4K tv as monitor.

[AllenJessup]

One of my old Dell 2001FP 20" monitors is starting to fail. I asked if I could get 2 new 

Dell 25" UltraSharp Monitor: U2518D. My boss wants to try buying a 40-50" 4k UHD HDR TV to use as a single monitor. I've done some research online and it looks like it's possible and if the TV has the correct specs it would be OK.

Does anyone have any experience with using Civil 3D with a TV as a Monitor?

[AllenJessup]

www.displayspecifications.com

Found that in one of my Google results. I don't remember the phrase I was searching.

BTW. The chart was my own creation. But you can do extensive between TVs. See attached

[ChrisRS]

I am a little surprised that Pixels per inch (PPI) has not come up in this discussion.

Screen size and and screen resolution both impact the viewing experience. PPI is a good indicator. 

A desktop setup typically has the monitor at arms distance. Eye to screen distance for my standing desk setup is 24". 

Don't be confused by  phone PPI discussions; phone viewing distance is about 12"

.

Allen' s Dell 2001FP is a 20.1" monitor with 1600 x 1200 native resolution yielding 100 PPI.

My Lenovo Laptop is 17" with 1920 x 1080 native resolution yielding 130 PPI.

I am comfortable using Civil 3D with no display scaling. The UI scale is about as small as I could tolerate.

Keep in mind that eye to screen distance is shorter with a laptop than a desktop setup.
(This is a preference. I am 60+ years old with good corrected vision. Your mileage may vary.)

A 42" 4K TV is 105 PPI, which is a little greater than Allen's Dell 2001FP.

A 46" 4K TV is 95 PPI, which is not quite as good as Allen's Dell 2001FP.
(I do not know if the difference would be noticeable.)

A 50" 4K TV will have a dpi of 88, which i find acceptable.
(This screen is large enough that a 24" x 36" drawing can be viewed full size.)

Link to screen calculator: https://www.sven.de/dpi/ 

[AllenJessup]

Thanks for the information. The PPI wasn't mentioned here. But an IT tech I spoke to had mentioned it. Thank you for setting it all out so well. I'm sure a 42" at 105 PPI wouldn't be noticeably different from my Dell 2011FPs.

When/IF we ever get one. I'll let you know.

[PeterKozub]

I have run Asus 4k now for about 4 years and could not be more pleased

The key is that

1 ) the asus are computer monitors for CAD etc no work arounds

2)  Asus  are made to run best on display ports being computer monitors

3) the nvidia K 6000 has the power to run two 4 k at once and 

4) the output from DVI / HDMI does not seem to be as good as display port

5) Display port is the standard now for CAD so why go to some other port style

6) see attached image autocad inventor on right monitor and C3D 2017 on left

     note the toolspace, ribbon, command line and on right inventor browser

I tried 3 4K assus for a while and i just got a sore neck looking side to side unless one could stack  the 3rd monitor on top.

So the ideal layout would be 2 8K with a video card with 6 display port capability

in case you stack monitors with some custom stand

I have never had any issues with 2 4k on display port resolution wise for my 59 year old eyes

Pete

[Pointdump]

Allen,
Thanks for the link.
I've been reading that if your graphics card doesn't support HDMI 2.1, or if you're not shooting a 4K signal to the TeeVee, you won't be able to use Schema Subsampling 4:4:4. Is there no end? I'm about ready to just buy something and see if it suits me.
Dave

[Pointdump]

Pete,
I can't find a dedicated 55" computer monitor, so I'm looking at TeeVees. As for 8K, not all Autodesk products work with even 4K, so 8K would be BEGGING for trouble. I really regret pitching my old 36" 1080P monitor.
Dave

[ChrisRS]

What size monitors are you using?

I am glad that your setup works for you. 

Civil 3D, is largely 2D views of line work. Other that jagged lines, what is the advantage of 8K? On the same size monitor, it seems to me that The UI will be half size and lines thinner. I do not know if the higher resolution will have a negative impact on performance.

My experience is that a 4K TV is "Good Enough" for me.

That does not means that "Better" does not exist.

[PeterKozub]

Hi

32 inch diagonal measure  asus 4k two at a time not 3 as in attached image

I would down load the image i attach in my first post not this old photo

so down load first image not this post image

first post is a screen capture of both monitors

running inventor 2018 and C3D 2017 at same time on two asus 32 inch 4 k

can you see any problems ? ie lack of clarity etc

Use the download buttom right to get the best screen shot

after one clicks on the above image

to best view the image everything looks crisp nice to me

Pete

[AllenJessup]

@PeterKozub 

I agree that what you have is one of the better choices, if not the best. However a 32" Asus 4K monitor cost around $800. We usually don't get the best here. My computer desk is an old reference table salvaged from surplus. My desk is battleship gray of a style you might have seen in a 50 year old movie. My phone is from when they first introduced touch-tone dialing. Where they just slapped a keypad where the rotary dial used to go. I have a corner spot where I'm surrounded by single pane, un-insulated, windows. The new computers they just installed to be compatible with Windows 10 (for non-CAD users) probably didn't cost much more than $800.

