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FAMILY CATEGORY: Moving subcategories over to new family category

FAMILY CATEGORY: Moving subcategories over to new family category

What currently happens?

  • When a family editor receives a family (manufacturer or other) where the family category is
    incorrect there is a lot of manual work involved to move the family to the new, preferred family
    category.
  • All elements that were previously assigned to proper subcategories are transferred on to one
    single category which is the main family category. We then need to delete previous subcategories,
    change family category, create new subcategories and manually re-assign have to manually every
    line work and geometry element individually to move it it’s new subcategory.
  • The current workflow process of changing family category is impractical and creates an unwarranted amount of repetitive re-work that should be able to be automated using in-house Revit features.

What we need, instead

Scenario: If a user decides to change the family category of a family:

  • We need all custom subcategories from existing Family Category (A) to move to the new Family
    Category (B)
  • Ideally there should also be an option to allow Revit to force nested families on to the new nominated
    family category as well or to leave them on their existing family category. (Users need the choice. E.g. of where option might be relevant: Nested taps (plumbing) in a vanity(casework) family.)

Example: Please see attached image. Manufacturer furniture content is often created in "Furniture" or the "Furniture Systems" category. Sometimes we need to switch these family categories. Having every single element moved onto the main Family Category during this process makes it's a risky clean-up endeavor since sometimes there may be multiple elements on top of one another that should be assigned to different subcategories. This process is unforgivably inefficient at present and I am confident that the developer team could find a way to solve this problem if they realized how much it impacted family creation and family management workflows.

 

This is a very old and familiar complaint amongst peers in our industry. Please vote to support this important request!

12 Comments

Maby Im not reading this right, but I can do this with transfer project standards.

Trans PS.jpg

 

Hi vivinyehuushansen4112 , I am happy to clarify my request in case anyone else may also have been confused about what I am suggesting. Thanks for your comments and images, above.  I am happy to answer any further questions if it's still unclear after this 😉

 

We are not just asking:

(1) that the subcategory names be moved across to a new Family Category (E.g. from Family category A to Family Category B) 

(2) or, for the ability to add duplicate subcategory names to the new Family Category (which is what your example of  transferring project standards would do).

 

What we are asking for is this:

1) We need all existing elements that are originally associated to a specific subcategory to be moved across to the new Family category without losing any associations between the subcategory name and the associated elements. In other words the subcategory names and all the element assigned to that subcategory name need to move seamlessly across to the new Family Category.

2) We also need all the legacy subcategory names (from original Family Category) to be removed permanently from family file. We don't want any double up's of subcategory names so that subcategories load into project under both Family Categories.

3) To avoid manually re-assigning elements to original subcategories that were under original Family Category.

 

It would be much easier:

  • OPTION 1: (a) to rename an existing subcategory . Would be a 1-5 minute exercise, including nested families ($)

- than to -

 

  • OPTION 2:  (i) delete original subcategories, (ii) change family category, (iii) add new subcategories and (iv) then manually re-assign every single element to new subcategories under new Family Category. This process takes 15-60 minutes PER FAMILY, depending on nesting ($$$$$$)

 

If Autodesk can change a Family Category then I can't see why they can't find a way to move all associated subcategories as well. It might not be easy to achieve, but it must be programmatically possible and it's definitely a functionality that the entire industry needs to make content clean-up and content integration a financially feasible and a time-efficient exercise.

 

I hope this helps clarify any confusion regarding what I am asking for  😉

[This is not a new idea, the industry has been asking for this change for more than a decade.]

I’m still not sure of what you are trying to  achieve.

Anyway, is it a possibility for you to add these to your family template?

Ive have added parameters and sub categories to family templates so users always name this the same way.

 

if is not what you are looking for, I’m sorry.

Hi vivinyehuushansen4112, Both of to ur replies seems to suggest that you are misunderstanding this software enhancement request.

 

Creating family templates with pre-defined subcategories has nothing to do with this issue since we are not talking about changing Family Categories of brand new families that have no content in them. 

 

I appreciate you trying to offer solutions to the problem but there is no solution to this problem at present that does not involve the actions listed in my previous reply under OPTION 2. 

 

Yes, transferring the subcategories from a family template file across the the family is an option, (1) after all element assignments have been removed from previous subcategories and (2) the Family category has been changed to me category but that is not really the point. All transferring subcategories will do is save someone the inconvenience of re-typing all new subcategories manually but it does not transfer previously assigned objects back onto the correct subcategories after the Family Category has been changed.

