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Room tag issue

14 REPLIES 14
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Message 1 of 15
tracy.cook
3903 Views, 14 Replies

Room tag issue

It doesn't happen all the time, but when it does it is quite annoying and unprofessional looking. How is it possible to get room tags to stay underneath components, their tags, wires, etc.?

14 REPLIES 14
Message 2 of 15
dbutts7
in reply to: tracy.cook

Edit the tag family - change the background for the text to be opaque. It's under the text type properties.

 

Let me know if this works - thanks!

David A. Butts

Engineering Technology Manager - Gannett Fleming

Autodesk Expert Elite

Revit Certified Professional/Autodesk Certified Instructor

Revit, AutoCAD Architecture, MEP, Plant 3D, BIM Collaborate Pro Subject Matter Expert

The MEP BIM/CAD Engineer Blog

Message 3 of 15
tracy.cook
in reply to: dbutts7

No sir, that was how the text in the tag family was previously. I changed it to transparent hoping that was the fix. All I can come up with  so far is getting rid of the mask (from opaque), but the room tag still sits on top of all other elements.

Message 4 of 15
dbutts7
in reply to: tracy.cook

Sorry, my misunderstanding - we normally want the tag to mask - but in this case, I wouldn't even want it in the room based on how crowded it already is. We would enable the leader and drag it out of the room for clarity, so this is more of a drafting issue...there isn't a send to back/bring forward type capability in Revit when it comes to tags, that's why they have the opaque/transparent settings embedded in the text. 

David A. Butts

Engineering Technology Manager - Gannett Fleming

Autodesk Expert Elite

Revit Certified Professional/Autodesk Certified Instructor

Revit, AutoCAD Architecture, MEP, Plant 3D, BIM Collaborate Pro Subject Matter Expert

The MEP BIM/CAD Engineer Blog

Message 5 of 15
Matt__W
in reply to: tracy.cook

Revit basically assumes that if it's text, you want to see/read it so it pushes it to the top. @dbutts7 suggestion of moving the tag (with a leader) will eliminate the issue of it sitting on top of other things, but at the cost of having to manually adjust each room tag, for each floor, for each trade.



Matt Wunch
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Message 6 of 15
rudi.roux
in reply to: tracy.cook

Hi @tracy.cook

 

Welcome to the community! Smiley Happy

 

Annotations are (and have always been) "always in the foreground." The only way I can think of now to make that not the case is to stack two views on top of one another on a sheet, where the "top view" is then sitting on top of the other views annotations. This as you can imagine is not ideal, so it's not seen as an option or even a workaround for most. 

 

I get where you're coming from, if you take pride in the "cleanness" and "legibility" of your drawings and have annotations/room tags running over your design which you're trying to depict... it almost feels like a small vein on your forehead starts to bulge Smiley LOL

 

What I do is to make use of leaders as already mentioned by @dbutts7 and @Matt__W. I revert to leaders as my last option, what I do prior to using leaders is to Edit the Label Type Text Size and Width Factors. 

 

Yes, there might be standards relating to text sizes, but mainly, a drawing needs to be legible at the intended paper size and scale. 

 

Metric Example:

 

If your current text size is 3mm and width factor is set to 1, you'll pretty much use around 6x 600x600 Ceiling Tiles. Setting the text size to 2mm and width factor to 0.75, you'll then use up around 4x (almost 2x) 600x600 Ceiling Tiles... I can also assure you that a contractor will be able to read text which takes up 4x Ceiling Tiles on a A1 piece of paper...

 

1-TEXT-1.png

 

I hope this helps! Smiley Happy


Rudi Roux
MSc | Digital Engineering Manager
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AutoCAD 2015 Certified Professional | Autodesk Building Performance Analysis (BPA) Certificate

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Message 7 of 15
tracy.cook
in reply to: tracy.cook

Sorry I didn't get back to this sooner, and it almost slipped my mind altogether for a minute until a few minutes ago when I received a friendly get-off-your-butt-and-answer-that-post-already reminder from Autodesk. Smiley Very Happy

 

I'm pretty new at anything forum. But I appreciate the responses. The smaller text for room tags is not an option, we're pretty tight on our standards. That image I posted above was 1/8 scale zoomed way in to get the detail. Didn't want everyone trying to decipher a pixelated example.

 

 I've used the leader in the past on tags as a last resort because I'm not too fond of how it looks when finished. On the other hand, I'm not too happy the other way when we cram so many symbols into such a limited area (that image is just a single example). I'm wondering if this could be a segue to my next topic, which I will post separately.

 

So now what do I do for checking off a solution like the Autodesk e-mail suggested? I'd rather not because I was looking for a way to edit the room tag family somehow. The other suggestions I've used (and will continue to use until I find a future version with what I'll call a X-mas surprise). And thanks again guys, I read this forum more than anything else Revit related because of the well-mannered and knowledgeable community.

 

EDIT: Except stacking views. I never thought of that. There might be another in-house scenario where that could come in handy though. Thanks!

Message 8 of 15
dbutts7
in reply to: tracy.cook

I agree on the leaders - at first glance, just a line going to the room is kind of ugly, but you can change the leader to include a filled dot (which is what we wound up doing), so it looks a little better from the drafting point of view.

 

Underneath the Revit forum, look for Revit Ideas.

