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Civil 3D Labels - Dragged State Positions

Civil 3D Labels - Dragged State Positions

Civil 3D dragged labels should remember their positions for a given annotation scale, as does AutoCAD annotative text.

 

 

24 Comments
troma
Mentor

 I would love to be able to plot my drawing at 1:1000 with the civil objects & labels scaled to 1:500 so they don't overwhelm the plan.  I should be able to simply set the viewport to have a standard scale of 1:1000 and annotation scale 1:500 and be done.

jmayo-EE
Mentor

If I could search this idea station I could give you a few more links where users are requesting C3D labels to behave like AutoCAD Annotation objects.

 

A couple of rehtorical questions for those reading.

 

1. Why not just have any Mtext, Mleader or dim object be able to extract any C3D property you need just by selecting the object and the component?

 

2. Why do we have to use and teach two separtate labeling systems with very different behaviors?

peter_thomson
Advocate

We often use XREF to display our profile views in drawing sheets.  This saves the work of data referencing all the components of PVs and having to "put them together" again on sheets.  The difficulty we have is that the scales reflect the modelspace scales in the design drawing where we typically set the annotation scale to suit the plan data. It would be great if scales (at least the horizontal scale and the vert scale factor) would respond to the viewport scale in the sheet drawing.

 

This is also true of sections.

 

So, while I realise that there is  another workflow for achieving this, it does take considerable effort in an environment where time is money and deadlines are very real. This functionality would save lots of precious time.

 

Peter T

martin.folber
Advocate

Missing important functionality. Big screens, several tiled viewports in different scales eg. plan view 1:1000, profile view 1:500, section views 1:100. All is labeled by one annotation scale, which is not very usefull and labels are not readable. And switching annotation scale all the time is tedious. Lets add similar behaviour to model space viewports as they have viewports in paperspace. Simple assign annotation scale to MS Viewport...

 

Thanks

Martin

Tags (4)
C3D_TomR
Collaborator
Maybe an expression like the one described in this post will help in the interim. https://civil3dplus.wordpress.com/2010/03/23/labels-with-text-that-doesnt-scale-youre-kidding-right/
KirkNoonan
Collaborator

I'd like to be able to assign different point and label styles to the same points based on the viewport. Then, for example, I could show a detailed label for my control points in a 30 scale viewport and only show the descriptor and number in the 100 scale viewport.

troma
Mentor

It would be possible to do something like this if the subcomponents of a label style could be assigned to different layers. Then you'd just vpfreeze the components you don't want to see. But this method may make it hard to get a nice, clean look to the drawing.

 

 

The other side of it is that we need to drag the label in different directions and/or different distances for different views and scales. We need something that works like an annotative multileader: to drag into different positions for different scales.

 

Do you think it would give enough flexibility if it were possible for a cogo point to have more than one label? You could put each label on a different layer, and vpfreeze them to get the display right in the viewport.

As far as I know the cogo point is the only C3D object which can only have one label, am I right in that?

KirkNoonan
Collaborator

The subcomponent thing would probably work, too. But I agree that it would potentially make it challenging to get a clean drawing.

 

More annotative-like abilities in all C3D objects and labels would be awesome!

 

Multiple labels would be one possible implementation of the idea. Right now, if we want to change the display in different views, we have to change the order of the point groups in the hierarchy. I guess, technically, you could say that for this reason the points have the capability of being assigned more than one label, but the display of those labels is very inflexible.

 

Your suggestion is very good. Allow the simultaneous assignment and display of multiple point labels and styles. We could control the visibility of the individual styles with existing vieport - layer commands.

Anonymous
Not applicable

There are some fantastic benefits to using C3D object lebels like view port or object orientation, automatic scaling, dynamic data connection and automatic leaders in drag state.  

Wait.  That last part is the problem.

If I initiate a drag state on a C3D object label, that label location is now locked to a specific location from the object.  It does roate based on viewport if you like, but there are two distinct things it will not do that an annotative mleader will do.

1.  You cannot change the location of that label based on scale.

2.  You cannot control the visibility of the label based on scale.

 

This means that if I'm using a COGO point to identify an enviromental monitoring well and I want to show the well label with the drag state initiated at 1:2500 and then again at 1:50, I have to turn off the object label and use an mleader with an object data field to call the name of the well.  This is not a big deal untill I need to do that with 100 sampling locations.

