Terminal Strip Editor - Added Footprint Blocks Misaligned

[stephen.cudmore]

Hi there,

I'm using ACADE 2017 and I'm having an issue with the terminal strip editor not lining up custom blocks properly that I've added to using footprint database editor. Picture below.

I created the terminal strip before adding the blocks to the footprint database and had no issue with the terminal blocks being lined up properly when it was using the stock blocks that the terminal strip selected. Now that I've added the catalog data and my own block files to the footprint database, I'm able to see the new footprint graphics in the preview window but things aren't lining up well. I have a feeling the block file needs to be modified to fix this but I'm not sure what to do.

Thanks in advance,

Steve

[Icemanau · Accepted solution]

OK, it looks like your base point of the block is not located properly.

Open the block's dwg file and type BASE on the command line.

Now select the new base point of the block. In the case of the block used for the terminal endplate, it should be in the centre of the top edge of the block.

As a suggestion, also run the PURGE and OVERKILL commands on all blocks you create to remove any extraneous data in the block itself.

Save the block and then either update the existing block in your main dwg or run a purge and just remove any unused blocks before trying to run the TSE again.

Regards Brad

[Anonymous]

Wait a second, you can designate terminal footprint blocks specific based on part number? I thought there was 2 or 3 profiles, a single layer, double layer, 3 layer??

[robert_creel]

---

@Anonymouswrote:

Wait a second, you can designate terminal footprint blocks specific based on part number? I thought there was 2 or 3 profiles, a single layer, double layer, 3 layer??

---

Oh yes---all types of terminal blocks and hardware---thermocouple, fuse, partitions, end anchors, etc.

You can download drawings from manufacturers and massage them a little. Some of the terminal blocks provided are generic; some are detailed already.

Tip---if you use Weidmuller blocks; a lot of them are more simple.........but Weidmuller makes AB blocks----and most of those are more accurate. Change the Weidmuller part numbers to point to the AB drawin

i.e. -- AB  1492-H4 = Weidmuller  18804x0000

[jseefdrumr]

The purpose of any footprint, whether it's for a terminal or a VFD, is to give you an accurate representation of a component for your panel layout.

This allows you to place the component footprints into a drawing and THEN try to see what size enclosure they'll fit in. If all the terminals, from all the manufacturers, were forced into using only 2 or 3 different footprints, we would lose that level of precision. Other things factor into this too -- for instance, I have a set distance that I like to maintain between the terminals and the wireway. I have to know the dimensions of the terminals in order to be sure that I lay the wireway far enough from the DIN rail.

We've had machines and retrofit installations that required me to make terminal strips in advance, to see if we had enough room in an existing enclosure. Having accurate terminal footprints showed us that we needed to use multi-level terminals in a few cases where we had intended to use single-levels.

IMO, all footprints, regardless of what type of component they are, should at the minimum be dimensionally accurate. Whenever possible, the graphics should also match the physical appearance of the part.

In order to make this happen, I don't use any of the footprints supplied with the software. These drawings are generally easy to find on the manufacturer's websites, and are generally more accurate than what comes with ACADE (some of those footprint blocks are really old, and some products no longer look the same as they did when ACADE first got its libraries). (Also, there are zillions of products out there now that have hit the market since those libraries came out. We use lots of things that were never in the ACADE libraries to begin with.)

Jim

[Anonymous]

I guess what I was asking is where do I define the Block name utilized for the graphical terminal strip editor? I assume this is within the Catalog Database relative to the catalog #, which column?  

My company uses the Graphical Terminal Strip Editor to show the wiring on a TB for a customer / wire man to use. Because of this use many times the graphical terminal strip is inserted with various scales (to match annotation scale) to ensure legibility. Unfortunately you cannot create copies of this import (one for the wire man to use and one for the panel footprint) otherwise the database doubles up the qty. 

Also note using it the way we do allow the smart links to be large enough for someone to actually use when trying to locate the terminal block within the schematic. 

