Isoline Edges For Imported CAD Data

[MysticLtd]

Hi!

First some short notes. Then images and then a detailed description. I hope you like it.

• Keep the typical "Isoline Edges Look" from CAD Data or BodyObjects when converting them to mesh (Convert to EditableMesh)
• Allow to store and restore an "Edge Visibility State" within the stack (extension for Turn-To-Poly and Turn-To-Mesh Modifiers)

Edges Display ComparisonTransport Edges VisibilityPowerEdgesMesh in CommandPanelPowerEdgesMesh in Import Dialogs

Detailed Description:

3dsmax has licenced some NPower tools for CAD import several years ago. That was the time when BodyObjects came to life.

NPower PowerTranslators has the ability to keep the Isoline Edges Display from the CAD Data and transfer them to the Edges Visibility State of the converted EditableMesh. This makes a clean and tidy look in viewport and is also beneficial when it comes to selecting faces for material ID assignment due to the big, clean shaped and nicely separated "B-Rep patch style" polygons.

With the current implementation all CAD models are imported as full triangulated trimeshes. This makes a messy look in viewport and so it is hard to see or select anything.

Since the Body Objects seems to be a lite version or redesigned version of the "Pwr_EditNRB" object, I assume that these functions are still present somewhere.

It was called "Power Edge Mesh" and was available on the NPower Import Dialog as well as in the Pwr_EditNRB object command panel GUI and many other NPower objects.

Please bring them back!

To guarantee that all operations and modifiers work with those Isoline-Edges meshes, I like to suggest, that you recommend the use of a "Turn-To-Poly" modifier before a conversion to EditablePoly or before the use of Modifiers. This will avoid problems which can be caused by models with hidden edges.

Also I like to suggest, that an option to the "Turn-To-Poly" modifier will be added, which allows to store the Edges Visibility State from the underlying EditableMesh object (or EditMeshModifier or current stack position) to the stack. And with that, I further like to suggest, that an option to the "Turn-To-Mesh" modifier will be added, which allows to restore the Edges Visibility State from the stack (if present), to bring back the nice Isoline Edges Look after some operations and modifications. This should work if the topology hasn't changed too heavly. Otherwise you can simply leave it off.

We in the company heavily use the IsolineEdges display and its benefits for tasks of the daylie work. Unfortunately it seems like NPower has stopped development of PowerTranslators for 3dsmax. Anyway it would be great to have this built-in natively.

Thanks for reading and voting! - I hope this will come.

PS: The model you see here is from the free GrabCAD libary. Thanks to the drawer. https://grabcad.com/library/jet-engine-220

[MysticLtd]

Also a good set of visible and hidden edges is impotant for some shaders to work properly. For example edge bumb shaders which have the option to ignore hidden edges.

[MysticLtd]

Something like this is already supported for imports of Inventor and SketchUp files - would be great to have it for all supported CAD formats too.

Further it seems, that the UV seams that come with a CAD import match exactly these Isoline Edges. So it would be nice to have an option which converts UV Seams to Visible Edges (and hide all other edges). I currently can't find a way to select all UV seams at one time. Is there a way?

[software]

I take bake my statement, that NPower has stopped development. There are still builds up to 3dsmax2021. It was just hard for me to find it on their website.

Anyway this doesn't change anything on my idea request here.

[TorgeirHolm8901]

Yes please! I get CAD files for product viz all the time, and this would make a huge difference. 

[kossatz]

Well, you can do this yourself:

- Convert the parts to editable mesh (convert, do not add editable mesh modifier, normals will break!)

- Select open edges in edge sub selection

- Invert Selection

- click the "invisible" button of the surface properties section of the edge mode

You will now have the isolines for your object. However, this only works if the parts were exported correctly. Some software, like Autodesk Vred mess up the surface patches and weld the vertices in some spots.

However, if this process could be done on import, I would be happy!

[MysticLtd]

Hey kossatz,

Thanks for this suggestion, but this is totally NO SOLUTION for me. Because then I have a model with thousands of open edges and this is simlply a bad mesh then, which I don't want to work with.

Maybe there are users for who it doesn't matter if the mesh has a lot of open edges or not, then this suggestion may be okay.

The requirement is clear: Properly welded edges AND IsoLine Display.

[kossatz]

This is not going to work. By welding the vertices/edges, you will lose the ability to select big parts of the object using the elements sub-selection.

