Vertical pipe - size of circle symbol in coarse or medium mode

[marekga]

Hello,

In revit 2016 - I think it is not possible to get real sizes of circles when sewage pipe is going vertically down or up.

There is only one parameter to deal with it which is: Manage/MEP settings/Mechanical settings/Pipe settings/Pipe Rise Drop Annotation Size.

But this parameter set a constant value: the same size of a circle for 50mm or 110mm or 200mm pipe, which doesn't show real size of vertical pipe.

Could Autodesk give the users such functionality?

Thanks,

Mark

[jboehning]

When the Detail Level of the view is set to Coarse or Medium, then pipe will appear "symbolic". When the pipe is cut, the view will show a circle. The size of the circle is based on the Pipe Rise/Drop Annotation Size in the Mechanical Settings (as you stated). You can change this, but it will not adjust for actual pipe size. You have a couple options to show the actual size:

1. Change the Detail Level of the view to Fine.

2. Override the Detail Level for the Pipes category to Fine in the Visibility/Graphic Overrides dialog.

[Scott_D_]

The display of the symbol can be further controlled using the Rise and Drop settings under the Pipe, Duct and Tray Categories in "V/G overrides Model"

[robert.klempau]

Hello @marekga,

I created a video for you to show you how the Rise and Drop symbols work in Revit.

There are two settings I show you:

1. The Rise and Drop symbol settings in your Pipe Systems
2. The Pipe Settings in the Mechanical settings

The size of the single line Rise and Drop symbols are not depended on the Size of the Pipe.

Two Line symbols are.

Below you see the Rise and Drop symbol settings of a Piper System.

Note: set these settings for all your Pipe Systems the same.

Below you see the settings for the Pipe Rise/Drop Annotation Size in the Mechanical settings dialog box.

Hope this helps you clarify your problem.

[marekga]

Hello,

thanks everyone to answer me. But it only confirms that this is not possible to show real vertical pipe size in Coarse/Medium mode.

I wanted to suggest Autodesk to implement such functionality. It is important for MEP designers to see how much space takes a big pipe,

and how much takes a smaller pipe. I tried this way (picture below) but it didn't work.

Is here any Representative of Autodesk, who could confirm that such functionality could be implemented in the future?

In Magicad for Autocad it was possible 🙂

In pure Autocad also.

[RobDraw]

You are forgetting a basic drafting standard. when representing your piping or duct work in single line format, it is symbolic in nature. It does not represent actual size. Drop and rise symbols should be consistent in size.

If you want to show actual size, use two line representation.

[Anonymous]

@RobDrawI agree with you that all single line symbols should be identical in size. but as @marekga mentioned, we (mechanical consultants) need to show double line symbols for pipe risers in wall/shaft, so that we know if all pipes will fit in the given shaft area or not,  and for all other piping on a plan we typically show it as single line. I wish Autodesk will resolve this issue in coming versions and give users more control to show piping as they want to show them on a plan .

P.S. It will be easier if Autodesk can add the function in "Override Graphics in a View - By element" for detail level of individual element.

[RobDraw]

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@Anonymous wrote:

@RobDrawI agree with you that all single line symbols should be identical in size. but as @marekga mentioned, we (mechanical consultants) need to show double line symbols for pipe risers in wall/shaft, so that we know if all pipes will fit in the given shaft area or not,  and for all other piping on a plan we typically show it as single line. I wish Autodesk will resolve this issue in coming versions and give users more control to show piping as they want to show them on a plan .

P.S. It will be easier if Autodesk can add the function in "Override Graphics in a View - By element" for detail level of individual element.

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I've been doing MEP consulting for 15 years and specialize in mechanical. Making the transition to Revit required a different way of presenting our drawings for ductwork, as our plans, at 1/8"=1'-0", combined single line for distribution and double line ductwork at risers. Piping plans, at 1/8" did not reflect actual size. It got messy at that scale. We just made sure to offset the single lines and rise/drop symbols appropriately. We were never required to show actual pipe riser sizes by any of our clients and we did some large and complex projects including cogen plants for large campuses. Two line piping was reserved for 1/4" part plans. That carried over quite nicely to Revit. Our ductwork plans became entirely double line which works well at 1/8".

If your clients require actual pipe sizes for shafts, it might be useful to utilize additional, blown up detail type views for them, which could be quite informative especially if the chases have other services.

[Scott_D_]

Our risers and plant spaces always get a Callout around 1:20 Scale and Fine detail.

If you want the zoomed in detail view, look at the relevant sheet.

This is not AutoCAD, the 'Revit method' is a lot better IMO.

[marekga]

Hello everyone,

it was possible even with my pencil to draw it in scale and now, after so many years it is not possible in such an advanced software like Revit? Unbelievable. There are thousands of options and functions in Revit, but this one is missing. If software is limiting users, something is wrong here. It should be implemented in Coarse and medium mode. Some designers need it, some not. You want to use it - just mark the option, if not - unmark it. But for now - there is no option in Coarse/Medium mode 🙂 From software point of view - it is in my opinion - no problem at all. (If I had a pipe insulated, insulation itself is as big as the real size of it, but pipe itself - not).

Have a good day.

[RobDraw]

You are forgetting two very important things. One, what you want to do is mix drafting techniques on one plan, which to those who know drafting, is technically wrong, like showing ceiling grids on floor plans. Two, Revit is not a drafting program and it has it's limitations. We have all had our frustrations and made adjustments. There are several very simple and correct ways to convey the information you desire to show. If they don't suit you, go back to AutoCAD or that amazing pencil. They will let you brake all the rules.

When it comes to capabilities of software, there are tons of users with opinions on what they think can and can't be done. Programming is a science and opinions mean nothing. Unless you know for a fact and can prove it, I wouldn't be so sure of yourself.

[jhudtwalcker]

the problem I see is not that we need the circle to actually reflect the exact real size, but it must reacts in some way to the scale considering the dimension... If it doesn't, then we will have this:

instead of this:

[RobDraw]

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@jhudtwalcker wrote:

the problem I see is not that we need the circle to actually reflect the exact real size, but it must reacts in some way to the scale considering the dimension... 

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You're contradicting yourself.

Traditionally, single line pipe risers have the same size symbol regardless of size of pipe. The size of that symbol in the model is dependent on the scale of the view. In Revit you can choose a size for that symbol. If you want that symbol to be different sizes according to the size of the pipe, you are going to have to come up with some sort of override.