Autodesk ID, and others. You may experience a different version of our sites based on feature testing, or view personalized content based on your visitor attributes. Adobe Target Privacy Policy
Google Analytics (Advertising)
We use Google Analytics (Advertising) to deploy digital advertising on sites supported by Google Analytics (Advertising). Ads are based on both Google Analytics (Advertising) data and behavioral data that we collect while you’re on our sites. The data we collect may include pages you’ve visited, trials you’ve initiated, videos you’ve played, purchases you’ve made, and your IP address or device ID. This information may be combined with data that Google Analytics (Advertising) has collected from you. We use the data that we provide to Google Analytics (Advertising) to better customize your digital advertising experience and present you with more relevant ads. Google Analytics (Advertising) Privacy Policy
Trendkite
We use Trendkite to deploy digital advertising on sites supported by Trendkite. Ads are based on both Trendkite data and behavioral data that we collect while you’re on our sites. The data we collect may include pages you’ve visited, trials you’ve initiated, videos you’ve played, purchases you’ve made, and your IP address or device ID. This information may be combined with data that Trendkite has collected from you. We use the data that we provide to Trendkite to better customize your digital advertising experience and present you with more relevant ads. Trendkite Privacy Policy
Hotjar
We use Hotjar to deploy digital advertising on sites supported by Hotjar. Ads are based on both Hotjar data and behavioral data that we collect while you’re on our sites. The data we collect may include pages you’ve visited, trials you’ve initiated, videos you’ve played, purchases you’ve made, and your IP address or device ID. This information may be combined with data that Hotjar has collected from you. We use the data that we provide to Hotjar to better customize your digital advertising experience and present you with more relevant ads. Hotjar Privacy Policy
6 Sense
We use 6 Sense to deploy digital advertising on sites supported by 6 Sense. Ads are based on both 6 Sense data and behavioral data that we collect while you’re on our sites. The data we collect may include pages you’ve visited, trials you’ve initiated, videos you’ve played, purchases you’ve made, and your IP address or device ID. This information may be combined with data that 6 Sense has collected from you. We use the data that we provide to 6 Sense to better customize your digital advertising experience and present you with more relevant ads. 6 Sense Privacy Policy
Terminus
We use Terminus to deploy digital advertising on sites supported by Terminus. Ads are based on both Terminus data and behavioral data that we collect while you’re on our sites. The data we collect may include pages you’ve visited, trials you’ve initiated, videos you’ve played, purchases you’ve made, and your IP address or device ID. This information may be combined with data that Terminus has collected from you. We use the data that we provide to Terminus to better customize your digital advertising experience and present you with more relevant ads. Terminus Privacy Policy
StackAdapt
We use StackAdapt to deploy digital advertising on sites supported by StackAdapt. Ads are based on both StackAdapt data and behavioral data that we collect while you’re on our sites. The data we collect may include pages you’ve visited, trials you’ve initiated, videos you’ve played, purchases you’ve made, and your IP address or device ID. This information may be combined with data that StackAdapt has collected from you. We use the data that we provide to StackAdapt to better customize your digital advertising experience and present you with more relevant ads. StackAdapt Privacy Policy
The Trade Desk
We use The Trade Desk to deploy digital advertising on sites supported by The Trade Desk. Ads are based on both The Trade Desk data and behavioral data that we collect while you’re on our sites. The data we collect may include pages you’ve visited, trials you’ve initiated, videos you’ve played, purchases you’ve made, and your IP address or device ID. This information may be combined with data that The Trade Desk has collected from you. We use the data that we provide to The Trade Desk to better customize your digital advertising experience and present you with more relevant ads. The Trade Desk Privacy Policy
RollWorks
We use RollWorks to deploy digital advertising on sites supported by RollWorks. Ads are based on both RollWorks data and behavioral data that we collect while you’re on our sites. The data we collect may include pages you’ve visited, trials you’ve initiated, videos you’ve played, purchases you’ve made, and your IP address or device ID. This information may be combined with data that RollWorks has collected from you. We use the data that we provide to RollWorks to better customize your digital advertising experience and present you with more relevant ads. RollWorks Privacy Policy

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