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force different annotation scale vs viewport scale

15 REPLIES 15
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Message 1 of 16
Anonymous
8959 Views, 15 Replies

force different annotation scale vs viewport scale

I am trying display my annotation scale that is different than my viewport
scale. Everytime I switch the viewport scale the annotation scale changes.
Can I turn this relationship off?
15 REPLIES 15
Message 2 of 16
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Why would you want to do this? Make a style that give you the height you
want at the given scale, no?
Message 3 of 16
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

I am doing some field work and I want the survey points to appear larger on
the print. Normally I can just switch this in the properties dialog box, but
for some reason when I switch the annotation scale the viewport scale jumps
up with it.


"Joe Bouza" wrote in message
news:6271522@discussion.autodesk.com...
Why would you want to do this? Make a style that give you the height you
want at the given scale, no?
Message 4 of 16
klugb
in reply to: Anonymous

I'm with Jason on this one. There are odd times that I need a 1"=50' VP but want to keep ALL of the annotation at a 1"=20' size.
This is usually when I need multiple Viewports so I can't do it from model space. I don't want to have to change to different styles to do this. An override of some sort is needed.

Bruce
Bruce Klug, P.E.
AutoCAD Expert Elite Alumni
AutoCAD Civil 3D Certified Professional
Civil 3D 2023.2.1

Win 10 Enterprise, 64-bit
Message 5 of 16
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

I believe that if you select the viewport and view the viewport properties, there are two settings there. One for annotative scale and one for viewport scale. The order in which you change them is important though. I believe you have to set your viewport scale first, then change the annotative scale second.
Message 6 of 16
Sinc
in reply to: Anonymous

You can set the scales independently using ZOOM XP or CANNOSCALE, but we've found no benefit to doing so.

The problem is that C3D labels use the VP scale, and ignore the CANNOSCALE. So you can get the values set differently, but the next time you regen your drawing, all the C3D labels will rescale themselves based on the viewport. To be able to do things like this, we really need C3D labels to scale based on the Annotation Scale, and not on the viewport scale.

-- Sinc
http://www.ejsurveying.com
http://www.quuxsoft.com
Sinc
Message 7 of 16
klugb
in reply to: Anonymous

I tried every combination I could think of when I first ran into this problem. I never could get those settings to change the text the way I wanted. After a regen the text ALWAYS matched the vp scale * .12 (for us). If you know the secret method I would like to try again.

I hate telling co-workers "It can't be done"

Thanks,
Bruce
Bruce Klug, P.E.
AutoCAD Expert Elite Alumni
AutoCAD Civil 3D Certified Professional
Civil 3D 2023.2.1

Win 10 Enterprise, 64-bit
Message 8 of 16
klugb
in reply to: Anonymous

Dang Sinc,

You type faster than me 🙂

Bruce
Bruce Klug, P.E.
AutoCAD Expert Elite Alumni
AutoCAD Civil 3D Certified Professional
Civil 3D 2023.2.1

Win 10 Enterprise, 64-bit
Message 9 of 16
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

The following method works for me in C3d 2008. I haven't tried it in other versions.

Create the vport and set the scale to the annotative choice I want.
From the Viewports toolbar, select or enter the vport scale I want.

If I try this using the pulldowns at the bottom of the screen it will not work. Only the viewport toolbar process operates as desired.

This results in a vport with two separate scales. If I change the annotative scale again, I have to repeat the process.
The scales remain even after a close or regen/regenall.
Message 10 of 16
Sinc
in reply to: Anonymous

Yes, the scales remain set that way, but C3D labels still scale according to the VP scale.

The OP is trying to change the VP scale while having the labels on C3D points remain the same size relative to the linework. Unfortunately, this is currently impossible. Basically, the desire is to be able to select "Use Annotative Scale" as an option to resize points, rather than the option we currently have to "Use Drawing Scale" (which actually defaults to "Use Viewport Scale" in paperspace).

-- Sinc
http://www.ejsurveying.com
http://www.quuxsoft.com
Sinc
Message 11 of 16
Wilderman2
in reply to: Sinc

 

Any progress on this issue in versions 2010-2013?  I came across this situation today trying to create an exhibit (at a different scale) from a plan/profile drawing, where the scale of the C3D lableling looks fine in plan view, but is too large (by a factor of two) for the exhibit.  I remember similar display problems in the past, anything new in the latest versions I should be aware of?

 

Thanks

Message 12 of 16
wilsonm2000
in reply to: Wilderman2

I would also really like a solution to this.  There has been a lot of times where I could be doing with this.

Message 13 of 16
AllenJessup
in reply to: Wilderman2

I do this by creating an Expression for fixed heights and using that for the text height in the Style. You have to create one style for each height. These are usually used for stakeout diagrams where we want to show the points quite large but not have other text and notes scaled up.

 

This is the expression for a height of 0.6 of the drawing scale 0.6 / {Drawing Scale Conversion}. It's from a metric drawing. You can paste that in to the Expression or you can get the Drawing Scale Conversion by clicking on the function icon in the Edit Expression dialog box.

 

Ex.png

 

Allen

Allen Jessup
CAD Manager - Designer
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Message 14 of 16
Sinc
in reply to: AllenJessup

As Allen says, you can always create a Style that forces a specific height.  But that gets back into the "Style Breeding" problem, as well as creating tons of Styles that confuse junior users (or anyone new to your company), so I'm not particularly a fan of that process.

 

There's a weakness in C3D where, especially if you are using the Plan&Production tools, it is NOT easy to create plots at different scales.  I was dealing with this issue recently in some of my training, where they wanted to be able to create plots at 24x36 as well as at 11x17, yet they didn't want to simply scale down the bigger drawings to 11x17.  My recommendation was to just create everything at 24x36, then use a Page Setup Override (via the Sheet Set Manager) to print an 11x17 version, even though that would result in things like your Scales being wrong.  After all, in practice, it's a bad idea to scale things off an 11x17 reduction in any case, so why worry that the scale isn't right...?

 

But then, we've also been moving toward giving plans to our field guys in the form of a tablet (like an iPad), so they don't even have paper plans at all anymore...  That kind of really throws away any desire to scale off a reduced set of plans.

Sinc
Message 15 of 16
Anonymous
in reply to: Wilderman2

It really pains me to say this, but I have been known to enlarge my title block, calculate out alternate viewport scales, then "scale to fit" my drawing.  (Say for instance, scaling a title block up by 2.5x to get 20 scale annotation on 50 scale viewports, making a 30x42 drawing into a 75x105 drawing)  I really hate doing that because it's prone to error when other people work with your files, but it can get you a 50 scale drawing with 20 scale text.  You also have to then set the print scale at the inverse (1/2.5 = 0.4) or scale to fit.  The scale to fit is tricky--because you have to have a boundary at the edge of your limits and 0 margins, or else you get something dumb like 0.38 instead of 0.40 scaling.

Message 16 of 16
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

This is still an issue in 2015. This workaround is recommended when cogo points are needed on exhibits. Treat the cogo points as a stand-alone xref...

 

First, import the points into the exhibit and drag them around until they look good at the desired scale. Then use quick select to export only the cogo points to a new drawing. Then xref the new drawing into the exhibit. Finally, turn off or delete the actual cogo points in the exhibit and you're left with the xreffed points that look right. Sounds complicated but it only takes a minute or two and there's no need to create "compensator" styles.

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