Basic VG Question.....

[payingtoomuch]

Need to make sure I have a handle on this.

I know there are distinctions between visibility graphics "overrides" for the view and  the visibility graphics in the view templates "overrides". What always seems to get my head spinning is that they use the term overrides for both.

Anyway.... am I correct in my understanding of the following:

• When I select the VIEW TEMPLATE in the properties pallet that is assigned to the particular view that I'm changing the settings for that view template globally and it will stick?
  • And that this button is basically the same as accessing the View Templates button in the ribbon
• When I select the Visibility Graphics Override button in the Properties pallet this is an actual override of what the current View Template is assigning to the view.
  • And that this button is basically the same as the overrides you assign via the visibility graphics button in the ribbon..... and this is also an override of whatever settings have been made in the actual view template.

I think I understand the above but just want to make certain that I'm not have some misunderstanding here.

[JasonKunkel]

• When I select the VIEW TEMPLATE in the properties pallet that is assigned to the particular view that I'm changing the settings for that view template globally and it will stick?
  • And that this button is basically the same as accessing the View Templates button in the ribbon

Basically, yes. But keep in mind that the VIEW TEMPLATES do not necessarily control all the view settings. That's what the checkbox is for:

If the row is not "checked", the View Template will not control it.

• When I select the Visibility Graphics Override button in the Properties pallet this is an actual override of what the current View Template is assigning to the view.
  • And that this button is basically the same as the overrides you assign via the visibility graphics button in the ribbon..... and this is also an override of whatever settings have been made in the actual view template.

Not exactly for the first bullet. If the View Template is controlling the setting (see the checkbox above) then the Visibility Graphics settings will be greyed out and you cannot change them. The View Template controls all.

But the second bullet is mostly correct - VG, VV, ribbon button, Properties palette button all go to the same place.

[payingtoomuch]

humh. Dang!

"Basically, yes. But keep in mind that the VIEW TEMPLATES do not necessarily control all the view settings. That's what the checkbox is for"

So, the "include" tick box is an override of sorts of the view template that is assigned as well? BUT it is assigning that tick box to the template globally as well right?

I was thinking that that tick box was a way to turn on/ off the selectability of the parameter. But what you're saying is that that parameter does not apply to the view at all... and that is the reason it is greyed back and not selectable? If that's the case then what does the view default to for that particular parameter? Regardless this is huge and important that I get my head wrapped around. Thanks for  pointing that out.

"If the View Template is controlling the setting (see the checkbox above) then the Visibility Graphics settings will be greyed out and you cannot change them. The View Template controls all."

WOW! DING! I see now that there is a connection between the tick box selections in the View Template! Those tick boxes determine what can be overridden correct? So, when I look at my properties pallet I can tell what is allowed to be changed/ overridden FOR that particular view template.... correct? Again, this is huge. Had no idea.

Also.... Interpolating.... So basically any time I select/ change any parameter that is available to change in the properties palette I'm effectively overriding the view template?

[JasonKunkel]

I think we are on the same page, but just to nail it down...

The tickbox in the View Template is what is included in the View Template. It's what the View Template cares about. If it's checked, the View Template controls that setting. If it's clear, the View Template does NOT control that setting.

Take Scale for example. I could (it would be dumb) have a View Template that ONLY controls the Scale of the view that use that View Template. Every other setting would be controlled somewhere else.

ONLY View Scale is checked.

In the View that is using that View Template, I cannot edit Scale...

If I change scale in the View Template, it will change the View's scale.

As soon as I check another box in the View Template, that setting is grayed out in the Properties palette.

 So basically any time I select/ change any parameter that is available to change in the properties palette I'm effectively overriding the view template?

I would say "not really." If you change a setting in the properties palette, that is not "overriding" the View Template, b/c the View Template is not even controlling that setting. The View Template has nothing to do with that setting. Now, you can go back and then check that box in the View Template and then the view inherits the View Template setting and that field gets grayed out in the properties palette.

I think once you play around with it a bit and check and uncheck those boxes it will help make sense as well.

[payingtoomuch]

Thanks Jason. Appreciate your helping me to get my head wrapped around this better. Yes, I'll play with things keeping all this in background while I'm figuring it all out.

[payingtoomuch]

In your opinion (and others) is the below a REALLY bad idea?

Working towards trying to get a clean template for my modeling.

I have all of my various templates set up but I'm experiencing some visibility issues in part because I've based my new templates on some templates I inherited.

The templates were also initially based on some views that I inherited and applied various view templates to.

So my thinking is that I have these views now that potentially have all kinds of overrides assigned to them so I want to clean that up.

So the thinking is just take ALL of my views and eliminate ALL of the overrides.

The intent is to figure out a way to have all my views assigned reasonably specific view templates with VERY limited overrides.

Am I going to create all kinds of headaches approaching this way?

Thinking I might also want to deselect the tick boxes for all the view template overrides and ONLY turn these tick boxes on as needed. That way I don't have any "arbitrary" overrides later.

Anything else you can think of I might want to do to clean things up having a fresh template?

[JasonKunkel]

I love Voltron, but it is usually bad way to build a Revit template, sadly. Starting from scratch helps avoid any old baggage that might have sneaked into the other models. The usual baggage that we hunt down are things like:

• Imported DWGs that led to gobs of extra Object Styles that are useless
• Redundant line and patterns that are exactly the same but have slightly different names
• Way too many text and dimension styles
• Bad RFAs

As far as approaching the View Templates with limited settings, it's a mixed bag. If you leave it too "open" they won't be useful and users will avoid them. It is a delicate balance. You certainly don't want to lock down everything b/c that can be even more annoying to users. 

I bet you can make a good educated guess as to what tick boxes to have on/off and get yourself ahead of the game as opposed to turning them all off at first and then turning on as needed. It won't be 100% but honestly a template never is. I would say to take a stab at what feels like the appropriate level of control to you based on the view's purpose.

[payingtoomuch]

Voltron?

Thanks Jason. Makes sense. Just need to get into it I guess.

[RobDraw]

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@payingtoomuch wrote:

In your opinion (and others) is the below a REALLY bad idea?

Working towards trying to get a clean template for my modeling.

I have all of my various templates set up but I'm experiencing some visibility issues in part because I've based my new templates on some templates I inherited.

Am I going to create all kinds of headaches approaching this way?

---

I've always preferred to start my project templates from scratch. If it's an "established" template, keep a copy for easy reference/transferring of anything that is/might be needed. 

Trying to decide if you should hang on to things that you're not familiar with can be a double edged sword depending on your work environment.

[payingtoomuch]

Thanks Rob for the interest. Have started the process of cleaning up and hope it doesn't bite me too hard later.