Changing the Terminal block in the Terminal Strip.
Make sure that you set the WIPEOUT to the back of the draw order for the block.
Then do an Block Update to get the latest version.
One problem that I have noticed in older releases is that occasionally, when a footprint is inserted, the wipeout will get moved to the front and leave an empty outline. Haven't seen it in 2018 so far as I haven't done any panel layouts with it yet.
Regards Brad
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Brad Coleman, Electrical Draftsman
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So, I looked at what comes default in the system. (I'm using ACADE 2017). The default footprint that came in with the UT4 is NOT drawn to the dimensions that are reported by Phoenix. However, for me, everything came in at appropriate locations and scaling. Not sure what is going on with your setup that makes that happen. But here's a workaround that *should* render that a moot point anyway.
Here's what I would do:
START FROM SCRATCH
1. Go to the Phoenix website and download the appropriate CAD file.
2. Use it to create a footprint. You'll need to draw your own wipeout and draworder it to the back. (note: adding attributes to footprint blocks is optional; the software will put what it needs into the footprint when you place it. For more info, see HELP). If it were me, I'd name it something other than the currently used name for the out-of-the-box footprint.
3. Open the Footprint Database Lookup Editor. (Panel Tab>Other Tools) Use it to reassign the new footprint drawing that you made, to the part number for that terminal block.
4. Restart ACADE.
5. Once ACADE is back up and running, open the Terminal Strip Editor and make a practice strip and test the block.
Did that work?
Jim
Jim Seefeldt
Electrical Engineering Technician
Here's what I would do:
START FROM SCRATCH
1. Go to the Phoenix website and download the appropriate CAD file.
2. Use it to create a footprint. You'll need to draw your own wipeout and draworder it to the back. (note: adding attributes to footprint blocks is optional; the software will put what it needs into the footprint when you place it. For more info, see HELP). If it were me, I'd name it something other than the currently used name for the out-of-the-box footprint.
3. Open the Footprint Database Lookup Editor. (Panel Tab>Other Tools) Use it to reassign the new footprint drawing that you made, to the part number for that terminal block.
4. Restart ACADE.
5. Once ACADE is back up and running, open the Terminal Strip Editor and make a practice strip and test the block.
Did that work?
Jim
Jim Seefeldt
Electrical Engineering Technician
I'm self-taught on this software, too. The largest part of that came from these forums. So it's all good, I've been where you are.
Good job figuring out the scaling issue.
Number one thing is, did you restart ACADE after making changes to the footprint lookup database? If not do that and check again. If it's still wonky, then continue on:
So maybe I wasn't clear before, but I'd like you to start all the way from scratch. The process you outlined here just made use of the out-of-the-box stuff, which was already an issue. Plus, its size is definitely not accurate, according to the Phoenix website. 3044102 is the same part number I looked up before. (see my historical note below)
Referring to my previous post, here's more detail to step number 2:
Once you have downloaded the CAD file, reduce it to only what you need, graphically. Just delete any linework and such that you don't want to see. At this point open the Symbol Builder, and instead of picking anything from a list, pick the objects you just drew/modified. Pick the same attribute template as before. For now, include any attributes it says are required. Be sure to include a wipeout, and be sure to use DRAWORDER to send it to the back. When you're done, you need to decide what to name it.
You can A) use the same name as the out-of-the-box footprint, which will overwrite the existing one; or B) give it a different name and preserve the original one. Either way, you will use the Footprint Lookup Database Editor to force this Phoenix catalog entry to use your footprint.
Remember to restart after making changes to the footprint lookup database.
If this doesn't work, can you post a copy of the footprint file for us to look at?
Hope this helps,
Jim
(quick history lesson: the parts database is very old, and many manufacturers don't update their info with Autodesk. So, it's totally possible that the physical dimensions of this model of terminal block are different today, than they were back when they were first placed into the database.)
Jim Seefeldt
Electrical Engineering Technician
Good job figuring out the scaling issue.
Number one thing is, did you restart ACADE after making changes to the footprint lookup database? If not do that and check again. If it's still wonky, then continue on:
So maybe I wasn't clear before, but I'd like you to start all the way from scratch. The process you outlined here just made use of the out-of-the-box stuff, which was already an issue. Plus, its size is definitely not accurate, according to the Phoenix website. 3044102 is the same part number I looked up before. (see my historical note below)
Referring to my previous post, here's more detail to step number 2:
Once you have downloaded the CAD file, reduce it to only what you need, graphically. Just delete any linework and such that you don't want to see. At this point open the Symbol Builder, and instead of picking anything from a list, pick the objects you just drew/modified. Pick the same attribute template as before. For now, include any attributes it says are required. Be sure to include a wipeout, and be sure to use DRAWORDER to send it to the back. When you're done, you need to decide what to name it.
