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M560V Okuma opinions

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Message 1 of 23
Lonnie.Cady
4036 Views, 22 Replies

M560V Okuma opinions

Anyone have any opinions on an M560V Okuma they would be interested in sharing?

 

 

 

 

22 REPLIES 22
Message 2 of 23
Rob.Lockwood
in reply to: Lonnie.Cady

Things are built like tanks. I've never been sold on Okumas windows based control, but I've also never used one, just played around while lathe shopping. If I needed a big 3axis mill, the m560v would be at the top of the list, as I dont actually think anything else compares well. All of the other typical players have been cutting corners.

But I thought you were 5x shopping? 🙂


Rob Lockwood
Maker of all the things.
| Oculus | | Locked Tool | | Instagram |

Message 3 of 23
Lonnie.Cady
in reply to: Rob.Lockwood

I am shopping for a 5 axis. But that is some what of a longer term project  I just sold my VF3 on friday.  I also have a VM3 I am considering selling and would just purchase one higher quality mill to replace the 2 haas.  I no longer do job shop work for other companies so one mill for my parts is sufficient.

 

 

 

 

Message 4 of 23

We are talking the Genos right?
That is the "cheap" line they have at okuma. So don't expect the machine to be the insane okuma quality. It's more just above the doosan and mori machines. Probably still we would take a look at those since the price is really competitive. But I don't think I would ever buy a "small" 3-axis mill anymore. Or bed-type milling machine if you need a big one, or a 5-axis machining center.

Laurens Wijnschenk
3DTechDraw

AutoDesk CAM user & Post editor.
René for Legend.


Message 5 of 23
greg
in reply to: Lonnie.Cady

I know a few MV-560 owners.

 

Every single one of them is absolutely gobsmacked happy with them:

 

- One has a room full of Moris/Citzens. An NH4000, two DuraVertical 5100s, 3 NLs, and an NTX. He needed a new vertical on his floor ASAP for a big Boing job, right during the Mori/Ellison breakup, so he begrudgingly got the MV-560 because they could have it in his shop within a week. His subsequent experience with the new NLX and the awful support, and silly changes... he's thinking about becoming an Okuma guy from now on.

 

- Another is a job shop that now has 2 MV-460s. They bought them after running a set of 3 Fadals ragged. Paid cash. One had a minor crash requiring a new spindle that Okuma got to them within 24 hours and the factory support was amazing. Totally reliable.

 

- A local R&D shop just got a new MV-560 installed and they have nothing but praise for the entire process. They are absolutely happy with it, and this is a world-class shop where the term "absolutely happy" is extraordinary praise.

 

I bought my Robodrill as a starter machine, with the plan that it could get some work done while being a big learning experience with the eventual goal of bringing some of our production in-house on a fast, 4th axis equipped, mill. The only two machines I'm considering are the Speedio X1000S1 and the Genos MV-560... and it really comes down to cost and the kind of philosophy I wish to subscribe to for production. They are the short list for a very simple reason - they meet my needs and they are the only two machines that do so where I've yet to read anything but praise about them (Hermle is the only other company I've heard people speak so highly of buying from). 

Message 6 of 23
Lonnie.Cady
in reply to: greg

@greg thanks for the info,  I have only heard good things on them also.  Everyone on the practical machinist seems to love them.  I almost wish I could hear something negative about them so it sounded more realistic.  I like the design compared to a "C" frame.  They also look more ergonomic for the operator. Also the ability to load thru the side looks nice vs loading all tools thru spindle.  On our VM3 which is based on a VF5 frame it can get to be a long reach to he spindle for me.

 

The only down fall I can see is the short z axis.  It is only about 18" IIRC.   There is a new model that is supposed to be at IMTS with an extended z axis.

