What cause large file size in this 3ds max scene. Attached file.

[5vil]

What cause large file size in this 3ds Max scene. Attached file (both 2014 & 2017).

How can I reduce size and clean redundant data of this attached file without erase animation of camera altogether? I mean I use every popular cleaning scripts but the file with only camera still have size about 17MB (if I do command "new/keep objects" then the size down to 72KB which is true size of content worthy but the "new/keep objects" procedure did clean/ empty all animation/key inside max scene).

So for this certain file (with only a save selected camara with movement/ a sample but the movement could be more complex or anything else), could you guy check it and tell what the cause of big file size. Granted it was not one of those things, like: NoteTracks, AnimLayerControlManager, Retimers, Empty layers, Empty objects, Missing plugins, Scene States, Selection Sets, Materials, Link Composite, etc... 'coz I already clean all of those. Thanks for reading and answering.

[Alfred.DeFlaminis]

Hello @5vil, good to see you again.

What a strange scene here.  Takes me 20 minutes to open, but only has a single camera.  When I did open it I saved the file and it ballooned up to 342MB.  I've never seen anything like it.   Are all scenes getting this issue when you use the command to create the old school Vray Physical Camera?  

When I use command vrayCreateVRayPhysicalCamera() I don't see the same problem when I save, so the camera itself must be somehow bad.  My guess here is that at some point this scene file crashed and became a recovery file but somehow the camera was partially corrupted or at least reading something incorrectly.   Can you tell me a bit about the history of this file?  

Best Regards,

[5vil]

Scene like this not so unfamiliar with me anymore, 'coz I saw all kind of weird 3ds max scenes with huge-filesize-problem in our projects. But not all the time we figure out the way to purge/clean it perfectly. Thanks you again for answering, without you I believe nobody would do.

For the scene above, I sent you only Camera (save selected) because it's unnecessary to sent any other data (I could send but I think it's useless for this question).

So talk about the file itself. Scene has something wrong/mis-configurated/redundant inside it which I haven't figure out myself, therefore the question was asked here. No special steps could reproduce the bug in my memory (or simply there're too many things aside I couldn't remember either). But I have some Max scenes in one of our current projects with this improper file-size problem. As regular, we would use scripts to clean it out (such as Cleaner by Andreas Meissner, Mr. Clear by Merlin Prokasky, etc...), also manually clean out as much as we could. But the problem still resist. To the point I save isolated a simple object such as Camera (or any object) to a separated file, file size is still improper.

Not because we create the Camera come the problem, but now the file we're working has the Camera with the problem, I couldn't seperate the file further more (in term of "3ds-max file that contain problem"). So I think you could analysis the attached file itself and find the cause in term of technical examination. I think it's possible within your reach. I've to state again, we still use 2014 as primary in render farm and workstations, etc... We didn't create old-school Camera, we simply use the 2014 version of Max which the "new physical cam" not implemented. I save 2017 version just for test purpose, 'coz I think 2014 is too out of support now so it has to be 2017 at least (but I believe if we switch to 2017 with out current projects, the problem still the same, so it's not the main point here).


What I have in mind about this problem and possible solution. Why I could purge it down to 72KB with the command "New/Keep Objects"? Because it purge/clean all the redundant data from the file, so remaining is only pure clear Camera, but less-usefully it also clean out the Cam movement (or any other movement in scene for that matter). But the details of tasks/steps that "New/Keep Objects" did to a Max scene is unknown for regular users, so we couldn't know what could remove before we reach the "camera movement"-part (which we prefer to keep). Is it possible (in future versions or scripts ability) to have a check list of task "New/Keep Objects" would execute to give user choice to check/uncheck the steps they don't want it to perform? Currently, I can't find any scripts do the similar task as "New/Keep Objects" command inside Max, let alone to have the choice with steps it would do, so it's still a problem.

[5vil]

About Camera issue, I think it's necessary to say again. That it's not particular Camera problem to me, I could have Standard Camera inside the problematic file and its size is still improper. The same with any object (of any type, spline, goemetry,...) not just bug come along with camera. If there's a moving object or even still object "save selected" to a separated file, the problem is still the same. Althought with still scene, we could just "New/Keep Objects" and accept it would break all group, erase all animation/key inside the scene, but with animated scene it quickly become problem (or we've to re-do animating tasks from beginning for the scene which sometimes is only solution we've to choose).

To say it another way, that the 3ds max file now as small as it could (by our attempts without use command "New/Keep Objects"). There's something refuse to leave the file. You could "save selected" anything from the file, and the newly saved file has size ~17MB, couldn't be smaller than that. While if everything right, the file only size count by KB (even with animation object/cam). What's remaining-17MB-of-redundant-data doing there inside the max file? Because data-size required to contain that object+animation only worth <100KB in general situation (Now it's 17MB, and becomes >200MB as your own experience). 

[Alfred.DeFlaminis · Accepted solution]

Hello @5vil,

The strangest part about it is when I merge that camera into a new blank scene the bloat and problem comes with it.  I thought that was an indicator that the problem was somehow attached to the camera.  When I use a zip program to open the Max file I see the majority of the file bloat in "Scenes" which is under normal circumstances the scene objects.  But then I delete the camera and save the scene and the bloat remains.  Next I tested the Clean scripts as you mentioned and typically they are great but not here though, as you noted.  

I thought that it might be some script or plugin that is adding scene data, possibly for organization or caching information.  I thought if it's not the object itself, maybe it's somehow related to scene objects in general and travels with them.  Layer management is the first thing that comes to mind here that might do that.   But that was just a guess and since the animation data was the thing that you were looking to keep I thought it might somehow be related to that.  Since reset and keep 'fixed' it, I thought to look further.  I did stumble across this blog post from 2011 and found some information which led to a resolution that kept the key info.  I pasted the line of code below that you can put in the listener to fix this issue.  It worked in my tests, will you please try it?  Thanks!

t=trackviewnodes;n=t[#Max_MotionClip_Manager];deleteTrackViewController t n.controller;gc() 

Thanks for taking the time to fully explain this one and your tested procedures.  Helped a lot!

Best Regards,

[Alfred.DeFlaminis]

Hello @5vil,

I just wanted to follow up here, does that command work for you?  

Best Regards,

[5vil]

The command works. I compares those scripts and notice that Cleaner seems only remove Notes and your given code remove Controller. Removing Controller seems like more thorough method than removing Notes. But it's just my wild guess because I don't know scripting.

I think those popular scripts for cleaning NoteTracks somehow missing those things. So I need to use separate code like the one you gave to completely clean it out. I remember I read about this missing functions of Cleaner type scripts but this time I clearly overlook it (they talk about such scripts removing notetracks but not all the case). Thanks for your spending time looking for the solution. Have a nice week.

[Alfred.DeFlaminis]

That is strange @5vil, and I think you may be right about the notes vs. the controllers.  I hadn't seen this before so I am grateful to add another bit of ammo to my arsenal, thanks for your patience while I sussed it out.  I wish you a great week as well.

Best Regards,

[Anonymous]

Man thank you man thank you so so much! you really saved my ass !!!!!!