You can A) use the same name as the out-of-the-box footprint, which will overwrite the existing one; or B) give it a different name and preserve the original one. Either way, you will use the Footprint Lookup Database Editor to force this Phoenix catalog entry to use your footprint.
Remember to restart after making changes to the footprint lookup database.
If this doesn't work, can you post a copy of the footprint file for us to look at?
Hope this helps,
Jim
(quick history lesson: the parts database is very old, and many manufacturers don't update their info with Autodesk. So, it's totally possible that the physical dimensions of this model of terminal block are different today, than they were back when they were first placed into the database.)
Jim Seefeldt
Electrical Engineering Technician
The audit tool in the symbol builder can be misleading at times. You can ignore those two errors because they refer to connection points for wires. Wires aren't shown in footprints, and so footprints never get wire connection points. Technically, that error shouldn't even appear when you're making a footprint but apparently Autodesk forgot to filter it out.
Jim Seefeldt
Electrical Engineering Technician
Jim Seefeldt
Electrical Engineering Technician
Since you're using 2018, those of us on older versions can't open up the drawing you posted.
That's OK, all you have to do is save it again, using SAVE AS, and select SAVE AS TYPE=AutoCAD 2013 dwg.
Jim Seefeldt
Electrical Engineering Technician
That's OK, all you have to do is save it again, using SAVE AS, and select SAVE AS TYPE=AutoCAD 2013 dwg.
Jim Seefeldt
Electrical Engineering Technician
Accepted solution
Is this the exact file you are using as a footprint? If so, instructions for the fix follow, along with some block-building 'best practices'. If not, post back with the actual file you're using as the footprint.
If you are indeed using this file as your footprint, there are a number of things to address: Block files should not contain other blocks; Block files should only contain what is necessary to the block - no junk; The insertion point is pretty far off.
The fix workflow (DO NOT do any of this through symbol builder, just treat it like any other dwg)
1. Open the drawing file and explode the main block.
2. Also explode the block that makes up the graphics.
3. At this point, you should have nothing but attributes, lines, some polylines maybe, and the wipeout. There shouldn't be any geometry in there that is more complex than that, meaning, no more blocks and no groups. If there is, explode/ungroup it.
4. Run the PURGE command. PURGE ALL, then do it again, then again, until it no longer displays purgeable items. Don't worry, you can't hurt the block by doing this. You're just getting rid of junk data. This makes the block file smaller.
5. Finally, the insertion point. Enter BASE at the command line. If it isn't already, define the base point as 0,0,0.
6. Use the MOVE command, and select everything you see. Pick it up by the midpoint of the line that goes all the across the graphics of the terminal block. Set it down on 0,0,0.
7. Save the file.
8. Double check your entry in the footprint lookup database.
9. Restart ACADE.
10. Give it another go.
Did it work this time? It did for me. Post back and let us know.
Jim
MAKING BLOCKS - BEST PRACTICES
Some of the things that 'should' (depending on who you speak to) be done to make a proper block:
1. Use only the simplest geometry possible. (I never use anything more complex than polylines and polygons, in ACADE.)
2. Always use PURGE to get rid of unneeded junk.
3. Always use 0,0,0 as your base point.
4. If there is a wipeout, remember that they carry a pretty decent performance penalty. This used to matter more, back when computers had less RAM, but there is still a correlation between performance and the number of vertices in your wipeouts. I always try to 'cheat' wipeouts when I can. Remember, all they *have* to hide is the DIN rail.
3.
Jim Seefeldt
Electrical Engineering Technician
If you are indeed using this file as your footprint, there are a number of things to address: Block files should not contain other blocks; Block files should only contain what is necessary to the block - no junk; The insertion point is pretty far off.
The fix workflow (DO NOT do any of this through symbol builder, just treat it like any other dwg)
1. Open the drawing file and explode the main block.
2. Also explode the block that makes up the graphics.
3. At this point, you should have nothing but attributes, lines, some polylines maybe, and the wipeout. There shouldn't be any geometry in there that is more complex than that, meaning, no more blocks and no groups. If there is, explode/ungroup it.
4. Run the PURGE command. PURGE ALL, then do it again, then again, until it no longer displays purgeable items. Don't worry, you can't hurt the block by doing this. You're just getting rid of junk data. This makes the block file smaller.
5. Finally, the insertion point. Enter BASE at the command line. If it isn't already, define the base point as 0,0,0.
6. Use the MOVE command, and select everything you see. Pick it up by the midpoint of the line that goes all the across the graphics of the terminal block. Set it down on 0,0,0.
7. Save the file.
8. Double check your entry in the footprint lookup database.
9. Restart ACADE.
10. Give it another go.
Did it work this time? It did for me. Post back and let us know.