See Attached Pictures

We also use the Tabular Terminal Strip Table Object to create Wire Labels with some external scripts. Not everybody uses wire numbers, our labels provide source / destination information. Doing this per TB ensures we are making a relative Label List ease trying to find a single label within 2000 labels printed for a panel. The negative about this method is only things touching a TB gets a label. 

[jseefdrumr]

There is a tool meant specifically for defining which footprints get used for which part numbers. It is called the Footprint Database Editor, and it is found at Panel>Other Tools. Once you have the correct footprints created, use this tool to link those drawings with part numbers in the catalog. (Note, the footprint database is a separate file from the catalog database.)

As far as depicting a terminal strip in more than one drawing, I personally do this using external references. My terminal strips always go in the panel layout drawings. So, if I need to show a close-up view of them, I use this workflow:
*Set up a new, blank project drawing. (For me, these get lumped in with 'detail drawings'.)
*Attach my panel layout drawing as an external reference.
*Set up a paperspace viewport for each terminal strip in that panel.

The advantages here are:
*If the panel layout should ever change, I can update my detail drawings simply by reloading the Xref.
*Physical scale isn't an issue because it's controlled by the viewports.
*No duplication of catalog quantities.
*I don't have to bother with creating/managing blocks of the terminal strips (which sometimes change).

Hope this helps,
Jim

[Icemanau]

Some manufacturers release multiple terminals that are identical except for colour and part number.

You can use one dwg for multiple different components in cases like this but if the dimensions are different, then you really need the correct representation.

At a minimum, you need a rectangle which matches the dimensions of the terminal (or accessory), anything other than that is getting fancy. While they look great, trying to create or find such a block while in a time crunch can be a headache.

Regards Brad

[Anonymous]

Thanks for all the responses guys / gals, sorry I kind of hijacked this thread; however, the first response hit the nail on the head. 

With the workflow of using a drawing with Xref, I am wondering if the batch plot PDF data links still work? I can see this being a bit cumbersome as when Xrefs are used you are linking the entire file, you would have to Xclip to ensure the panel footprint detail doesn't include the extra components on the drawing / the wire notations. I will have to give this a go and see how well it plays. My company manually manages Panel Layout / BOM drawings, I understand ACADE can help with this; however, it doesn't quite hit the mark with our expectations. 

Something else this would help with is another gripe I have about the ACADE panel footprint short comings for the TSE, when you insert a foot print it remembers the entry X/Y ref and when updating uses this; however, it ignores the Scale and Rotation. Why would the DB Builder that runs when launching TSE not identify the new X/Y Ref, Scale, and Orientation! I wish these were carried in the block as when having to go through a project and update some 50 - 80 footprints (for wire to from destination updates) I invariably have to go double check them all and re-do those that are rotated or scaled at a different size. 

Note I am still on ACADE2017, I haven't had the chance to update to 2017 and migrate all the staff over, this may of been fixed by now since 2019 is already out (guys its only May 2018!). 

Regards,

[stephen.cudmore]

Thanks for all the replies - especially to Icemanau regarding the base points.

All is lined up nicely now after moving the base points for some of the parts. TB end bracket block had to have the base point top center whereas the TB, TB side cover, and TB partition blocks needed the base points at the bottom center.

[hbohm]

A couple of my drafters have a similar issue. Except it's not because of our footprint blocks "base" setting. I have used the TSE for years with the same set of blocks and it has never done this to me. However, these two users experience random misaligned blocks of the same type and catalog.

See the attached picture for reference. As you can see, one of the two-tier blocks is not lined up with the others next to it, the end barrier and end anchor on the right side are the same way.

This picture is a mild case of it, but when we build panels that have 300+ terminals...it takes them a while to move all the blocks where they should be. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks!

[testsubject]

I don't know if this applies to you but I have had problems in the past when OSnaps are turned on while inserting footprints. I have often said I want to rip out the F3 button to keep this from happening....