Create a custom symbol with subsymbols

[Leggo0]

Hi all, first post here and I have a weird one. I recently started a job as a panel designer, and we mainly use Siemens hardware. Unfortunately, Siemens and AutoCAD don't seem to mix well. When it comes to drawing I/O racks, the previous designers have taken to using individual PLC I/O points for the drawings.. The issue with this is that, each I/O point added has an individual line reference number. However as a single card, technically all the IO points should have the same line reference. 

I essentially want to create a symbol that contains eight (8) 2-wire I/O points that can be dropped into our drawings. I want to be able to edit each I/O point individually, giving them signal descriptions and label the pins, but overall I want each I/O point to share the same reference number. I have tried selecting "parent/child" and parenting the points together, however this just overrides the custom descriptions and if I ever do a sheet reference update, they all get their own reference numbers again. 

The easiest way would be to just manually change the reference number of each I/O point but for obvious reasons that's a terrible idea. I have attached a screenshot of what a typical slot might look like for reference and to help maybe get a better idea of what I am trying to do. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[Leggo0]

Hi all, first post here and I have a weird one. I recently started a job as a panel designer, and we mainly use Siemens hardware. Unfortunately, Siemens and AutoCAD don't seem to mix well. When it comes to drawing I/O racks, the previous designers have taken to using individual PLC I/O points for the drawings.. The issue with this is that, each I/O point added has an individual line reference number. However as a single card, technically all the IO points should have the same line reference. 

I essentially want to create a symbol that contains eight (8) 2-wire I/O points that can be dropped into our drawings. I want to be able to edit each I/O point individually, giving them signal descriptions and label the pins, but overall I want each I/O point to share the same reference number. I have tried selecting "parent/child" and parenting the points together, however this just overrides the custom descriptions and if I ever do a sheet reference update, they all get their own reference numbers again. 

The easiest way would be to just manually change the reference number of each I/O point but for obvious reasons that's a terrible idea. I have attached a screenshot of what a typical slot might look like for reference and to help maybe get a better idea of what I am trying to do. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[rhesusminus]

This just looks like someone that don't know AutoCAD Electrical has done it. 
The TAG for the I/O's should all be the same, one of them being a parent, and the rest "children" of this parent.

I'd look into the parametric PLC tool. It looks like that would be exactly what you need.

https://knowledge.autodesk.com/support/autocad-electrical/learn-explore/caas/CloudHelp/cloudhelp/202...

[rhesusminus]

This just looks like someone that don't know AutoCAD Electrical has done it. 
The TAG for the I/O's should all be the same, one of them being a parent, and the rest "children" of this parent.

I'd look into the parametric PLC tool. It looks like that would be exactly what you need.

https://knowledge.autodesk.com/support/autocad-electrical/learn-explore/caas/CloudHelp/cloudhelp/202...

[Leggo0]

Hi yes the parametric PLC tool would be fantastic, if there was options for the PLCs that I am trying to use. The only Siemens PLCs I was able to add were the 1500 series PLC, which is not what we use often enough to really make a difference in our designs. Like I said, I know that the drawing I posted is wrong. I am simply trying to find a better way to do it. 

[Leggo0]

Hi yes the parametric PLC tool would be fantastic, if there was options for the PLCs that I am trying to use. The only Siemens PLCs I was able to add were the 1500 series PLC, which is not what we use often enough to really make a difference in our designs. Like I said, I know that the drawing I posted is wrong. I am simply trying to find a better way to do it. 

[Icemanau · Accepted solution]

It is possible to edit the PLC database and add the cards and other units you need.

Use the PLC DATABASE FILE EDITOR tool and take a look at how some of the modules similar to what you need are set up.

Then it's just a matter of adding the correct data to the database for your required modules.

Regards Brad

[Icemanau · Accepted solution]

It is possible to edit the PLC database and add the cards and other units you need.

Use the PLC DATABASE FILE EDITOR tool and take a look at how some of the modules similar to what you need are set up.

Then it's just a matter of adding the correct data to the database for your required modules.

