Arc beams for curved and visibility issue

[jesser]

Try to keep this short.

Placing curved beams below a curved roof.  Using the beam tool and placing on a picked plane in a building section.  If the curve radius is below a floor level below the level of association with the beam placement the beam will be visible in those plans.  This seems to be a REVIT issue.  If the beam's curve radius is above a floor level the beam above doesn't show up on the floor plan.  I have seen suggestions to use filters, but that seems like a bandaid.  Has anyone else had this problem?  Is Autodesk aware of this flaw?  For now we will make a family and model the beam exactly how we need and load it in.  This works, but truly is a workaround.  We should be able to use the REVIT built-in tool as intended and not have graphic display issues.

[Alfredo_Medina]

How can a software company anticipate all the infinite circumstances that might occur in the users' designs? Revit provides all kinds of tools to deal with visibility. Use them.

[barthbradley]

Finesse the Beam's Cross Section Rotation. 

I think you referring to this:

Structural beams disappear from floor plan view after being joined in Revit (autodesk.com)

[jesser]

Alfredo,

This is clearly not how Autodesk would intend the tool to work.  It is a flaw, that perhaps can be fixed.  This isn't a "USER" design issue as you suggest.  I placed a curved beam and a flat beam associated with the same level, let's call it level 3.  Why on earth would I want the curved beam to be visible on a level 1 view?  The flat beam isn't visible, just the curved beam.  Because the arc radius falls below level 1.  Sure I can hide them, filter them, but shouldn't have to complicate our models, views and workflow for this IMHO.  Modeling it in a family is a much better approach, then work around visibility methods that are not intuitive to anyone else working in the model because it is a workaround.  Again I am trying to figure out if this is something Autodesk knows about as I bet this isn't how they intended it to work.  Thanks.

[barthbradley · Accepted solution]

Uncheck show Family Pre-cut in Plan Views in Family

[jesser]

Thanks, but modifying the family will affect the family when placed flat as well.  We are using a beam family and placing along an arc.  Again this is a visibility issue ONLY when the beam is placed curved when the radius point is below a level. It will be visible in a floor plan view, even if the beam is above the cut plane and shouldn't normally be visible based on view range settings.

[barthbradley]

Why do you need Pre-Cut for Beams? 

[jesser]

Honestly we may not need to.  I gave your suggestion a try and it did solve this specific issue.  I don't fully understand the impacts of unchecking this down the road, but this looks like the solution for now.  Thanks.

[Alfredo_Medina]

I made a test model, to reproduce this case, based on the information that you provide. A building with 3 levels. From a section view, on a workplane, I drew a beam, with the arc tool, with center on the first floor. Then I created floor plans with fine level of detail to see the beam. The beam is visible only on the 3rd level, as it should.

My point is that many users jump quickly to conclusions about the software, blaming Revit and Autodesk for something that they see in their models, thinking that it is a Revit issue, when it can be the result of some specific actions that the user took in his model, which doesn´t happen in other models to other users. 

[jesser]

Alfredo,

I appreciate your time on this.  That is great it worked for you.  Did you see previous post discussion Pre-Cut being checked on or off?  Some people are quick to point out flaws.  I am not one of them.  I have been using REVIT solely since 2010 and do a lot of searching, attempting different methods, before I post here.  I appreciate your defense of REVIT/Autodesk, but your direction at me is missing the mark and quite frankly isn't appreciated.  The point is that the arc beam show up when a horizontal beam does not.  At least in 2023.  So I ask, does your beam family have Pre-Cut unchecked?

[Alfredo_Medina]

Again, this is an issue in your model. When I tried to reproduce the case, the issue does not happen. And no, I have not changed any settings in the beam family.

And I am not defending Revit or Autodesk. I express my thoughts frankly when something is not working. But in this case, I cannot reproduce the issue. Views show what they are supposed to show. So I guess this is something specific to your model, your settings, your methods. Not something that should be immediately escalated to "Revit, Autodesk".

[barthbradley · Accepted solution]

I thought this was the condition?  

Show Family Pre-Cut in Plan Views CHECKED:

Show Family Pre-Cut in Plan Views UNCHECKED:

[jesser]

Thanks for sharing this.  The Pre-Cut toggle seems to be the key.  It is interesting that even when the beam is curved up as you were showing that is still is visible in the levels below.  If you move it up in elevation there is a point that is will not be visible, so there is some factor causing it to be visible where it shouldn't be.  Seems like a bug.  Thanks for looking into this.

[ToanDN]

Precut is to present a member as it appears in the family.  It is more useful for structural framing drawings, and not for architectural drawings, especially when a member is not plumb, or is curved like what you have. 

[jesser]

That makes total sense and see how that could be helpful.  One would think that if the physical beam or any of the curved beam is NOT within the view range it wouldn't be visible in levels below.  Per barthbradley's images it is still visible which is problematic, but fortunately Pre-Cut does "fix" the issue.