Sump shape modeling parameters using conceptual mass family

[REDO10]

Hi everyone,

I am trying to model a trapezoidal geometric shape (sump of a circular tank) in order to use it in my various circular tank projects..so I've to create a sump's void form witch I can use to cut my slab and put my sump in place. (the details of the shape and its position relative to the axis of the tank are defined according to the sketch below)

I managed to model a fixed shape of my sump according to the above data using a conceptual mass family, but i still have to determinate an exact formula to set parameters of the trigonometric distances D1 and D2 as shown in the sketch witch are function of the sump opening angle of the compared to the tank axis

Do you have any idea how to find the exact formula to calculate distances D1 and D2?

Please check my attached file below

Thanks.

[barthbradley]

Here's a good reference to keep handy:

https://revitforum.org/showthread.php/1046-Revit-Formulas-for-quot-everyday-quot-usage

[Alfredo_Medina]

I think that it is not necessary to find those distances, because the family does not need to have round edges on the left side. Those edges could be rectangular. Since the family is going to cut the tank, and the tank is circular, the result would be a void with round edges on the left side.  

[RDAOU]

@REDO10 

Not sure why in a mass family...I used a Generic Model for the pit (Nested into a Floor based generic model where a void that cuts the host is added)

Assuming that Wall radius + Top Length x Width x Depth are the user's input to define types, the outcome turned out as follows:

    

[REDO10]

Hi DR.RD,

thanks a lot for your reply and for the demonstration video you have put...its very useful for me

Just a precision: my sump have a trapezoidal form in both faces (interior and exterior) but your shape is trapezoidal for interior face and rectangular for exterior.. (see my shape below)

can you correct the shape for me and send me your file?

Note: I'm using Revit 2021.

Thanks.

[RDAOU]

@REDO10 

Would that be as per below image? 

Do you know how to nest it into a Face or Floor base to add a void that cuts host automatically? Alternatively, you could keep it simple, use the generic family as is and edit the profile of the Floor in the model?

[REDO10]

Hi DR.RD

Yes I want it as your image above

I would like to nest it automatically into my slab (I want to generate in the same time the void in my slab and the walls of my shape that can be attached at slab).

Send me your file pls

THX.

[REDO10]

Hi DR.RD

I saw your file and frankly I didn't think it was that complicated to model my sump when I saw the formulas you employ and I wouldn't be able to do it on my own !!

I still have some questions :

1. how did you find the trigonometric formulas for the parameters (D1a, D1b, D2a, D2b and the angle?) ... can you give me any documentations if it possible?

2. why dimensions of those parameters are only visible in the properties table and not into the drawing such as the other parameters (W_Top, L_Top, wall thickness ..)?

3. why I cannot apply the concrete material for the walls when the sump is nested in the raft?...how can I do that?

4. how do I make the sump insertion point coincide with the center of the raft?

Note: Maybe I've put "accept solution" to my problem by error

have a nice day

Thanks.

[REDO10]

@Discussion_Admin
Kindly do not mark my solutions
Thanks.

[RDAOU · Accepted solution]

@REDO10 

I will answer in reverse order,

4. Where is the center of the raft with respect to the Sump pit? Is it the center of the circle/wall? if it is the latter, simply select the vertical Reference plane passing thought the center and in the properties panel check the box Defines Origin.

3. I think I did not associate the geometry with any parameters. To do that, you need to Edit the Family >> select the Geometry >>> In the properties panel click the box next to material and associate it to a parameter (type or instance is up to you)

2. I am not sure what you mean. All parameters in the family I transferred control an annotation either on the Plan view, section or elevation 

1. D1a, D1b D2a and D2b were calculated using the Pythagorean theorem . They control the Reference planes that determine the intersection between the circular wall and the lateral wall see image below:

PS: I have added a void to cut the slab when you load into the project. I will upload the new and port you the link please do not just use it as it is. Try to break it down and reconstruct it to learn how to build the next one on your own.

[REDO10]

Hi DR.RD

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@RDAOU wrote:

2. I am not sure what you mean. All parameters in the family I transferred control an annotation either on the Plan view, section or elevation 

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Sorry not all parameters...I want to say Offset bottom and Angle  those parameters have not dimensions in all views?

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@RDAOU wrote:

1. D1a, D1b D2a and D2b were calculated using the Pythagorean theorem . They control the Reference planes that determine the intersection between the circular wall and the lateral wall see image below:

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Ah Ok....its escaped to me to using the Pythagorean theorem to solve my problem and determine these dimensions (D1a, D1b, D2a and D2b) 🙄 🙄🤔

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@RDAOU wrote:

PS: I have added a void to cut the slab when you load into the project. I will upload the new and port you the link please do not just use it as it is. Try to break it down and reconstruct it to learn how to build the next one on your own.

It's certain !! I'm going to break down and reconstruct your model which serves to me as a basis to build my own shapes in the future ... it's great to learn from you and from this wonderful forum!! 😉

Thanks a lot DR.RD for your contribution

Have a nice day 😉

[Discussion_Ad]

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@REDO10 wrote:
@Discussion_Admin
Kindly do not mark my solutions
Thanks.

---

??? not sure what you mean

DA

[REDO10]

Hi,

You put "accept solution" to two answers to my problem or maybe I did it by mistake!!

Thanks.

[alfmedina]

@REDO10 , you, as the person who asked the question, you are the person who should mark one of the posts as the solution. If you don't do it after some days and there is a post that is clearly a solution, one of the moderators can do it. Usually the administrator of the forum does not mark solutions. 

[RDAOU]

There is definitely something not right in this post. I have at least received 6 notifications that a new solution has been accepted! (last of which was a few seconds ago)

I do not think it is the administrator and a mistake could happen once or twice but not 6!! I would say it is either a Moderator or an Elite OR the Forum itself is messing up considering that on other posts I am even getting notifications of new replies which people actually posted before I even join the thread!

[alfmedina]

Seems that it was the OP who had marked multiple posts as solutions. Then somebody unmarked all the solutions, and today the OP (I think) has finally marked as solution one post only. 

[REDO10]

HI All,

This time it is me who marked the solution posted by DR.RD on 05-16-21 at 07:36 PM as an "accepted solution".

Thanks.