Engineering Design Review Process

[Anonymous]

Hi Everyone,

Can someone give me some input on how your engineering process works through the design portion of the project?

We are transitioning from AutoCAD to Inventor and have proven processes in place for our engineering. The problem is, that process is based on older methodology (i.e. Drafting, then 2D CAD, etc.). Now that we are moving (finally) into the future, I believe that some or all or these processes need to looked at in regards to design concept to release to manufacturing.

The biggest area of concern for me is the way design reviews and customer approvals are handled. In the past we would create a drawing in AutoCAD and when that drawing was complete enough to be passed on to our customer for their approval, we can simply email that drawing. Currently, we are creating our 3D models, and then when we are to the point of approval, we then create a .idw of the machine, export that to AutoCAD 2D, then email to the customer.

That seems very backwards in my opinion. I have spoken to a friend in the same industry, and he told me their engineering dept does not create a single drawing until the job is completely finished and ready for manufacturing. ALL internal and external reviews are done virtually using the 3D models.

Any opinions or examples you can share would be appreciated.

Thank You!

Ron

[mcgyvr]

All depends on the expectations/needs of your customer.. plain and simple..

My customer review process is simply done with screenshots of the model..

No 2d or 3d data is passed to the customer at all..

There are also DWF files (or one day in the near future we might have 3d PDF files which will put dwf in its grave finally)

Autocad (dwg files) are still #1 in the 2d world.. Everyone can open them/view them easily..

And IMO 3d models pass too much information. The customer can give that 3d model right to China and out the door you go (for the most part)..

[dgorsman]

There is a third-party plugin for creating 3D PDF, but I suspect you are referring to native capability.  There's also Navisworks, which can be useful for viewing larger projects (e.g. compressor or pump skid packages) in context with other models along with in-context markup capabilities.  It also depends on what kind of approval is required - do they need to check specific dimensions, or is it just a "looks right" type of check?

Screen shots of 3D content in a shaded or rendered appearance are a good compromise for clients who are reluctant to adopt 3D review technology.  Some places are reluctant to work with anything other than the default PDF viewer, although installing and maintaining Navisworks Freedom is not a chore (there's even a deployment creator).  Others are completely wedded to the 2D review concept, they want something they can print and physically red-line.

[IgorMir]

Hi Ron,

In addition of what other posters said here I would like to add that no mater how hard one is trying to create a perfect drawing on a screen - once it is printed and reviewed - there is almost always something needed to be changed/edited. So hard copies of the design will stay for a while, I think.

Cheers,

Igor.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the replies. We also are not very fond of these DWF's. Would love to have 3D pdf. Hopefully that does come soon.

We had a recent meeting with a customer using WebX and were able to display the model for them and it worked out pretty well. They were more or less giving us approval based solely on what they saw, but I think we will always need something of a "signed" document, which is really the main reason for creation of a 2D drawing. Does anyone know of any digital signature type features that are available in Inventor? Or would that be more of an available feature with the 3D PDF when it arrives?

Also to what Mcgyvr pointed out, we do not want to give them the actual 3D data because of exactly what he said. We have a lot of proprietary designs that we would not give to anyone.

Thanks.

[mcgyvr]

I'd be looking at using the "signature" type functionality in PDF files..

You can print the drawing to PDF and let them "sign" it for approval.. 

Make sure you look at what options are in Adobe reader vs full adobe acrobat as more than likely they will just have reader which doesn't have all the functions of the full blown program.

[dgorsman]

Some of that can come down to proper record keeping of the design review meetings, whether in person or online.  There should be a list of what will be reviewed, notes taken about what was asked, answered, and decided upon for each item.  The notes get summarized, either in text format or using various mark-up tools, and then distributed to those who attended plus put into the project record.

[jyager]

Dependning on what the project is we could have several levels of confusion.

Typically if it's something "we" deem proprietary:

1. Create the model

2. Create a "submittal drawing" which is a bare bones .idw featuring a couple of views and sections, BOM, weights etc. This requires engineering and QA INK signatures so we transmit a scanned PDF at that point.

3. Create a "fabrication drawing" which is set of controlled drawings/details/welds based on the approved current "submittal" revision, the shop will use this to fabricate.

This drives me nuts because it's two separate sets of .idw files to update depending on the timing of last minute imagineering by A&E's and in house utility people. However...it's infinitely easier now with one model updating both drawings than dealing with separate 2D drawings with different level of details.

If it's something I can sell as not being proprietary, we'll submit only the "fabrication" level drawing set or a high level assembly "fabrication" drawing.

Either way the customer is getting a PDF file with a couple of Isometric views on it which they're usually wowed by. I'd love to be able to have them approve based on the models...but most utilities can barely function in 2D.

[NigelHay]

We have similar issues to the ones noted in earlier replies. We mostly send 2D drawings of outline & interchange dimensions which work OK but sometimes a customer wants a 3D model to load into their own model in order to check fit & function. We don't want to give away too much detail so I would usually create a derived part of the full assembly & strip out all of the internal detail leaving just the external 'shell' & whatever parts the customer needs in order to sufficiently check compatability.

3D PDFs are available, we've tried pdf3d.co.uk & that works with Inventor but costs about £500/install. We currently use the free iTools from Envisage UK Ltd. which is a bit clunky & outputs in greyscale but does generate a useable 3D PDF.

Our products are quite small & expensive so we are also considering sending 3D printed models to customers.

[swalton]

If you do your Client Design Reviews over Webex or Gotomeeting, you can record them as part of the project file too.  That also makes transcribing the minutes easier.