Message 7 of 23
Steinwerks
in reply to: Lonnie.Cady

As mentioned on another thread on PM, the Z min distance is still 6" from the table, so really there's 24" between table and spindle nose at maximum extension, which isn't too bad. I don't get the impression it's a Haas noodle either so a few long holders aren't going to raise the cycle times through the roof.

 

Z Table Height.JPG

Neal Stein



New to Fusion 360 CAM? Click here for an introduction to 2D Milling, here for 2D Turning.

Find me on:
Instagram and YouTube
Message 8 of 23
irobotix
in reply to: Lonnie.Cady

I know this is an old thread, I came across it tonight browsing.

 

I just purchased a brand new M560V, with tool setter and part probe.  It's due in this week.  I chose it over the Doosan DNM5700 because I wanted something other than a Fanuc control.  I can post more info once we get it installed and up and running if there's still interest.

Message 9 of 23


@irobotix wrote:

I know this is an old thread, I came across it tonight browsing.

 

I just purchased a brand new M560V, with tool setter and part probe.  It's due in this week.  I chose it over the Doosan DNM5700 because I wanted something other than a Fanuc control.  I can post more info once we get it installed and up and running if there's still interest.


There are a lot of reasons to buy an Okuma over a Doosan but the Fanuc control really can't be it, if you ask me. I mean programming wise they are very similar and Doosan also gives you the choice of Siemens and Heidenhain. With the Siemens being great for on-machine programming, the Heidenhain is usually the fastest option(Block processing time and Smoothing options). And the Fanuc the most reliable choice of control, it lacks fancy screens but it runs all the time. And if it would break down they guarantee that you can buy the parts at least 20 years.(Something the Okuma control is famous for not doing)

 

But there are a lot of other things to consider of course when buying a machine and Okuma's are a great choice.

Would love to hear what you think when you are actually using it.

 

 

Laurens Wijnschenk
3DTechDraw

AutoDesk CAM user & Post editor.
René for Legend.


Message 10 of 23


@Laurens-3DTechDraw wrote:

@irobotix wrote:

I know this is an old thread, I came across it tonight browsing.

 

I just purchased a brand new M560V, with tool setter and part probe.  It's due in this week.  I chose it over the Doosan DNM5700 because I wanted something other than a Fanuc control.  I can post more info once we get it installed and up and running if there's still interest.


There are a lot of reasons to buy an Okuma over a Doosan but the Fanuc control really can't be it, if you ask me. I mean programming wise they are very similar and Doosan also gives you the choice of Siemens and Heidenhain. With the Siemens being great for on-machine programming, the Heidenhain is usually the fastest option(Block processing time and Smoothing options). And the Fanuc the most reliable choice of control, it lacks fancy screens but it runs all the time. And if it would break down they guarantee that you can buy the parts at least 20 years.(Something the Okuma control is famous for not doing)

 

But there are a lot of other things to consider of course when buying a machine and Okuma's are a great choice.

Would love to hear what you think when you are actually using it.

 

 


Actually okuma is very famous here for doing just that.  One shop here just had tape readers put on an old machine.  Okuma builds the drives and everything from what I understand and have one of the best support for machines out there.  They offered a lifetime guarantee on the control.

 

As for the Doosan, I like it.  I still stand by the opinion that fanuc are one of the least friendly controls out there.  It is not like it is unusable but the number of keystrokes just to load a program is not right.   On haas it was list program, F2 to copy, select memory and you are ready to run.  Fanuc go to edit mode, program soft key, change device, fget, fset, exec etc.......

 

Renishaw probing on HAAS is implemented much better also.  Not having the ability to probe all tools is a pain.  If you do want to probe multiple you can either specify the first and last tool, or type every tool number in a sequence.  No way to probe multiple offset/face mill tools. 

 

Overall it is a great machine and the support for it at this point is awesome.  

 

 

 

 

Message 11 of 23


@Lonnie.Cady wrote:

@Laurens-3DTechDraw wrote:

Actually okuma is very famous here for doing just that.  One shop here just had tape readers put on an old machine.  Okuma builds the drives and everything from what I understand and have one of the best support for machines out there.  They offered a lifetime guarantee on the control.