Regards Brad

[JeffatPrimex]

Not sure if this link has what you're looking for but you could try it.

AutoCAD Electrical Content Packs | AutoCAD Electrical 2019 | Autodesk Knowledge Network

Best regards,

Jeff

[JeffatPrimex]

Not sure if this link has what you're looking for but you could try it.

AutoCAD Electrical Content Packs | AutoCAD Electrical 2019 | Autodesk Knowledge Network

Best regards,

Jeff

[rhesusminus]

Here's a video showing how to add PLC's yourself: http://autode.sk/2oUa4Mi

You really should just get to it for all the PLC modules you're using. It'll be a good reward for you in the long run.

[rhesusminus]

Here's a video showing how to add PLC's yourself: http://autode.sk/2oUa4Mi

You really should just get to it for all the PLC modules you're using. It'll be a good reward for you in the long run.

[jseefdrumr · Accepted solution]

I've added so many PLCs to the database with that tool, it's one of the best ones in this software if you can master it. I've used it to parametrically build distribution boxes with M12 connections and third-party software controllers with ridiculous pinouts. I even have PLCs with custom symbols, one is an M12 port that has two I/O points that are configurable as inputs or outputs. (That one was pretty tricky, lol.)

That said, it's not the easiest thing to learn. However, I agree with the others, you should try to create your own PLCs with the PLC Database File Editor tool. To get you started, be sure to look up these things in HELP:

*About the PLC Database File

*To Work With the PLC Database File

*PLC Database File Editor Dialog Box

*all other entries that appear at the bottom of those pages, that sound like they apply to you

I'd focus on the easy stuff first. Just pick an existing one out of the catalog at random and insert it. Play with all the settings in the insert dialog to see how the parametrically built symbol reacts. Then, use the PLC Editor to randomly modify it. Insert it again and observe the differences. Then, find things to deliberately change and see if you can make it happen the way you want. Once you can do that, move on to creating a PLC entry from scratch.

Be prepared to edit, insert, hate, delete, edit, insert, repeat. It takes some of that to fine-tune your final result. Usually, though, once you've got the particulars figured out there's less of this insert it/hate it cycle.

It's definitely a lot of work. But it'll be worth it. You'll end up with symbols that are not only a little more similar in appearance to what's already out there, you'll also have symbols that are flexible, addressable, and exactly as you want them to be.

Feel free to post back, or to start a new thread, if you need assistance with PLC building.

[jseefdrumr · Accepted solution]

I've added so many PLCs to the database with that tool, it's one of the best ones in this software if you can master it. I've used it to parametrically build distribution boxes with M12 connections and third-party software controllers with ridiculous pinouts. I even have PLCs with custom symbols, one is an M12 port that has two I/O points that are configurable as inputs or outputs. (That one was pretty tricky, lol.)

That said, it's not the easiest thing to learn. However, I agree with the others, you should try to create your own PLCs with the PLC Database File Editor tool. To get you started, be sure to look up these things in HELP:

*About the PLC Database File

*To Work With the PLC Database File

*PLC Database File Editor Dialog Box

*all other entries that appear at the bottom of those pages, that sound like they apply to you

I'd focus on the easy stuff first. Just pick an existing one out of the catalog at random and insert it. Play with all the settings in the insert dialog to see how the parametrically built symbol reacts. Then, use the PLC Editor to randomly modify it. Insert it again and observe the differences. Then, find things to deliberately change and see if you can make it happen the way you want. Once you can do that, move on to creating a PLC entry from scratch.

Be prepared to edit, insert, hate, delete, edit, insert, repeat. It takes some of that to fine-tune your final result. Usually, though, once you've got the particulars figured out there's less of this insert it/hate it cycle.

It's definitely a lot of work. But it'll be worth it. You'll end up with symbols that are not only a little more similar in appearance to what's already out there, you'll also have symbols that are flexible, addressable, and exactly as you want them to be.

Feel free to post back, or to start a new thread, if you need assistance with PLC building.