Project North not matching between Linked Files

[Anonymous]

Hi there!

I am currently working on a urban plan that contains two rvt. files: one in which the Pads, the Topography and other site-related objects are placed and another one meant to host all project related elements, such as walls, floors, roofs but also the final plans and the sheets where they'll be printed. 

The 'Project rvt.' is linked to the 'Site rvt.' and vice-versa, in order to make the files lighter and to be able to work on them independently.

The thing is that I want to rotate the Project North on the 'Project rvt.' in order to place the plans on the sheets, but whenever I do it (which works just fine in the Project File, both site and buildings rotating), it totally changes the relationship between the site and the buildings on the 'Site rvt.' I tried to rotate the Project North on the 'Site rvt.' in the same way I had done on the other file to see if it matched the orientation but it made matters worse...

I'm attaching two images below to show the situation. The first Image shows the 'Site rvt.' before rotating Project North in the 'Project rvt.' and the second one shows the same Site file after the rotation.

Any ideas or best practices on how to solve this?

Kind Regards

[barthbradley]

Did you set up Share Coordinates between the two?  Doesn't sound like it.  

[Anonymous]

I don't recall doing it.

Is it possible to do so at this stage?

[barthbradley · Accepted solution]

Well, this is key.  Move the Building Project Link  to the correct location, orientation and elevation in the Site Project, and then select the Building Project Link and Publish Coordinates (Manage Tab: Coordinates: Publish Coordinates).  Save the Project and the Link Position.  

[barthbradley]

Just to confirm something; you mention that you are changing the View between Project North and True North. I take that to mean that you have an Angle to True North value entered for the Project Base Point. Is that correct?

BTW: the other method to set up Shared Coordinates, would be to Link the Site Project into the Building Project, move it to the correct orientation and elevation relative to the Project Building, and then select Site Link and Acquire Coordinates (Manage Tab=>Coordinates=>Acquire Coordinates).   Save Project/Link Position.  

[Anonymous]

As an answer to your 1st reply, I managed to do just like you told me and it worked fine, thanks! So, I am wondering about what this Publish Coordinates actually does: it gives consistency throughout all links loaded in a project, and avoids further movements, right? So, in which case would I use 'Accquire Coordinates'?

As far as I've understood, True North gets shared in each link, right? And Project North is set according to my will in each of the different links?

As an answer to your second reply, my Project Base Point had no angle to True North because P. North and T. North had the exact same orientation, hence my problem when trying to give P. North a different angle.

Because both rvt.'s were interlinked, your second suggestion would work exactly the same as Publishing Coordinates from the Site Project, right? 

Thanks!

[Anonymous]

So, something crazy just happened to the mass that was representing the existing urban fabric, which was placed at the Site Project. I've been changing Project North in both links to see whether everything was functioning, but apparently not...

 

The mass not only moved but also distorted! How did this happened??

[barthbradley]

Changing a View between Project North and True North would not have anything to do with this.  Changing a View from Project North to True North is akin to rotating a piece of paper sitting on your desk for a better writing angle.  So we can rule out that out.  

Tell me more about this Mass. Is it a Revit Mass?  How was it created and placed into the Site Project.

...Try Pinning the "Mass" element before changing the View's  True North/Project North Orientation.  

[Anonymous]

I know, but it's all I've done. I was "flexing" Project North on both links to see if they would stick to each other but apparently I exaggerated and it bugged... It was a 100% Revit Mass created on the 'Site rvt.'. It was not even placed. RIP Mass.

I'm going to pick the rvt. backups and restart the 'Shared Coordinate' the way I just learned, because I find no way of reverting the mass to it's original shape... However, I will leave both files if you want to check them out!

[ToanDN]

Here is a basic workflow that guarantees to make your life easier, whether you have one or multiple buildings on a site.

- model the site from a survey
- model the building with its orientation upright, do not change project north or true north, location of buiding should be around the original project base point/ internal origin
- link the site in the building, unpin and relocate it to match the building location
- acquire coordinates from the site link, now your survey point and true north with match the site's
- if you wanf to link the building back in the site, simply link using shared coordinates

[barthbradley]

You have a circular reference. "...Projecto2.rvt" is Linked into itself.  Remove the Link and Save.  Everything is right as rain afterwards.  No problems happening on my end.  

...just to be clear: no problem on my end Acquiring and establishing Shared Coordinates between the two Projects.  

[Anonymous]

Ok, this is happening, as I suspected, on the Site Project when I try to rotate its Project North. It's actually not an issue because I don't need to actually do it but it seems odd enough for me. The Mass was pinned and still it didn't work.

 

[Anonymous]

Project is linked to Site, and Site is linked to Project because I need to edit both with the other right above it. If I unlink it I cannot edit one of the projects with the other as a reference... If that's the cause of the deformed mass, I will just not change any orientation on the Site project and leave it like that. I appreciate your help 😉

[barthbradley]

Have you set up Shared Coordinates?  Doesn't sound like it. Follow my previous instructions. Like I said, I'm have no issues on my end.  

Try these:

[Anonymous]

(This comment is being edited)

[barthbradley]

I had to reattach the files above.  See the new ones.  Both projects are linked into each other. What I said before was that one project was linked into itself.  The files I posted above have the other Linked into it.  

[Anonymous]

@barthbradley  I have used Shared coordinates the exact same you told me, if by them you mean using 'Publishing Coordinates'. Both links were placed at the right spot before publishing coordinates in the 'Site rvt.' using the linked file that contained the project. That helped me establishing a different Project North on the 'Project rvt.' without changing the link's position back on the 'Site rvt.' 

At the moment, my files look exactly like the ones you sent me back. However, if you change the Project North on the Site Project you will almost likely end up with some of those strange looking Masses.

Our friend @ToanDN says that if you want to link a building project back to a site project you need to, and I quote, 'link the building back in the site using shared coordinates'. What does that mean anyway? Does it mean you use some other feature apart from 'Publishing Coordinates' that I am not following through?

The case is settled anyway, so everything we're discussing here is just further learning.

[barthbradley]

Okay, I just re-examined the Masses in your original files. I am not seeing any peculiar behavior happening to them when I change the change the View Orientation between Project North and True North -- in either Project.   

BTW: you are correct. Your original files are linked together nicely. My bad.

[barthbradley]

Maybe this will provide a clue, but like I said I don't see anything weird happening. Maybe you have a keener eye than I do.

Edit In-Place Mass reveals this: 

[ToanDN]

I can see the distortion in the mass. I would avoid rotating project north at all cost since I have experienced elements out of place when doing so. The distortion of your mass may have something to do with the rotation. Project North should always be upright and you can always rotate True North to establish the same relationship between the two norths.

I would go back to your original model before rotating project north and do the above.