 

As for the Doosan, I like it.  I still stand by the opinion that fanuc are one of the least friendly controls out there.  It is not like it is unusable but the number of keystrokes just to load a program is not right.   On haas it was list program, F2 to copy, select memory and you are ready to run.  Fanuc go to edit mode, program soft key, change device, fget, fset, exec etc.......

 

Renishaw probing on HAAS is implemented much better also.  Not having the ability to probe all tools is a pain.  If you do want to probe multiple you can either specify the first and last tool, or type every tool number in a sequence.  No way to probe multiple offset/face mill tools. 

 

Overall it is a great machine and the support for it at this point is awesome.  

 

 

 

 


Well from what I hear here is that Okuma controls older than 12 years, you'll pay the world to get the parts or they don't have them anymore.(Charging over 300% for what a part used to cost is like saying you don't have it anymore, and then it will have to be made which took some guy months before he was back up and running)

 

About the running of a program, we have a machine with a data server and that means send it there, two buttons and you are running the program.

How are you running your program? From a Compact flash or PCMCIA Card?

(Also usually this is easier in manual guide, but doing DNC of a Compact flash card can be a little more tricky indeed depending on the version of the control. And once you have done this and change the program but not the file name you don't have to do it again.)

 

I bet the probing isn't what you would like on the fanuc, it's much better on the Heidenhain and Siemens controls, which I've actually seen/used.

 

Laurens Wijnschenk
3DTechDraw

AutoDesk CAM user & Post editor.
René for Legend.


Message 12 of 23

Biggest issue for me with Fanuc was lack of memory without data server, and lack of memory with data server lol... We're talking 1985 here.  The price to add a data server was many thousands of dollars, and you don't really get all that much more..   And base model at 512kb...really?  Half a floppy.  

 

Granted, yeah I know they work.  I had 2x Kitamura Mycenters with 16i-M controls.  Not user friendly, but worked.   Loading programs was a HUGE pet peeve I had.  Pretty much anything that had to do with file manipulation irritated me to no end.   There were a lot of things about the user interface that I just couldn't bring myself to buy again on a brand new machine.

 

As for support into the future - yeah that could be a problem, I'll deal with it as it comes.  

 

I looked very closely at the Doosan and almost went with it because I knew I could jump into it and run w/o need for training etc.  I also looked at Haas.  I don't have anything bad to say about them, but I think their pricing is too high for what you're getting...  They were only a few grand off from a Doosan and were actually higher priced than a Hardinge similarly equipped.  I was looking at a VF4SS so it did have more X travel, but still...

 

Hopefully I made the right choice.  

Message 13 of 23

@irobotix

Don't think a Okuma is ever a bad choice. Especially when you look at the price point of the Genos machines.

Laurens Wijnschenk
3DTechDraw

AutoDesk CAM user & Post editor.
René for Legend.


Message 14 of 23
Steinwerks
in reply to: irobotix

I have heard nothing but stellar opinions of the M560V from those who have bought them. The same cannot be said of Haas unfortunately, and Doosan, Samsung and others are coming for them and fast.

Neal Stein



New to Fusion 360 CAM? Click here for an introduction to 2D Milling, here for 2D Turning.

Find me on:
Instagram and YouTube
Message 15 of 23
irobotix
in reply to: Steinwerks

I've been running the M560V for a few weeks now.  So far I am very impressed with the machine.  There are a lot of qualities about the machine I really like as far as the control, the ergonomics, ease of tool access etc.  The Easy Touch probing is worlds beyond what I am used to and honestly I have no idea how I lived without it.  Worth every penny.  Only bitch I have about the machine - the chip buildup... It doesn't have a washdown, and the flood coolant doesn't really wash the chips into the augers....so they build up and build up..  Steel chips arent too bad just blow them down into the augers...but aluminum chips turn into confetti and blow everywhere.  I need to hook up a hose to an aux pump for a washdown for sure.  Chips like to get into all of the crevices of the doors which end up blowing all over the floor outside the machine, and the back corners are a PITA....