Jim
MAKING BLOCKS - BEST PRACTICES
Some of the things that 'should' (depending on who you speak to) be done to make a proper block:
1. Use only the simplest geometry possible. (I never use anything more complex than polylines and polygons, in ACADE.)
2. Always use PURGE to get rid of unneeded junk.
3. Always use 0,0,0 as your base point.
4. If there is a wipeout, remember that they carry a pretty decent performance penalty. This used to matter more, back when computers had less RAM, but there is still a correlation between performance and the number of vertices in your wipeouts. I always try to 'cheat' wipeouts when I can. Remember, all they *have* to hide is the DIN rail.
3.
Jim Seefeldt
Electrical Engineering Technician
Accepted solution
Glad to hear that we got you together!
OK, so what you're seeing now is totally normal, it's just how ACAD (and therefore, ACADE) deals with blocks.
Background: when you insert a block into a drawing for the first time, ACAD looks at the block you want, then copies all of its info into the drawing's database. When it does that, it writes what is known as a 'block definition' into the database. From that point on, whenever you want to reinsert that same block, ACAD realizes that it already exists in the drawing and gives you the block definition, rather than the actual block file.
This is legacy behavior, from back when computers weren't so powerful. Doing this saved time: it's quicker to load info that's already in the drawing, than it is to go find it in another location and load it in. Especially if it's already been done once.
That's what's happening. You inserted this block already, so a block definition for it now exists in the drawing's internal database. We must kill it.
So here's what to do. This is NOT the typical workflow for replacing updated blocks in ACADE. For that you would normally use the swap/update block command, but for some reason I get mixed results using it with footprints. To keep it easy, do it like this, just this once.
1. Delete all instances of your block from that drawing. We want nothing left but the block definition.
2. Use the PURGE command to get the block definition out of your drawing. (HINT: the block won't show up as 'purgeable' until you delete all instances of it from the drawing.)
3. Save the drawing.
4. Try to reinsert the terminal strip.
Did that work?
Jim Seefeldt
Electrical Engineering Technician
OK, so what you're seeing now is totally normal, it's just how ACAD (and therefore, ACADE) deals with blocks.
Background: when you insert a block into a drawing for the first time, ACAD looks at the block you want, then copies all of its info into the drawing's database. When it does that, it writes what is known as a 'block definition' into the database. From that point on, whenever you want to reinsert that same block, ACAD realizes that it already exists in the drawing and gives you the block definition, rather than the actual block file.
This is legacy behavior, from back when computers weren't so powerful. Doing this saved time: it's quicker to load info that's already in the drawing, than it is to go find it in another location and load it in. Especially if it's already been done once.
That's what's happening. You inserted this block already, so a block definition for it now exists in the drawing's internal database. We must kill it.
So here's what to do. This is NOT the typical workflow for replacing updated blocks in ACADE. For that you would normally use the swap/update block command, but for some reason I get mixed results using it with footprints. To keep it easy, do it like this, just this once.
1. Delete all instances of your block from that drawing. We want nothing left but the block definition.
2. Use the PURGE command to get the block definition out of your drawing. (HINT: the block won't show up as 'purgeable' until you delete all instances of it from the drawing.)
3. Save the drawing.
4. Try to reinsert the terminal strip.
Did that work?
Jim Seefeldt
Electrical Engineering Technician
Accepted solution
I took a look at the drawing you posted. This is an insertion point issue.
Recall from my earlier post that you should have a base point in the block of 0,0,0. The base point in a block drawing file, is the same thing as the insertion point after you insert it as a block. This block does indeed have BASE=0,0,0. So what the problem is, is the footprint is 38" from 0,0,0... up and to the right.
To fix:
Select the polyline and the wipeout. Pick them up by the midpoint of the top line. Set that point down on 0,0,0. Save the block. Remember to use PURGE in your working drawing before trying to place the edited end plate, otherwise you'll get the older block definition.
That should work, post back if it doesn't and we'll see what else is going on.
Jim
Jim Seefeldt
Electrical Engineering Technician
Recall from my earlier post that you should have a base point in the block of 0,0,0. The base point in a block drawing file, is the same thing as the insertion point after you insert it as a block. This block does indeed have BASE=0,0,0. So what the problem is, is the footprint is 38" from 0,0,0... up and to the right.
To fix:
Select the polyline and the wipeout. Pick them up by the midpoint of the top line. Set that point down on 0,0,0. Save the block. Remember to use PURGE in your working drawing before trying to place the edited end plate, otherwise you'll get the older block definition.
That should work, post back if it doesn't and we'll see what else is going on.
Jim
Jim Seefeldt
Electrical Engineering Technician