There is no downside to open edges if they come from properly tesselated Nurbs surfaces. Yes, there are open edges. But you can not see them if that is what you are afraid of.

However, if you really need the vertices welded, there are tools in Max already that can handle this. Never weld inside the Editable Mesh though, as this will arise other issues.

[MysticLtd]

Okay. I respect your point of view.

For me open edges are A BIG disadvantage and a NO GO. No matter if they match each other or not. With those I experienced just problems.

Welding vertices of meshes which come from a CAD conversion with regular 3dsmax tools will destroy smoothing groups and normals, so that the surface of the mesh will look awful afterwars. This is no solution to me.

Maybe I am wrong, but I think what you say about the "Weld/Smooth" option inside the BodyObject before it comes to MeshConversion is not true. It welds the CAD B-Rep patches proberly PER element. So that you have proper elements after conversion to EditableMesh. What you're loosing are the "big B-Rep-shaped N-Gon Polys", which I think you mean with "Elements". - And thats what this idea here is about. If the IsoLine edges would survive mesh conversion, you would have the possibility to select the "big B-Rep-shaped N-Gon Polys" via the default "Polygon" sublevel selection of the EditableMesh object AND properly welded edges. Both. With NPower "PowerEdgesMesh" this is already possible and this is what I want to achiev with this idea for native 3dsmax. (And the Turn-To-Mesh, Turn-To-Poly Edges Visibility Sets Store/Restore feature).

[kossatz]

I never use the ancient nPower tools, because these have their very own problems.

I was talking about already tesselated geometry coming from Nurbs software or conversion tools. As described, there are ways to safely weld the vertices/edges in Max without compromising mesh quality. So this is not true: "Welding vertices of meshes which come from a CAD conversion with regular 3dsmax tools will destroy smoothing groups and normals, so that the surface of the mesh will look awful afterwars. This is no solution to me."

[MysticLtd]

Point 1: Okay. I think its up to every user which tools he/she/x prefers to use.

Point 2: I think thats a matter of personal experience. I personally have made no good experience with welding/smoothing afterwards in many many different cases. I like best if the tool which performs the import operation also does the welding and smoothing properly in one go.

[kossatz]

I don't know why you're so obsessed with open edges. Anyway, it seems I can no further help in this case.

If there was a way to display only the isolines after ATF-import with convert to mesh turned on, I would be happy.

[MysticLtd]

You can help with a vote for this idea, please :-). Thank you!

There are a ton of reasons why open edges are bad in many cases of cg work. For now I don't want to further elaborate it here.

[kossatz]

Done

[Anonymous]

Je n'utilise jamais les anciens outils nPower, car ceux-ci ont leurs propres problèmes.

le site ma boucoup aideé.

 vidmate        snaptube

[PropChad]

@kossatz What tools within 3ds Max will weld a mesh converted from a BREP/Body, without destroying the explicit normals? Not saying there isn't any, just never found them. Everything I've tried destroys the explicit normals.

FYI, welding the vertices is very important when you are exporting for interactive use from 3ds Max, the more vertices the worse your performance in the resulting application. This is where nPower Translators is very useful. You can set the tesselation interactively and create a low poly mesh using settings that are best for each object for the most lightweight triangle count with little visual loss; fully welded, with isolines to easily select to assign material IDs or to assist in unwrapping. This is much needed as default in 3ds Max. It's all there except the ability to extract a mesh. The current conversions or collapsing to is not the best workflow. Probably the best way is for Autodesk just to fully license the translator/viewer.

[kossatz]

@PropChadThe ProOptimizer modifier with "merge vertices" set to 0 will do what you need. You need to press the calculate button at the top to get the results.

[PropChad]

@kossatz Thanks. I never would have thought to use ProOptimizer to do welding. That does preserve explicit normals. But it does not preserve edge visibility unless I missed a toggle.

[kossatz]

No, it does not preserve edge visibility, sorry.

[proffwaterr]

For example, you'll likely want to change "Sub Main" to some thing one-of-a-kind, and relying in your needs/expectancies, you can even need to trade it to a Function link. As you could already recognize, a Sub essentially simply does something, while a Function procedures something and returns a end result.

[inulchik]

What sort of text container are we talking about here? For example: Inventor.TextBox (in a caricature), Inventor.TextBox (in on a drawing sheet to shop online), System.Windows.Forms.TextBox (in a Windows Form)