 

Lastly - you have to be extremely careful not to leave a vise handle in the machine because the table is so low in relation to the Y-axis way cover.  I made that mistake once and dented the cover.  I think I can get by without replacing it but **** that's an expensive part to wreck.  While its convenient to bring the y-axis all the way forward for a part change, you can smash things if you forget a vise handle... aside from possible damage issues, the vise is hard to clamp because you can't get a good swing on the handle since it will interfere with the way cover...


Those are very minor complaints however....only thing I have found so far that I didn't like.

 

I did also add a 1000psi chip blaster, and I believer I'll be adding a 4th axis in a few months.  Having this new machine has inspired me to actually want to make more things...

Message 16 of 23
greg
in reply to: irobotix

FYI, there is a thread on Practical Machinist (I can't search it well right now, the site is having issues) where an M560 owner went through the details of adding a coolant wash down hose. Might be worth a read.

 

Apparently, Okuma wants "thousands" to add in-enclosure wash down + an external hose. I guess every MTB has their little quirks where they just biff on the offerings, and this would be one of them. 

Message 17 of 23


@Laurens-3DTechDraw wrote:
We are talking the Genos right?
That is the "cheap" line they have at okuma. So don't expect the machine to be the insane okuma quality. It's more just above the doosan and mori machines. Probably still we would take a look at those since the price is really competitive. But I don't think I would ever buy a "small" 3-axis mill anymore. Or bed-type milling machine if you need a big one, or a 5-axis machining center.

From my understanding the cheaper line is production built (Not al a carte) as opposed to factory ordering options.

Keith Clausen
Gcode In Motion

SolidWorks 2021
HSMWorks 2022
Fusion360 - Manufacturing Extensions
Message 18 of 23
keith.clausen
in reply to: Lonnie.Cady


@Lonnie.Cady wrote:

Anyone have any opinions on an M560V Okuma they would be interested in sharing?

 

 

 

 


I would not hesitate in recommending. The shop I used to work is an Okuma tool-room and has pretty much every generation from the MC-VE up. They are a pretty demanding bunch of guys and I am still good friends with the guy that runs the M560V and he loves it. From what I hear they are looking at adding another. If you have never used an Okuma (OPS) control you may find it a bit of an adjustment but the machine is powerful and capable Japanese rig. I would have bought and Okuma 5th when I bought the UMC750 if it weren't for the cost.

 

I don't think you will have any buyers remorse with this machine.

Keith Clausen
Gcode In Motion

SolidWorks 2021
HSMWorks 2022
Fusion360 - Manufacturing Extensions
Message 19 of 23
irobotix
in reply to: keith.clausen

I'd say in no way is this machine "cheap" as far as construction.  It's extremely heavy, rigid, has great thermal comp, is very nice piece.

 

I'm not sure what their MV-56 costs but I believe it's modeled after that, with some less expensive options.

 

I bought mine at the end of the reseller and Okuma fiscal year.  With the probing system (tool and work), Chipblaster, and chip conveyor I am slightly over $110k not including any freight or rigging...  I think it's an incredible machine for that money...  

I think the Doosan 5700 is also an excellent choice but I went with the Okuma for the control.  The Okuma was slightly more expensive but only slightly.  Haas machines were coming out a few grand less than the Doosan which in my mind are $40k too expensive.  If a Haas VF4 was 55-60k I'd buy one.  But not for almost 90k, w/o thru spindle coolant.

Message 20 of 23
craig
in reply to: Lonnie.Cady

We just got an m560 v absolutely love it, it's a tank and the control is incredible. We bought it with full probing and I don't have a single negative thing to say about it.

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