I'll have to show whether a TV is go or no-go before asking for even a $700 monitor. The reason it will be a Dell is that they are on the state contract.

[ChrisRS]

Thanks, @PeterKozub. 

A 32" monitor at 4K is 138 PPI.

My 17" laptop at 1080p is 130 PPI.

UI elements and dialog boxes on the 32" monitor would be sharper, but about 5% smaller than on my laptop. I am sure that I would find this readable.

I think that 8K on a similar sized monitor would require display scaling.

There does not appear to be a downloadable image file attached to your previous post. The embedded image is low resolution.

For comparison, here is the image from my previous post.  (Message 9 of this thread.)

https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/civil-3d-forum/4k-tv-as-monitor/td-p/7969548?attachment-id=688117 

[PeterKozub]

Hi 

Here is the image reattached

note open the image and at bottom right is a button to

down load the screen shot " capture" a best resolution

Again

Note open the image

Next

THEN at bottom right is a pick buttom to down load the best image

send me your email and i will send the image versus using this SITE

Thanks for your patience

Regards Pete

[ChrisRS]

Thanks, Peter.

The images looks really good.

I did not know that the embedded images could be downloaded.

[dj8TAPQ]

Three monitors is way too much for any type of CAD work, if you are really working

[rl_jackson]

I have zero issues having C3D on 1 then menus/properties/layers/research/edge and other stuff on the other, all while having outlook and teams on the last one and I'm still looking for more space.

[AllenJessup]

---

@dj8TAPQ wrote:
Three monitors is way too much for any type of CAD work, if you are really working

---

I think that would be a personal choice. When I'm working on grading. I like to stretch Civil 3D across both my monitors. A 2D view on one and a 3D view on the other. I've often wished for a small monitor to have some text, a spreadsheet or even this forum open on it.

[kevinluebbert1851]

Whatever happened to the 4K TV as monitor? I have seen some people bring in a 32" or bigger TV and it looked awkward to me (colors and line shadowing and such). They seem to suffice for doing a demo in the boardroom, but to work on?

I always say to follow this order for the budget of CAD monitors:

1. Buy the best monitor you can. Huge difference in $100 vs. $250 vs. $700 in image quality.

2. Buy the biggest monitor you can. Of course.

3. Buy the most monitors you can. I like 2 (old school). More and more people like 3 or more. Video card dependent.

[ChrisRS]

I cannot answer for Allen, but I am still happy with my 50" 4K TV. (See PPI discussion in post 42 of this thread.)

I'm sure that dedicated monitors have advantages, but I am satisfied. Sometimes Good Enough ... Is Enough.

Be sure to use game mode, or whatever TV setting minimizes fussing with the signal.

The size is awkward in that from an arm's length working distance I cannot view the entire screen without turning my head. To overcome that, I use a program called "Display Fusion" to partition my tv into multiple virtual monitors.* The AutoCAD/C3D window gets about 2/3 of the display. (2350 x 1440 = 32" diagonal)
When zoomed out to full screen I can see a 24" x 36" at full scale for checking!

The following is my display configured for a standing position. I just ignore the peripheral information. Display fusion has settings to blank or fade the non-active screens. I have not tried that.
My wife and I, mostly her, have reared four children: Now apparently stable and productive adults.
The ability to screen out peripheral distractions is a well-honed defense mechanism.

A PNG file of this 4K image is attached. Copy this to a thumb drive and you will be able to view it on various TVs. In Phoenix, both Costco and Best Buy have allowed this. Both have said that I could bring in my laptop and try running AutoCAD/Civil 3D. Remember to bring your own HDMI Cable and a mouse. It would be best to avoid the store's "busy" hours. You will probably need access to the remote control and will need customer assistance to find it. Say Please and Thank You. Consider buying local/brick-and-mortar if you can.

If you try this, please report back!

Advantages of a Humongitor.

• 4K TVs are cheap.
• One cable - simpler graphics card.
• Can serve as a huge monitor.
• Can serve as Multiple Virtual Monitors.
• Good enough!
• Did I say cheap?

Disadvantages of a Monitor.

• Color range.
• Absolutely not best in class.
• I'm sure there are others.
• Not Good enough!
• Inability to boast "My monitor can beat up your monitor!"

Personal preferences matter here. Your mileage may vary.

Note: I recently set up a friend (65 years old realtor) with a 1080P 32" TV as a monitor. It is only 69 DPI but works well for Word, Excel, and Email. We were both satisfied, but no way would I try to use it for AutoCAD.

* Windows 10 and to a greater extent Windows 11 have some limited screen-splitting capabilities. Some graphics cards do as well. Display Fusion ($35 to $49 lifetime license) is not cheap but I find it well worthwhile. Check for discounts.

  

Edit 2011-10-31 Added missing attachment.