Status changed to: Gathering Support

Duplicate with: http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/autocad-civil-3d-ideastation/civil-3d-labels-dragged-state-positions/i...

 

Regards,

 

Peter Funk
Sr Product Manager
Civil 3D
Autodesk, Inc.

Status changed to: Gathering Support

In Civil 3D 2016 I set up a layout with 2 views.

 

On the right I'm plotting at Standard Scale of 1"=100' and an Annotation Scale of 1"=100'

On the left I'm  at Standard Scale of 1"=100' and an Annotation Scale of 1"=50'

 

The annotation on the left is 1/2 the scale as the annotation on the right.

 

This appears to meet the request listed above. What am I missing?

 

Regards,

 

Peter Funk
Sr Product Manager
Civil 3D
Autodesk, Inc.

2 scales.PNG

troma
Mentor

@peterfunkautodesk sorry I just now noticed the request for comments on this. Your picture looks good! I wonder if this is a new feature for 2016?

 

Here are some comments. First, my original question from January 2013 with replies from @mathewkol and @BrianHailey stating that it can't be done:

https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/autocad-civil-3d-general/annotation-scale-amp-standard-scale-of-a-vie...

 

Here's a thread from November 2013 with the same problem, and I replied to it with the same answer:

http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/autocad-civil-3d-general/making-annotative-scale-different-from-viewpo...

 

Finally, here are a couple of comments and a blog post by Richard Sincovec @Sinc. Note the bold text in the blog "Civil 3D objects will always scale according to the Viewport Scale"

http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/autocad-civil-3d-general/force-different-annotation-scale-vs-viewport-...

https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/autocad-civil-3d-general/civil-3d-label-styles-annotation-scale-versu...

http://www.civil4d.com/2010/07/civil-3d-annotation-scaling-revisited/

 

So I say it certainly didn't work in the past, but your picture looks like it does in 2016.

I'm still working in 2013, I'll try to post a picture later.

 

 

troma
Mentor

Although I'm stuck in the past, I do pay attention to all the announcements when the new release comes out every year. I would have remebered if this was one of the listed improvements!

BrianHailey
Mentor

Doesn't work for me @peterfunkautodesk. I did notice the text scaling differently after making a few changes but as soon as I did a regenall, they went back to the same.

 

Please see THIS Screencast and let me know if I did anything differently than you did.

troma
Mentor

Yep, I too noticed it looked good until I did a regenall.

Here are my results in 2013. Notice the annotation scale has no effect whatsoever.

ANNOTATION SCALE AND STANDARD SCALE.PNG

Status changed to: Gathering Support

OK, I'm setting it back to "Gathering Support". Thanks for the input.

 

Regards,

Peter Funk
Sr Product Manager
Civil 3D
Autodesk, Inc.

rl_jackson
Mentor

This would be a great improvement for labels to follow the annotation scale and not the VP scale. I can't not tell you how may times I have done a survey drawing with a overall basemap for the sheet layout that might be 1" = 500 or 1000' and then have individual sheets that would be at 1" = 50' and have to use standard text in PS to label the parcels with the duplicate information, that I already had at 1" = 50'.

Status changed to: Future Consideration

This is a great idea, but the timing isn’t quite right for development consideration in the near term. As such, it is being put on the back burner to be re-visited at a later date. Please continue to comment and add your support.

 

Regards,

 

Peter Funk

Sr. Product Manager

Autodesk, Inc.

troma
Mentor

@peterfunkautodesk at least four different ideas combined here into one thread:

 

  1. C3D labels to be in different locations/rotations at different annotation scales.
  2. C3D labels to respect the 'annotation' scale of a viewport instead of the 'standard' scale.
  3. C3D labels in x-ref to respect viewport scale
  4. Assign different annotation scales to different modelspace viewports
Anonymous
Not applicable

Allow the user to grip a current C3D label and add the current scale.  Then if the user changes the scale of the MSpace or the Vport scales changes allow the user to have the label either turn off and/or allow the user to add the current scale and then the label would turn on at the new size and then allow the user to be able to grip move the label to a new location without effecting the original location of the label as per the other scales that have already been added.

 

Just like current annotative text and dim are now but add the ability to have the label turn off automatically once the scale has changed. Maybe make it a ghost image so you can see there is a label there but its not meant to be seen nor plotted at the current scale.

 

Bill Neuhauser 

Managed Design

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