 

Why do we need this functionality? 

This process of changing Family Categories of existing families is done often when companies have to clean-up manufacturer families so that they import well into Revit projects under the correct Family Categories and match the company subcategories.

 

Many advanced Revit firms have project templates that use customised View Templates and it becomes very important to import families into projects under the correct family categories and matching company template subcategories.

 

If your firm does not use View Templates or if you don’t use any external content on projects then you may have never faced this issue yourself. 

 

There are however many firms that are very familiar with the issue of cleaning up and converting externally sourced content in order to integrate the families into their audited library.

 

E.g. If we receive 300 furniture families that are all in the incorrect Family Category we have to manually edit each family and redo all the Family subcategory names and assignments as described above. It is incredibly inefficient and adds significant risk to editing all manufacturers content that could simply be avoided without Autodesk’s programming assistance. 

 

I hope this may have helped you understand the issue better. Thanks for your replies.

Hi vivinyehuushansen4112, 

ps. I notice you work in the MEP sector so you may be less affected by this issue. In architecture or interiors decor manufactures can sometimes make a family in all kinds of Family Categories that might not suit us.

E.g. furniture or equipment can be made using various Family templates based on cuttable requirements or additional features such as casework, generic model, furniture, furniture systems, speciality equipment and more.

 

I guess in MEP the Family Categories are used with far more specific guidelines of appropriate industry standard 🙂 

Okay, now I understand.

In my company you, it’s strictly forbidden to use other families than company families, maybe that’s why we don’t have this issue.

me only use company templates and company families.

we also have architects, structure etc.

same rules fore everyone.

families found on the web are only  causing trouble😊

 

But now that I understand your request I’m sorry so say. I think there’s a long waiting for this. I’ve bin requesting for hidden lines in all family categories for six years now, Together with maintain annotation orientation in all family category’s. And still nothing.

So cross your fingers, and maybe start a strategy for families used in your firm.

 

Ps. The dynamo scripting.

the worst comment I know, sorry

cprice
Advocate

To be honest, if this feature was implemented I'd want it to be optional.  Rarely have I ever opened a family created by someone else have I thought, oh those sub-categories are great, but I need the family category to be different. 

 

I guess these days I'm just 100% resigned to rebuilding any piece of content where I wasn't the one who created it originally and in which case I'd generally prefer to assign sub-categories element by element...

 

The ideal scenario would be some sort of mapping dialog window, but that seems way to niche for Autodesk to ever implement and something more likely suited to a custom plugin or script...

Totally agree Chris. Optional is fine as long as we have it. At Woods Bagot we just have too many studios and too many teams and projects to expect that all content can be built from scratch. It’s just not feasible. Thanks for the comment and support! M

Quick cleanup and conversion is imperative for us, when using manufacture content. But, would I (personally) download some random family from the web? Definitely not. But unfortunately truly experienced content creators are hard to come by, as you know, and most studios don’t have enough content resources. Even small firms need the option of this feature to try an automate the content quickly, with minimal fuss, before adding it to their projects. Easy external content integration needs to become a much higher priority in Revit for small and large firms to benefit from externally made content of they have even the most basic View Templates or template standards.

jquarry
Contributor

Resurrecting this old thread.

 

I completely agree that there’s a significant need for efficient management of manufacturer content in BIM, especially given the advancements over the past five years.

While it’s true that many BIM Managers have historically been cautious about using manufacturer-provided content, the situation has improved with the availability of better resources. When managed properly, this content can be integrated into a company’s library effectively, provided that office standards are applied.

For instance, I’ve been working with a range of manufacturer content, specifically related to casework, which we have decided to incorporate rather than recreate from scratch. We have existing generic casework families that I’ve been refining since 2005 to align with our schedules and view templates. These serve most of our needs, but now we’ve decided to base our design on a specific healthcare casework manufacturer’s products.

My current challenge is to efficiently add subcategories to these new families so they integrate seamlessly with our view templates, similar to our library casework families. Although the new content is already categorized correctly as casework, I need a way to batch import the necessary subcategories.

I was hoping to find a Dynamo solution to streamline this process and am surprised that one hasn’t been mentioned yet in this thread. If I come across a script or solution that addresses this need, I’ll be sure to update this thread to help others facing similar challenges.

 

I look forward to any suggestions or solutions others may have found.

 

Appreciate resurrecting this. It's an oldie but a goodie! Would make life SO much easier, wouldn't it?

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