 

https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/revit-ideas/idb-p/302/tab/most-recent

 

This is where users can post suggestions, ideas, recipes and safety box combinations (jk). Other users can come in and upvote your idea - if it gets enough momentum, Autodesk pushes it up the list for development.

 

There's a ton of bright and motivated users up here, and I learn something new up here all the time - even though I've been using it for 15 plus years. Thanks for contributing, and let us know when you post up your next topic - I'd be interested in seeing it!

 

thanks - David B.

David A. Butts

Engineering Technology Manager - Gannett Fleming

Autodesk Expert Elite

Revit Certified Professional/Autodesk Certified Instructor

Revit, AutoCAD Architecture, MEP, Plant 3D, BIM Collaborate Pro Subject Matter Expert

The MEP BIM/CAD Engineer Blog

Message 9 of 15
kadmonkee
in reply to: tracy.cook

we set our room tags to Halftone in our model and turn off the room tags from the linked model

we also use the leader w/ filled Dot to clearly define the room and not interfere with the design intent






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Message 10 of 15
ASOL89GEY
in reply to: dbutts7

Hi David,

Thanks for all your contributions to the MEP community over so many years.

Having said that, many times it is not possible to simply "drag the tag out" (e.g. in the middle of the footprint of the building). The crazy part is that if you tag first and then create the MEP element, it displays properly; but then when you retag (cause the Arch changed names), then it hides everything under the tag.

It's pretty sad that we can't simply "send to back" in so many Revit Families. Honestly, can't be that hard from the programming standpoint, but "whatever, it's MEP, who cares! let's add another curvy wall feature for Architects" (Amen?). Have a good week.

 

Message 11 of 15
ASOL89GEY
in reply to: tracy.cook

Many times it is not possible to simply "drag the tag out" (e.g. in the middle of the footprint of the building). The crazy part is that if you tag first and then create the MEP element, it displays properly; but then when you retag (cause the Arch changed names), then it hides everything under the tag.

It's pretty sad that we can't simply "send to back" in so many Revit Families. Honestly, can't be that hard from the programming standpoint, but "whatever, it's MEP, who cares! let's add another curvy wall feature for Architects" (Amen?). Have a good week.

Message 12 of 15
iainsavage
in reply to: ASOL89GEY


@ASOL89GEY  schrieb:

if you tag first and then create the MEP element, it displays properly

 


I don't get that. Red ringed fitting added after room tag.

iainsavage_0-1676565349731.png

Why would you want the room tag under the device? - you wouldn't be able to read the tag so you'd be as well not tagging the room at all.

 

You could make the tag text transparent, that would help:

iainsavage_1-1676565558262.png

You could also use an outline font in the tag:

iainsavage_2-1676565885896.png

Or a simpler font:

iainsavage_3-1676566014950.png

 

 

Message 13 of 15
ASOL89GEY
in reply to: iainsavage

That is what I do. Set it to transparent (but just because it is the only acceptable way)

 

Here is the concept:

The idea is that the trade's information (piping, ductwork, equipment, etc.) should always take precedence.

If you're hiding important fittings or any other relevant information with a "room tag" (which can be deduced from any adjacent rooms or the Architectural plans), then we would be missing the point. There is a reason why the sheet is      P-101 or M-101 because it conveys Plumbing or Mechanical Information (the little room tag is secondary) 

Message 14 of 15
RobDraw
in reply to: ASOL89GEY


@ASOL89GEY wrote:

It's pretty sad that we can't simply "send to back" in so many Revit Families. Honestly, can't be that hard from the programming standpoint, but "whatever, it's MEP, who cares! let's add another curvy wall feature for Architects"


Wow. Someone is feeling victimized today. "Can't be that hard", really? Didn't you read the posts about annotation always taking priority over model elements. It's hard coded. Nothing to do with trades. You need to get out of your little head.

 

This "problem" is solved in a number of ways without changing the program. Any drafter worth their salt can solve this. Room tags are always a necessary evil. On complex MEP projects at 1/8" scale, they can be a time consuming task. In my years before Revit, I started using reduced size versions from the architect's drawings. Text height was 1/16". That was a huge improvement that allowed us to avoid a lot of overlap with and without leaders. For areas that became too crowded, we generated larger scale drawings. If your standards get in the way of finding a solution, it's the standards that are the problem and they need to be re-examined. If you're blaming Revit, you are admitting defeat.


Rob

Drafting is a breeze and Revit doesn't always work the way you think it should.
Message 15 of 15
iainsavage
in reply to: ASOL89GEY


@ASOL89GEY  schrieb:

That is what I do. Set it to transparent (but just because it is the only acceptable way)

 

which can be deduced from any adjacent rooms or the Architectural plans


Hide room tags in the Architectural or structural links, tag them in YOUR model then you can control tag position, size, leader etc.

 


@ASOL89GEY  schrieb:

That is what I do. Set it to transparent (but just because it is the only acceptable way)

 

The idea is that the trade's information (piping, ductwork, equipment, etc.) should always take precedence.

 


Absolutely agree but my point is that if you had the room tag underneath MEP items then the room tag would be illegible and useless and you might as well just not tag that room if there's not enough blank space to locate the tag and you don't want to move it out of the room with a leader.

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